18000 miles in a year on a Chinese 125

[symonh2000]

It would be interesting to get an update.
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Four strokes is two strokes too many.

[Hobgoblin]

[SamWise72]

Somebody drew my attention to the fact this hasn't been updated. Long story short, the darker and rainier it got, the less I was able to cope with the 2.5 hour ride. There's a long, dark, narrow section of road on the way home where on a rainy night, I could literally see nothing but the oncoming lights, and all I could do was go slow and steer to the left of them. I was getting home massively stressed, so I decided to knock it on the head and commute by car til I could afford to do a direct access test. That should be fairly soon!

In the meantime, the bike continues to be very reliable, and with a coat of ACF50 has neither dissolved into a pile, nor become horribly scruffy looking in the meantime. So, DA course soon, then it'll be up and down the motorway for the little beast. I'll probably use it all summer, and see how I feel come October; I suspect that on the relatively well lit motorway, with the traffic going the same way as me, I may be just fine. Equally, I may have saved up some pennies and bought a BMW K75RT by then.

[mysterious_rider]

upgrade the headlight. gs500 light with a hid kit..
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KAWASAKIIIII

[SamWise72]

That would help, but honestly, I think it was more the dark and the rain and grime on my visor. I wear glasses, and the combination was something fierce!

[UnspeedySam]

I was starting to wonder if you were still alive. I don't blame you a bit for taking a break...it's been a bloody horrible winter.
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Riding: Does an Audi estate count?
Fixing: Honda VFR750 RC36 '94 and MZ ETZ 251 '90
Gone: ZZR600 '00, TRX850 '97, RXS100 '93, JS125-6B '07, BMW R1100RS '93, Kawasaki ZX-6R-J2 '01,Honda Bros NT400 NC25 '88

[SamWise72]

Part of the reason I'm not easy to kill is that I'm reasonable at spotting when I might be about to do it

I have money on the way in the next few weeks for a test. I've also just bought a Jag XJ6 4 litre Sport, so driving is currently more of a pleasure than usual....

[mysterious_rider]

[SamWise72]

If I take the glasses off, I might as well just close my eyes I did try everything I could to keep the visor clean; washing it carefully every night, using polish to make the water bead off better, wiping it with my glove.

If it's not a problem for you, brilliant, but just to be clear, whatever I tried, I couldn't see shit in those conditions.

[i.p.phrealy]

the head light on most chinese bikes is pretty dire, I know it is on mine.
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it is impossible to lick your own elbow...
and if you just tried you need professional help.
Finally allowed a big bike 19/03/14!

[Teflon-Mike]

[thosoneill]

suppose he could let us know how reliable a jag is

[SamWise72]

[Efes123]

[SamWise72]

[SamWise72]

Oh, an XJS. I'm slow off the mark today. Anyway, you don't have to kill for 30 mpg, you can get it for about £600 (mine was more but it's rust free, waxoyled, and generally in very very good nick. And it's black. Which is the right colour). The temptation to floor it to hear the muffled roar and feel it haul the horizon towards you unfeasibly quickly is always there, though.....

[Efes123]

Aye, this is my third Jag, although the missus say it has to go now I have three bikes I did have a series 3, and actually drove it to Turkey, and back, that was a holiday and a half Got it to 120 on the autobahn, but bottled it after a few minutes, it was 20 years old after all. I think I was getting about 3 mpg at that point, but a great smile factor
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Honda Goldwing GL 1000 Current love
Honda VT500 ED - SOLD
Projects Suzuki GS125 Done, then stolen - Kawasaki GPX750R SOLD - Honda VF750S SOLD

[Teflon-Mike]

LPG never 'pays for itself'...

I have two LPG'd Range-Rovers, neither kit has clambered out the car with a wallet and offered to pay for a fillup!

You dont 'Save' money by spending money... you save money NOT
spending money!

Woman's logic; buys three times as much shampoo as she needs, becouse its on a 3 for 2 offer, and claims to have 'saved' almost two quid for the free bottle, when in fact she's actually spent almost two quid more than intended to buy the second bottle, she didn't need; in order to get yet a third bottle she doesn't need even more!

At best, you buy an LPG kit, and it improves the saleabilty of the car if you want to punt it on at any point. Some-times it may add a bit of value to the resale, but don't bank on it.

Meanwhile the primea-facia estimates that at 90p/l compared to £1.35/l, you are going to 'save' 30% dont work out.

Unless you buy effoff expensive sequential injection gas system; you still need full-price fuel for warm up. On a big engine, that can be a long time, and anything under perhaps, five miles, you are often gong to be where you want to go, before the thermostat reckons the evaporator is hot enough to start boiling gas and let you switch over to the cheap stuff.

MPG will also tend to drop slightly on gas; again depends on the system how bad the drop off may be, but its in the order of 5%.

Engine will hapily burn full-price petrol, or cheap gas, but to get the best out of either fuel, the mixture has to be spot on and the ignition timing optimised, and if you want ultimate LPG performance, best burrowing into the engine and re-tuning it; they can handle and like a lot more compression, and a bit of camming, to get the 'bulk' charge into the motor and squash the heck out of it.

Running 'Duel-Fuel' its always going to be a compromise; there are a few widgets that can improve things a bit; ignition advance by retard units; closed loop gas mixture valves etc... but you wont get the best out of either fuel, and power will drop and mpg go up one one, other or both depending on set up.

It is noticeable; on one 30mph road near me, if I'm on FPF, then the Rangie will drive up its mild incline like its not there; but if I'm on gas.... its 'just' steep enough that the Auto-box down shifts to make up the extra oomph.

While on gas, while the engine is not significantly less powerful.... we're talking the power of a couple of lawn mowers of a clapped out CG125 over a couple of hundred ponies..... it IS significantly less responsive, the effective fuel mapping of the 'bulk' gas being a lot less precice, and having quite a bit more 'lag' when you want to shift a big chunk of it in a hurry.

Think about it; Rangie is quoted at 15mpg. Thats a third of a litre, a coke can quantity of liquid fuel, every mile, or at 60per, every minute..... I'd struiggle to down a can of coke in a minute..... but that's the flow rate of fuel at highway speeds. Now boil that coke to about 25 times liquid volume, and its STILL a compressed gas!

On gas, car feels decidedly lazier, both because of the lower response, and the small power loss. Ecconomy you get from the stuff, is then flattered by it disenclining you to drive it very hard... and as some-one once suggested to me.... why have a V8 if you ENT going to make it howl? Might as well have an Aga engine in there! He has a point! One probably more pertinant to a sporty saloon or exec coupe.

So... yes, gives you that option to make it shift when you want; or sit back, relax and enjoy cheap motoring.... but when you do want it to bustle, you have to flick the switch, let it clear its pipes, then it will go.... with a nagging thought in the back of your mind... "This is costing me a fortune!"

Which it is anyway... becouse very unlikely you will EVER see any of that 'saving' from bunging in 90p gas instead of £135 FPF.... you will still fill up, and probably more often given the small capacity tanks you can fit in a saloon...... "Oh, only costs £30 to fill! What the heck"... so you will simply drive to whatever your budget will allow...... which is fine..... you sort of forget the 'this has to pay for itself' suggestion from the beginning, and start making excuses like "Yeah, but think how much I would have to spend if I was buying Full-Price-Fuel for ALL these miles I HAVE (suddenly they are all essential hourneys!) to do!"

Until, one evening, you find yourself, miles from home, in an LPG 'black-spot', where you have just driven ten miles to find the petrol station in the LPG guide.... to discover that it stopped selling the stuff three years ago, when the franchise changed... and chap behind the counter knows of no other place that does it, and casually comments "Yeah, get a lot of people asking for that!" and you have a dilemah, do you fill with FPF? Do you go hunting the next LPG outlet in the book, another 15miles off your route? Do you go home on FPF and take the hit, and fill up at your regular LPG place on Monday!

At which point, suddenly LPG has not saved you anything; encouraged you to carry on spending, and worse, dropped you in the shit having to spend MORE than you had intended....

Great stuff, and is nice to run cheap fuel; but you have to look at it as a 'Bonus' when you can run on it, rather than expecting to.

If you really want to save money.... don't drive! Ask yourself WHY you need to go some-where, and get the miles down!

Rangie oiffers good example of how much its not the car that effects ecconomy, but how you drive it.

If I get on the Motorway for a long haul down to a Landy-Meet, and cruise at a considereate 55mph, I can get the fuel consumption up over 25, nudging the 30 mark. Especially if I have the road tyres on, and pumped up. Muds, at lower pressure, and getting a husstle on, that can drop back into the low teens... or out of them... while round town, single figures are not hard to see.

That's almost 90% varience either way, depending on driving conditions & style; or +/- 50% fuel costs, whichever fuel its running on.

But, average annual mileage is around 15K miles a year, for average car. Average commuter, travels eight miles to and from work five days a week, forty five weeks a year; that;s only 3,600 miles. Less than 1/4 of the annual mileage put on the car, the 'essential' road miles. Rest is cranked up going to the shops, popping round to see freinds; "Social Domestic Pleasure' as the insurance companies class it. Of all that mileage, three times the miles used going to and from work; aproximately 2/3 is shear convenicence miles, becouse the car is there.

IF you thought about your journeys; and didn't waste miles poping frivilousely to teh shop for a pint of milk or whatever, you could probably halve your annual mileage and more than halve your annual fuel spend, as well as the maintenence costs......

Lots of ways to find ecconomy... and as said, best way to save money is not spend it in the first place!

Works for me, at least! If only because I rarely have it to spend in the first place! V8 Range-Rovers plus motorbikes, and low rate mobility allowance to pay for them does not leave a large margin for inneficiency!
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[SamWise72]

Ok, well, in counter to that:

My commute is three days a week, 62 miles each way, 50 of them motorway, so warmup is not an issue. There's an LPG station on the motorway en route, so fillup won't even take me out of my way. Furthermore, when I'm doing a big programme of workshops (5 months out of the year), then I'm driving to Leicester, North Derbyshire, Newcastle, Plymouth, all over the place. I'm sure I'll have to use full price petrol some of the time, but even if I just have one fill of LPG for each of those trips, the saving will be significant.

Yes, it's fun to put the boot down and hear the big cat roar, but the main reason I bought it was for quiet, comfortable motorway cruising, and when I do that, it returns 30mpg on petrol, and should be approaching 40mpg cost equivalent on gas. I have a 1 litre Hijet, a 125 motorbike, and a wide selection of bicycles (including one that will carry both kids and a whole week's shopping) for those around town trips; given that the Jag is like parking an oil tanker, there's no temptation to use it for that.

Bottom line, I HAVE to do a lot of miles for my job. I could have bought a little diesel hatchback, I could have bought a diesel luxobarge, and either would have given me better fuel consumption, but I didn't want to, I decided I wanted a car that I'd love getting into. At £1250, it's not going to lose a lot of value; it's waxoyled and dead straight, and the engine has been looked after.

I might decide on something different in 6 months; what I'm not going to do is spend the money on an LPG kit until I'm sure I'm going to keep the Jag. There's part of me that thinks I should have gone with a Daimler (even more toys, walnut picnic tables, and most important, cruise control. Can't believe mine doesn't have cruise!), there are other parts of me that think in a year's time, I might decide to go for a diesel Peugeot 106, and get 60+mpg. For now, I'm doing this, and getting my bike test. Everything else has yet to be decided. I want to be able to 125 it to work before too long, and maybe then I'll save for a BMW K75RT, maybe not. Life is full of happy choices

[SamWise72]

[Teflon-Mike]

[Efes123]

[D O G]

[SamWise72]

I am a trainer and instructional designer. A chunk of my time is spent in the office, designing eLearning, the other chunk on the road running workshops. And no, I am not a lady, I'm a 6'3, 16 stone bloke.

My choices? I guess you could say they're illogical. The 125 was just an attempt to find the cheapest way to get to work. Motorways ARE boring, but an hour each way sitting on the bike, with the iPod in, is fine. I don't think I necessarily want to do it all winter (certainly not when it's icy), but I could do at least 8 months if the year, and mostly enjoy it. I may well replace the 125 with a BMW K75 when I've passed my test; the mileage is almost as good (K75 owners allege 70 mpg; my 125 gets 80), and I'd be more comfortable both on a bigger bike (I'm a big bloke for a 125 cruiser) and sitting behind a barn door of a fairing. It would also be more fun, probably. For now, though, a 125 is just fine. I've got a LOT of experience driving and riding slow vehicles (1971 Bedford Bus to India at 50 mph, quite a lot of UK miles in a big Mercedes minibus at 50mph, right around the country in my HiJet at 55mph, not to mention several months on the 125 earlier in the year). I'm not worried about riding it on the motorway; I have NEVER need speed to get me out of trouble.

As far as the Jag, yes, it's illogical. I had found I could afford to drive the Hijet to work, but it's noisy and I bought it when I was only doing work travel by train. It's my microcamper, and my trailer tent tow vehicle, and my people mover, and my piano deliverer etc etc. It wasn't a good idea to punish the old girl with all those miles.

The logical thing would have been to buy a little diesel hatchback, but I did the maths, and guess what? I can afford to drive the Jag to work, specially if I ride the bike a lot too, and my mileage allowance more than covers me for fuel for longer distances. I've been a car and bike nut all my life, but just about every car choice has been very practical (even the hydraulic Citroens I've owned have been very cheap to buy and run), and I just felt like treating myself to an awesome toy. I'm single, I work hard, and if I choose to spend some of my disposable income running a gentleman's club on wheels, then I will

The truth is I've always been a bit of an extremist. I always want to be doing something that's the most economical, or the coolest, or something that people think I can't do. When I was still married, I gave up my car completely for several years, bought a Brompton, and only travelled by train (and this was when I was doing a job that took me all over the country, 3-4 days a week). Prior to that I'd run a Citroen AX diesel which was really too small for my body, but would get me 70mpg if I drove at 55, which, believe it or not, I did. Before that, it was a Citroen XM diesel, because I like me a luxobarge, and again, that would get me 50mpg. These things feel like adventures to me; I know other people would rather buy a sensible, medium sized diesel hatchback for £3000 and run it for years, but I'd rather buy something tiny and frugal for £500, run it for a year on fumes, then switch to something gigantic and comfortable, etc etc. It's how I've always been, and though it doesn't make my life easy, it's fun, at least for me.

[SamWise72]

Teflon Mike - your maths is a bit out of whack. My actual fuel bills are more like £3200 for the commuting (or were in the HiJet, will be more in the Jag), and a reasonable LPG system for a 6 is about £1300 now. I'll calculate the payback period carefully, and be sure that I intend to keep the car that long before I take the plunge.

I did consider buying an LPG converted one, but went for this one because of the condition (better than most £3,000 cars). If an LPG converted Daimler comes up for under a grand, I might jump on it.