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KTM Duke 125 vs. CBR 125

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guile
Spanner Monkey



Joined: 20 Mar 2012
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PostPosted: 13:58 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: KTM Duke 125 vs. CBR 125 Reply with quote

As my first bike, I am deciding between the CBR 125 and the KTM Duke 125. What are your opinions on these?

https://s18.postimage.org/f6bqu3met/media.jpg

https://s16.postimage.org/m341dlag1/2011_Honda_CBR_125_R_black.jpg

It is for commuting (not motorway riding) so I don't really care that one has 10mph at the top end over the other.

I think the KTM looks a bit better but I don't like its engine sound. It is also £700 more than the Honda. I can take a test ride on the Honda but KTM don't offer test rides.

Anyone think the orange KTM is a bit chavvy? Also I guess the Duke would be much more attractive to thieves.
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UnspeedySam
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PostPosted: 14:22 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would have the KTM given the choice, because it doesn't pretend to be something it is not.

The CBR is a commuter bike with some extra plastic; fairing is completely pointless on a 125 and will just get broken when you inevitably drop it.

I think they are both very expensive bikes for what they are and if you have the money for one of these bikes, you can afford to buy a used YBR125 or a CBF125 to practice for your test. Then do your test and get a good all round commuter bike like a Honda CBF500/CBF600 or any bike on the market!
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 14:40 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Being brutally honest; I dont think much of either.
If you are old enough to have a licence; you are old enough to have a FULL Licence. 125's are for Learners or seriously economy minded commuters.
Therefore; a 125 is either a Learner-Bike, in which case, being easy to ride; cheap to run, not too excpensive to fix when you fall off it; and easy to sell on when you are done; are the 'most' important facets of the machine; or a 'commuter' in chich case the only facet of worth is 'Cheap'.
An 'expensive' 125, that is neither the cheap, utiliterian commuter, nor the easy to ride, numbers-make sense 'training & test' tool; is an expensive irrelevence, and money put in to having such a bike, based on what it looks like, rather an expensive extravigance.
Wont look that great to any-one that knows what they are looking at any-way; especially with an L-Plate attached.

£700 difference in price? Fuck That, save £1500 on EITHER and buy a YBR and put teh difference in to passing tests while you still can, on a 125 and get a licence worth having for the effort.

Better still, buy a 2nd hand YBR for around £1500, save even MORE money; and get your licence with that, for less than the depreciation on a brand new bike; and piut your dosh in to a REAL sports bike, or a full-size motard/trailie when you have the licence to ride it.

But hey; end of they day it's your money; and if you have it to burnb, and looks are THAT important to you, buy the one you think looks pretiest.

Practically neither is good value for money; or a great way to getting a full licence; just DONT come moaning in a years time, that tryiong to make the repayements, fund the insurance, and fix teh damage the first fall has caused you haven't been able to afford or get round to doing the mere £121.50's worth of tests that could, right now get you that FULL-LICENCE, and in a years time, you are stuck on a triddler almost 'for-ever' becouse 3rd directive licence laws due to come into force Jan 19th 2013 say you have to test on a 125, pass and wait 2 years to test again on a 500, pass, and wait to years, test again on a 600, to get the full licence YOU could have in, oh..... two-three months time? Getting a 'sensible' learner bike, and making your self into a 'real' biker, rather than worrying about merely looking like one....
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guile
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PostPosted: 14:53 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I appreciate the knowledgable replies but let me ask - why is there so much bike snobbery against 125s? I am commuting on 30mph roads - why would I need to upgrade to a 500 which is more fuel hungry and costs more to insure?

The CBR is £2700 new which I didn't think was that bad but what do I know? I would also be keeping it for at least two years (until the 33bhp restriction is up).
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UnspeedySam
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PostPosted: 14:57 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

guile wrote:
I appreciate the knowledgable replies but let me ask - why is there so much bike snobbery against 125s? I am commuting on 30mph roads - why would I need to upgrade to a 500 which is more fuel hungry and costs more to insure?

The CBR is £2700 new which I didn't think was that bad but what do I know? I would also be keeping it for at least two years (until the 33bhp restriction is up).

It's not so much snobbery against 125s, as not really seeing the point of spending £2700 on a new sports-looking bike that does 65.

You will be happier in a year or so with a licence (albeit restricted) and something with a bit more punch. If you are worried about costs, get a little CB250 or something. I can almost guarantee it will be a hell of a lot less to insure, it'll be faster, more fun and will cost under £1000.

edit: Hell...my Bros 400 does 60mpg when thrashed and is under 33bhp. You can get a really nice one for £800...Link
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_Troy_
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PostPosted: 14:58 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think there is much snobbery towards 125's, especially from Tef because he still rides them (don't you?).

I think those bikes are great for what they are, but that is mostly posing to be honest. You're better off with a commuter style bike that will be cheaper, easier to ride, and easier to sell on.

I will advise you to do your tests though. You don't have to get a big bike, but getting some real training and getting rid of the L's is a good idea.

125's are great in town, like you say, but a 500 commuter will be better. It will hold the road better, be easier to handle, powerful for when you need/innevitably want it, oh and much cheaper than a tarted up 125.

Back on topic - the Duke's look awesome for a 125, but it's looks will be seriously ruined by L's. But the CBR is a tried and tested machine, and many praise them.
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guile
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PostPosted: 15:00 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

CBR 125 = £2699
CBR 250 = £3999


£1300 more for a 250 and my CBT instructor told me the 250 is pretty much the same as a 125.
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UnspeedySam
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PostPosted: 15:04 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

guile wrote:
CBR 125 = £2699
CBR 250 = £3999


£1300 more for a 250 and my CBT instructor told me the 250 is pretty much the same as a 125.

I said CB250:
https://www.bikez.com/pictures/honda/1982/19381_0_1_2_cb%20250%20rs_Image%20credits%20-%20Haynes.jpg

It was the first efficient yet fairly fun bike that popped into my head and is probably a bit old for you.

If you like sporty bikes the a restricted SV650 is probably a better bet, but that is getting into proper big bike territory so doesn't really fit the 'strictly city only' bill.
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 16:22 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

guile wrote:
I appreciate the knowledgable replies but let me ask - why is there so much bike snobbery against 125s? I am commuting on 30mph roads - why would I need to upgrade to a 500 which is more fuel hungry and costs more to insure?

The CBR is £2700 new which I didn't think was that bad but what do I know? I would also be keeping it for at least two years (until the 33bhp restriction is up).


As troy says; its not 'snobbery' certainly from me, and yes, a full licence hoilder of twenty odd years, I still ride tiddlers and enjoy them for what they are. BUT that remains great super-ecconomy bus fare beaters; or training & test tools.

Spending a lot of money on a 'fancy' 125 here and now, may seem like a great idea; but if you use it as its intended to get tests done, believe me, you will almost certainly regret it.

Either the bike will not encourage you to get your licence, and you'll be stuck with it; or having got your licence, you'll be facing the hefty depreciation selling on early, and 'stuck' with it.

Either way, it WILL be frustrating.

Idea of buying a 'snazzy' 125 to keep after tests? Well, yeah... as said, I ride tiddlers. I enjoy them for what they are, and like the fact they are demanding to ride and dont need to be taken TOO seriousely.... and I have a 750 if I get frustrated.

And its an affordable 'toy' for me; I'm looking at sub £100 a year insurance; & £50 a year for tax and test.

That wouldn't even pay for a pair of tyres for my 750, so why not; saves squaring expensive rubber to pop to teh shops!

But I have choices.... I have not committed to an expensive bike I can ONLY loose lots of money on; and I dont have to worry about getting a licence with it, I already have one; nor am I frustrated by the practicalities that IF I want something different, I have to 'Deal' with the tiddler to get it..... in my case its already sat there, waiting for me to pick up the keys.

Its about making situations work for you. End of the day its your call; but be aware of what you are getting into; and while it makes SOME sense, you are looking a LONG way down the line.

6-12 months to get a CBT, bike, licence, ride out the insurance policy; and two years of 33bhp restriction. And saying here and NOW you THINK you'll be happy with something that has just 15bhp......

I can tell you straight off, both those bikes are expensive to insure. 125's as a class get loaded by learner claims; even if you have a full licence they are expensive to insure. And those TWO are in the higher risk brackets becouse they are fancy ones, more likely to be nicked or crashed.

If I was to tell you that a Suzuki GS500 is in the same insurance bracket as an Aprillia RS.... which is probably only a group higher than either of those two.... and with a full licence and a years NCB is as like as not going to be barely any more expensive to insure, (& infact, 2nd hand, half the value, probably a lot cheaper!) restricted to 33bhp, which they can be, easily and cheaply, and that that bike, a full 500, would be damn near as good on petrol trundling about town, and possibly actually BETTER heading out of it, where its working more in its optimal efficiency range, where a tiddler would be having teh knackers thrashed up on it to hold teh same road speed.... AND the maintenence and running costs are likely to be bog all different.....

WHICH would you preffer to ride out your 33bhp restriction on?

End of teh day, its not 'snobbery'. its ecconomics; and recognising that here and now you are a learner, and have a lot of learning to do.

Chucking yourself in the deep end, here and now, planning THAT far ahead, and committing yourself to such a lot of money, on a long term plan that migh NOT necesserily be the 'best' way to go, and which denies you flexibility to adapt or change the plan, as you progress, is likely to give you frustration, and hassle, and unnecessary cost.

What I suggest is to keep your options open; do only what you NEED to do here and now; dont commit money you dont have to; or put EVERYTHING into something based, as yet, merely on ideas pre-conceptions and hear-say.

BIG thing at the mionute is getting a Full A-Group licence while you still can on a 125.... ANY 125 that will do that job, is a good'n, in my book.

THAT done, licence in your pocket, door is open to ALL options.... of which a 'fancy' 125 is but one..... Heck its a FULL licence, not a BIG bike licence, & I have a Honda CB125 Super-Dream and an old air-cooled Yamaha DT125 to ride on my FULL licence... no-one says you HAVE to have a big bike as soon as you have passed your test.

BUT its just one option you have after getting youe licence; get that on a 2nd hand YBR, least risk, least cost, you coudl sell that on for very little lost money, and STILL buy a CBT or KTM if thats what you really wanted, to.... BUT, you could as easily and as cheaply have any number of other bikes, that would probably offer a lot more bang-for-your-buck.

Its not snobbery; its common sense; and not planning SO far ahead you cant deviate from the plan, EVEN if your ideas, aspirations or circumstances change.

YBR; £1500. £500 for some training & tests, and you can flog YBR for maybe £1250, and be down just £500, on doing it on a brand new CBR or KTM, that would cost you half its show room price in depreciation in teh first two years. a third in the first year.

You could than have a Hyosung GT250 instead of a CBR, or a Honda CRF250 if you so wished and probably STILL be in pocket from it...

ALL for not looking SO far up the road, and JUST dealing with THIS bit of road here and now.
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Tomzo47
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PostPosted: 17:13 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

my mates had a KTM Duke 125 for 8 months... been to the dealer 3 times for different problems, first was fluid leaking for no reason, then the whole thing died for no reason, went back to the dealer, they did something regarding the tank (not sure what :S) and it died again last week. My YBR 125 can keep up with it easily, even out corner it sometimes, and the only problem I've ever had is the clutch needs adjusting every few hundred miles. Much more reliable, much more MPG, so much comfier, half the price and when you get round to your Mod 1, slow maneuvers are so much easier. If I were you I'd get a YBR, pass your tests, THEN you can have a big bike, not a big bike wannnabe.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 17:56 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

guile wrote:
CBR 125 = £2699


Where's that from then? From Honda UK:

CBR125R = £3400.

CBF125 = £2500

If you can get a brand new CBR125R for £200 more than a CBF125 then that's a reasonable deal, as it'll hold its value better.

[UPDATE] Unless you mean used, in which case you'd be as well actually saying so.
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Paris2
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PostPosted: 17:59 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL:DR

Get a cheaper 125

Do your tests with the money left over

Then buy the bike these are trying to look like



They will be cheaper to insure once you have a license and be easier to ride.
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Oldie
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got a Duke 125 and it's a cracking bike. The handling is superb and you can definitely keep up with the traffic - no problem Very Happy I bought it to take with me on my trailer when we do the family holiday thing. I had some recall work done last week (ECU and Caliper I think) but the bike is faultless so far. I don't use it that much and will probably be flogging it soon.
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 18:45 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oldie wrote:
I had some recall work done last week (ECU and Caliper I think)

Err that, doesn't ACTUALLY support, this...
Oldie wrote:
but the bike is faultless so far.

Really, does it?
If it was faultless, why the fuck was it recalled Shocked
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beaslethorpe
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PostPosted: 18:50 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

All this price warring aside, does anyone care to give a review of a CBR125R? As I'm just about to get one (used - and for a grand) as my first bike to get used to riding on before going for test at some point.

Not bothered that I could get a cheaper CB125 or what have you - looks are part of what I'm after, and I like the look of the CBR125 so it passes that test straight away. Obviously they're good on fuel economy and decent with most other stats. But what are they like to ride - with a 3-day CBT gained rider perspective in mind ideally...?

Ta
RB
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the_quick
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PostPosted: 18:52 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Few weeks back I booked my cbt and started planing what 125 to get. All I wanted was cruiser because of the look.

And all I read everyone said the same, 125 is to small for cruisers , difficult to drive, does not have power to pull it and manoeuvres are more difficult at slow speeds. I just want it for looks. But after some time and doing CBT I realized that even lighter bikes will not be that quick and I will jump on bigger soon enough. So I've bought Yamaha ybr125 and ride on that, till I think I'm ready to start training on something bigger.
125s imo are mostly training bikes. And CBR125 is just that but with bit of looks.
Test ride one of them and see for your self
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Oldie
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PostPosted: 18:59 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teflon-Mike wrote:
Oldie wrote:
I had some recall work done last week (ECU and Caliper I think)

Err that, doesn't ACTUALLY support, this...
Oldie wrote:
but the bike is faultless so far.

Really, does it?
If it was faultless, why the fuck was it recalled Shocked


Oh well, here's the full story.

I phone dealer in Perth to arrange for the ECU restriction to be removed.

He says "No probs, when it's in we'll attend to some recall work"

I say "fine"

I have had no issues with the bike, no faults. Now calm down Cool
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Ayrton
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PostPosted: 19:04 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Prepare to be told by everyone to do your full license test Laughing
Seriously though, you should buy a easily controllable bike like a CG and get your tests done before they change.

As for the OP, i have a cbr125 and its brilliant. Its easy to maintain and i have found no faults with it at all. But dont for god sake pay that money for it. I have a 2005 cbr and it only cost me £970 and it looks like new and performs just as well as a new one (and has better looks Thumbs Up ).

Dont expect it to outrun every 125 out there though. My brothers ybr will keep up with it just fine. Its not a sports bike, its a learner bike that looks like one.

I would still recommend a CG125 instead Laughing
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bLiXeY
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PostPosted: 19:15 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its not 125 snobbery, its people who have prior experience not wanting you to make mistakes that they, or people they know, have made, which is to spend a lot of money on a bike that you may not be keeping for very long.

If you're keeping it for ages, great, but even then, I would imagine people on here have heard that said before...then read a thread by the same person 3 months later stating their 125 just isn't quick enough.
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 19:57 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oldie wrote:
Teflon-Mike wrote:
If it was faultless, why the fuck was it recalled Shocked
"No probs, when it's in we'll attend to some recall work"
I have had no issues with the bike, no faults. Now calm down Cool


So YOUR bike, that you admit you haven't used much hasn't shown any 'problems'....

I'm perfectly calm, and you obviously have received 'customer satisfaction' from the product; but still remains:

You cant in one breath say a bike is 'Faultless' then admit that it has faults so severe as to be subject to a factory recall in the next, and not expect that 'irony' to go unremarked upon!

Bike is NOT faultless, or dealers wouldn't have anything to fix under recall. You have merely not been inconvenienced by it's faults!
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beaslethorpe
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PostPosted: 20:01 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ayrton wrote:
Its not a sports bike, its a learner bike that looks like one.


To be perfectly honest, I've no intention of lying - that's exactly what I'm after. I'm under no illusions that I'll not want something bigger and better in a few months - I'm DEFINITELY the kind of person who will. Which is why I'm not willing to pay more than a grand for a bike. But I do insist I have something that looks sporty. Had considered naked bikes like a CG125 but I can hardly stand to look at pictures, so I just know in my heart I'd never love it.

You also answered some of my important factors - easy to maintain and found no faults (perfectly, it's a 2005 CBR 125 I'm looking at. Obviously they're not the exact same bike and the one I get could have unlimited faults and be hideous to maintain, but its good to hear that overall, they at least have the potential to be great)
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 20:13 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaslethorpe wrote:
All this price warring aside, does anyone care to give a review of a CBR125R? As I'm just about to get one (used - and for a grand) as my first bike to get used to riding on before going for test at some point.

Not bothered that I could get a cheaper CB125 or what have you - looks are part of what I'm after, and I like the look of the CBR125 so it passes that test straight away. Obviously they're good on fuel economy and decent with most other stats. But what are they like to ride - with a 3-day CBT gained rider perspective in mind ideally...?

Ta
RB


Three days after CBT anything that moves under its own power will be 'awesome'.

CBR, as said is a learner-commuter in a Toys-R-Us 'Dress-Up' outfit to look a 'bit' like a CBR-sports-bike....

As learner commuters go; its much of a much. It has a couple of extra bhp over a CG or a YBR, but its also got a more complicated multi-valve water-cooled engine, thats rather less newbie freindly come spannering, or expensive if you have to pay any-one for engine work. & Second hand likely to have been more 'thrashed' by any-one expecting something rather more spirited than it is!

Min question with the CBR is whether it 'fits' you. They have a rather small frame, and the sports styling dictates certain compromises like the sculpted seat and low clip-on bars. Erganomically they are an oddity; being small they ought to suit smaller people better, and larger ones less so; but the reality is they are something of a lottery as to whether you 'fit' one.

Other wise; they don't make a 'bad' newbie bike; but they ARE compromised for style.

As for the CB125? It is what I ride; I DO NOT reccomend it as a universal learner bike. They haven't made any in Japan for over 20 years for a start off; so they are old and cantakerouse. Great bike, and the opposite of the CBR, which is a modern Learner-Commuter in a track-suit. CB125T was actually designed as a sports-bike, in the days honda wished to prove they could build 4-strokes that rivalled the competitions two-strokes on performance. With the CB125T they did it. In full power guise it was as powerful as the Yamaha RD125 twin or Suzuki GT125 twin. The later Super-Dream, with mono-shock suspension & twin piston brakes amongst other features was actually more sophisticated and again as powerful as rival Yamaha RD125LC & Kawasaki AR125LC until the de-restricted ones got power-valves. But conservatively styled, its a thoroughbred, no compromise 'sports' 125 that just looks like a modern commuter. Actual riding experience is what you would HOPE for, but dont get with the CBR; its engaging, and brisk, with bit of charecter, especially when the twin pot motor hits 6K revs and starts to howl. BUT, old age and years of neglect or abuse; most are rather tired, and while they can be a long term every day 'classic' they dont present themselves as a particularly great, trouble free, boring as buggery training & test tool.

For that, its the more modern, though older technology, push-rod single cylinder engine CG125 that remains the favourite small honda.

Back to the CBR, forwarned of the risk a bike will be more thrashed; and more expensive to fix if it goes wrong, try before you buy, see if its 'comfy'.
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Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'
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Shinigami
World Chat Champion



Joined: 14 Feb 2012
Karma :

PostPosted: 20:15 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

used to like the look of the duke in pictures..

saw one in person couple of months ago and thought it was FUGLY
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CoolBreeze
L Plate Warrior



Joined: 22 Feb 2012
Karma :

PostPosted: 20:18 - 20 Mar 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaslethorpe wrote:
with a 3-day CBT gained rider perspective in mind ideally...?

Ta
RB


Wait... what?!

A 3 day CBT? It is supposed to only take a day. Was it set to be 3 days from the start or did you not get it and have to come back to finish.. twice?

I'm not going to offer an opinion on what bike you should get, because ultimately you'll do what you want most probably and that's fine.

What I will say is that, the biggest thing that resonated with me reading this forum is that people have constantly and with great regularity said 'Nothing looks cool with L plates'. This was a revelation for me, because I'd never thought about it like that before. And they are 100% right, now... every time I see one of these souped up 125's I shake my head and think how utterly pointless it is having a such a nice looking bike with those hideous L plates on it.
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 12 years, 11 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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