(Possibly) Dumb Question: Why are 250cc bikes going away?

[esullivan]

I've seen a few people mention this recently, but without enough details for me to make sense of it. Apparently some regulation is coming in that will make 250cc (or similar) obsolete or much less desirable. Can someone enlighten me? Having failed to pass my tests after an expensive DAS course and now riding a 125, I was thinking of just doing the restricted route. (I'm 48, so I'm not really affected by the new regs, I think.)

My guess would be with the new multiple levels next year, there would be *more* choices in the sub 33bhp market soon, won't there? What am I missing? I don't particularly like the look of the Ninja 250 (I'm not a sports bike guy), but I was hoping to see others of that class soon.

[J.M.]

[snikks]

Currently we have:
"A1" License, available at 17, allows you to ride bikes under 125cc and 14.5bhp. Achievable by taking the normal motorcycle test on a bike between 75 and 125cc and under 14.5bhp. Pointless as if you're going to take the test, you may as well take an "A2" test, to get your restricted A license.
(A2) "A" License (with 2 year 33bhp restriction, no further training or testing required to remove restriction), available at 17, allows you to ride any bike but the power output must be no more than 25kW(33bhp) or 0.16kW/kg. Achievable by taking the normal motorcycle test on 120-125cc bike capable of 100km/h.
(DAS) "A" License (No restriction) available at 21, same as above but allows you to skip the 2 year restriction by taking your test on a bike over 35kW.

You can also retake the A test if you are within your restriction but over 21, on a bike of over 35kw, in order to skip the rest of your restriction. That's "Accelerated access".

Since 33bhp is broadly the kind of power output one would expect of a 250 - 300cc machine, sales of 250cc bikes have in all likelihood been improved in the UK by the presence of people limited to no more power than a 250 will (roughly) provide. Even with that limit though, it's still possible to ride a larger bike but with a restricted power output.

Come January next year the licensing laws are changing so we will have:
"A1" License, available at 17, same conditions as above.
"A2" License, available at 19, unsure off the top of my head what bike you have to test on, but the power limit on this license is 35kW (or 46bhp roughly) or 0.2kW/kg. Additionally the original bike must have been less than 70kW (or 92bhp roughly).
"A" License, available at 24 OR 21 if you've completed two years on an "A2" license, allows you to ride any bike.

Since 46bhp is roughly the kind of power you could expected on a 400cc, or a restricted 500cc or 600cc, 250cc's lose their "boost" through restricted riders needing that power-level, and thus will only be any good to riders who specifically want a low-powered light bike.

I think that's all correct, but if I've made any errors I'm sure someone will be along shortly to let me know
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- CBT: 02/01/11 Theory: 26/04/11 Mod 1: 19/05/11 Mod 2: 19/08/11
- 2007 Honda XL125V Varadero (Sold), 1999 Yamaha FZS600 Fazer (Sold), 2001 CBR600F

[Rogerborg]

[UPDATE]
Ah, snikks got in there first.

I'll leave my spooge here anyway though, as I think the change in test vehicle (125 to 395) for the intermediate license category will be significant.

Hiii-yo!

Current license categories are:

Provisional, and A1: 11kw, 125cc
A <= 25kW: As it says, which suits ~250cc bikes. It upgrades after 2 years, so there's only about 11,000 people with this category at any given time. Significantly, this category is obtained by sitting your tests on a 125cc bike, and can be had at 17.
A : full power

As of next year, the new categories will be:

Provisional and A1: 11kW, 125cc as now.
A2: 35kW, significantly more than the 25kW category now. Also, to obtain this category, you'll have to pass your test(s) on a 395cc+ bike - in practice, likely a 500cc or even 600 or 650 - and not before you're 19.
A: full power, as now.

So with the new A2 license, you'd have to take a big step down from the bikes that you've trained and tested on in order to ride a 250. It'd also be well under the maximum power that you're allowed. 35kW is (pretty exactly) a GS500 or a very slightly restricted (or just tired) CB500 / ER-5 / GPZ500.

Note also that we're going to "lose" 2 years of bikers. Right now, the moment you turn 17 you can get yourself a 25kW license and buy a restricted big bike. As of next year, everyone in the 17-18 bracket loses that option and will be stuck on 125s until they hit 19. That'll result in a sudden sharp lowering of demand for restricted power machines, rather than driving it.

It's possible that we might see a resurgence in ~400cc Japanese imports in the 25-35kW range, but 250 will be too small, both for test purposes, and for the purposes of wringing the maximum out of the new A2 license category.

Note that the G650GS and NC700S/X are bang on the 35kW mark, and manufacturers can just restrict any of their bikes down to 35kW just as they do now for 25kW licensees.

So I believe that 250s are dead bikes riding. Personally I think they're ace - my GPz 305 would be an ideal commuter if it weren't a ticking time bomb - but that's somewhat of a fringe opinion. Why Suzuki are planning to introduce a brand new 250 at the end of this year is quite beyond me, but it's possible that they really are just being daft - note their current fire sale price and plummeting sales figures.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[esullivan]

Thanks! That makes sense now. I didn't realize the restricted limit would rise.

I did my DAS on a BMW G650 GS and really, really liked it. Perfect size, perfect amount of power for a newbie. So I have personal experience of the new restricted level and it seems quite sensible to me. Not too scary, but yet plenty of power for sane speeds on the motorway.

Unfortunately, this doesn't really help me to decide what to do. I'm back to leaning toward redoing DAS... In the meantime, I'm slowly gaining confidence on the 125, so it's not a waste at all.

[AlanC]

[Rogerborg]