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Legality of Japanese Helmet (Non ECE)

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deadwolf
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PostPosted: 02:36 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Legality of Japanese Helmet (Non ECE) Reply with quote

I'm interested in buying a helmet from Japan that claims to meet the Japanese SG standard but isn't tested for UK standards. The helmet:

https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/crowracing/item/491899/

With UK laws having clear restrictions on what standards are legal, I'm not sure how much grey area there is regarding helmet standards, especially when you have that exception where Sikhs are allowed to forego helmets in lieu of a turban.

Will wearing that Japanese helmet get me taken down by the plod the moment they see me?
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 02:47 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL no.
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SQL
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PostPosted: 02:51 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you are that worried buy the kitemark sticker (or print it) and buy a ACU sticker on egay.
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J.M.
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PostPosted: 07:07 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

How many times has your helmet actually been inspected by the plod? I know that none of my helmets have ever been inspected, even with tinted visors.

So long as you're wearing a helmet, I very much doubt that they're ever going to question in.

Worst case scenario, you have a small fine to pay (around £20).
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Efes123
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PostPosted: 07:35 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

WTF
Quote:
New sense neo-futuristic full-faced helmet AKIRA! !
The plating lacing braid which is rare on a full-faced helmet has good parenthesis!


What a load of bollox, and why would you want good round brackets () on a helmet Confused

Are those studs for a visor? Good luck getting a replacement in a year or so. Why would you want to do this, it's not as though there's a lack of choice in the UK.
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j.silvs
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PostPosted: 08:07 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Customer Reviews

Posted by ちゃっぴー0819 on 1/24/12 I will buy a vintage helmet or was at a loss, but I was careless, but the price is cheap, and this helmet may ask a shop for paint by a carry-on with a helmet before a hand does not appear pricewise and purchases it when paint is different from an image and! !The form is the best, too! !I examine the purchase of other colors! !

Posted by ガンダムン0560 on 9/15/11 I think that you may take an appearance and the lightness, but I am sorry that a silver part of the relationship came off. A shield is the best as a demand more if attached!

Posted by a buyer on 3/13/08 I longed for the toe cutter army corps of the mad max, and I wanted you to want a helmet made in BELL company of the 70s, and it was unbearable, but the genuine article was rare for the times and was high and could not reach it, and the replica did not seem to be made too much, and this article made a hit when I looked for it to look for it and rolled it up! As for the form and the size a color (is way of vulgarity rhinoceros Coe of the lam!) ) is perfect, too, but a price is splendid even if I say anything! If, as for the maker stock, rather less みたいなので is at a loss comparatively; atto-...
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Great reviews too lol, what is a rhinoceros Coe of the lam?

The first one is the best
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fox
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PostPosted: 08:43 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

J.Silvs wrote:
Quote:
Customer Reviews

Posted by ちゃっぴー0819 on 1/24/12 I will buy a vintage helmet or was at a loss, but I was careless, but the price is cheap, and this helmet may ask a shop for paint by a carry-on with a helmet before a hand does not appear pricewise and purchases it when paint is different from an image and! !The form is the best, too! !I examine the purchase of other colors! !

Posted by ガンダムン0560 on 9/15/11 I think that you may take an appearance and the lightness, but I am sorry that a silver part of the relationship came off. A shield is the best as a demand more if attached!

Posted by a buyer on 3/13/08 I longed for the toe cutter army corps of the mad max, and I wanted you to want a helmet made in BELL company of the 70s, and it was unbearable, but the genuine article was rare for the times and was high and could not reach it, and the replica did not seem to be made too much, and this article made a hit when I looked for it to look for it and rolled it up! As for the form and the size a color (is way of vulgarity rhinoceros Coe of the lam!) ) is perfect, too, but a price is splendid even if I say anything! If, as for the maker stock, rather less みたいなので is at a loss comparatively; atto-...
Go Back to Product Page Top


Great reviews too lol, what is a rhinoceros Coe of the lam?

The first one is the best


You beat me to it! Funny Asians are funny Laughing
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 09:48 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

For every non-EU-approved helmet brought into the UK two baby kittens are mercilessly flatted by a steam roller. Crying or Very sad

I don't know if our plod are up to speed on helmet approval. They're not all clued-up on the one headlamp on in a twin headlamp bike. Smile

I think as long as you are wearing a helmet they won't bat an eyelid.

But in an accident, your face may be pressed into the helmet and when you awaken from the coma you will look Japanese (But an F-ugly Japanese though.)
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ElBandido
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PostPosted: 09:52 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Re: Legality of Japanese Helmet (Non ECE) Reply with quote

Scud wrote:
I'm interested in buying a helmet from Japan that claims to meet the Japanese SG standard but isn't tested for UK standards. The helmet:

https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/crowracing/item/491899/

With UK laws having clear restrictions on what standards are legal, I'm not sure how much grey area there is regarding helmet standards, especially when you have that exception where Sikhs are allowed to forego helmets in lieu of a turban.

Will wearing that Japanese helmet get me taken down by the plod the moment they see me?



The ECE standard is to do with whether or not you can use that helmet on a track and whether or not UK suppliers can sell that helmet - no ECE means you cannot use that lid at a track and it cannot be stocked/sold by UK suppliers.
it is perfectly legal for you to buy a lid in Japan/Australia/USA etc who don't use the ECE standard and you can use that lid for everyday riding with no drama from plod.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:20 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Re: Legality of Japanese Helmet (Non ECE) Reply with quote

ElBandido wrote:
The ECE standard is to do with whether or not you can use that helmet on a track

Lulwut? Neutral Are you thinking of ACU?

Here's the law: The Motor Cycles (Protective Helmets) Regulations 1998.

tl;dr - write ECE 22.05 on it, and ride.

If it ever becomes an issue - and it won't - and you really fancy a day in court rather than a £60 non-endorsable fine, then argue that it "is of a type manufactured for use by persons on motor cycles which by virtue of its shape, material and construction could reasonably be expected to afford to the wearer a degree of protection from accidental injury similar to or greater than that provided by a helmet of a type prescribed [by the Regulations]".

Then throw some gang signs to keep it real, yo.
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Fnatic
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PostPosted: 11:45 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd imagine if you suffered a serious head injury wearing an illegal helmet, you'd receive a much lessened compensation payment under the principle of contributory negligence.

Not only that, but wearing a non EU/UK helmet is no different in law than wearing no helmet.
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deadwolf
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PostPosted: 15:04 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies, now I'm somewhat reassured about the odds of getting busted.

Efes123 wrote:

Are those studs for a visor? Good luck getting a replacement in a year or so. Why would you want to do this, it's not as though there's a lack of choice in the UK.


Not planning to use a visor if I can help it, there's a goggle holder on the back so I might go and copy Toecutter's style.

J.Silvs wrote:
Quote:
Customer Reviews

Posted by ちゃっぴー0819 on 1/24/12 I will buy a vintage helmet or was at a loss, but I was careless, but the price is cheap, and this helmet may ask a shop for paint by a carry-on with a helmet before a hand does not appear pricewise and purchases it when paint is different from an image and! !The form is the best, too! !I examine the purchase of other colors! !

Posted by ガンダムン0560 on 9/15/11 I think that you may take an appearance and the lightness, but I am sorry that a silver part of the relationship came off. A shield is the best as a demand more if attached!

Posted by a buyer on 3/13/08 I longed for the toe cutter army corps of the mad max, and I wanted you to want a helmet made in BELL company of the 70s, and it was unbearable, but the genuine article was rare for the times and was high and could not reach it, and the replica did not seem to be made too much, and this article made a hit when I looked for it to look for it and rolled it up! As for the form and the size a color (is way of vulgarity rhinoceros Coe of the lam!) ) is perfect, too, but a price is splendid even if I say anything! If, as for the maker stock, rather less みたいなので is at a loss comparatively; atto-...
Go Back to Product Page Top


Great reviews too lol, what is a rhinoceros Coe of the lam?

The first one is the best


IIRC that website translates trousers and jeans as 'underwear'... Gods know what they call proper undies.

Once you get a hang of it you can extract the meaning from the gibberish. Second review is complaining that the chrome trim is cheap and rubs off easily. Rhino guy wants to do the Toecutter look and is bemoaning the fact that vintage Bell Moto helmets now sell for $$$ because they've become trendy across the pond and it's hard to find a similar style of helmet that's new and affordable.

Walloper wrote:
But in an accident, your face may be pressed into the helmet and when you awaken from the coma you will look Japanese (But an F-ugly Japanese though.)


Being Oriental myself I doubt that would change much. These eyes ain't gonna get any squintier Laughing
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ElBandido
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PostPosted: 15:35 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Re: Legality of Japanese Helmet (Non ECE) Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
ElBandido wrote:
The ECE standard is to do with whether or not you can use that helmet on a track

Lulwut? Neutral Are you thinking of ACU?


i don't know what ACU is, but what i meant is that to wear a lid on a track (e.g. for a track day), it MUST comply with the ECE standard. without the ECE (or kitemark) it can be used for riding on the road but not at a track.

but for any lid to be SOLD in the UK, it must have either the kitemark or be ECE compliant.
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Jim Mc
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PostPosted: 15:55 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

You are thinking of ACU, not ECE. The sole purpose of the ACU is as you've stated above, you have to have their fancy pants sticker on your helmet to gain access to a track. This is for ACU affiliated tracks only mind you, however I'm not aware of any which aren't ACU members.

Kitemark is specific to BSI which has been superseded by ECE and is required to legally ride on the road in the UK and EC member states.
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ElBandido
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PostPosted: 16:08 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim Mc wrote:
You are thinking of ACU, not ECE. The sole purpose of the ACU is as you've stated above, you have to have their fancy pants sticker on your helmet to gain access to a track. This is for ACU affiliated tracks only mind you, however I'm not aware of any which aren't ACU members.

Kitemark is specific to BSI which has been superseded by ECE and is required to legally ride on the road in the UK and EC member states.


oh ok, thanks for clarifying... all these different standards and specifications get confusing.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 17:47 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fnatic wrote:
Not only that, but wearing a non EU/UK helmet is no different in law than wearing no helmet.

Read the whole of the Regulation.

I can find a reference that claims that Japanese SG meets or exceeds US DOT (FMVSS 218), which itself meets or exceeds ECE 22-05.

I'd call that "reasonable expectation".
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ElBandido
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PostPosted: 19:24 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
Fnatic wrote:
Not only that, but wearing a non EU/UK helmet is no different in law than wearing no helmet.

Read the whole of the Regulation.

I can find a reference that claims that Japanese SG meets or exceeds US DOT (FMVSS 218), which itself meets or exceeds ECE 22-05.

I'd call that "reasonable expectation".


that's another point that adds to the confusion. when i was doing my CBT, i was told that you can where a lid from anywhere - it doesn't have to be UK/EU certified.
i had a lid which has the kite mark but is pre-ECE, then i was told what Rogerborg is saying - that my lid HAD TO BE ECE certified. so i bought a new lid, and promptly got told that i need not have got a new lid and could legally ride with my non-ECE lid!

i don't know anymore. just to be safe, i'll stick with ECE certified lids.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 19:45 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, I'm not saying that. As always, I'd suggest that you read the actual Regulations and decide for yourself.

The BSI kite mark is fine, that's what's actually specified in the Regs. An ECE marked helmet is allowed as an alternative. Pretty much all helmets you buy now will be ECE marked though as that covers them most places in Europe - although I wouldn't be surprised if Ze Germans have some extra TUV bollocks going on.

Then we get to visors, which are covered by a whole different set of regs. IIRC, mine has an "E13" sticker peeling off on it, which means it's ostensibly been approved by, uh... Luxembourg. Technically, when that sticker blows off then it magically becomes un-approved, even though there's no practical way of verifying that it actually passed any testing to begin with.

And I expect that's why there's that surprising bit of common sense in the helmet Regs, although I'm not ruling out a very convenient "infinite monkeys on keyboards" accident.
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DottyDuck
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PostPosted: 19:54 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

nevermind the helmet i like the coke can holder for the handle bars! Smile

p.s i kind off like that helmet :O Sick
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ElBandido
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PostPosted: 20:02 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
No, I'm not saying that. ...


sorry mate, i put your name in it by accident. i meant to write "i was told what Fnatic is saying...".
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pits
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PostPosted: 23:53 - 07 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Always thought you could wear what you wanted as long as you expect it to give reasonable protection the same as any other lid.
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illuminateTHE...
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PostPosted: 01:29 - 08 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was about to make a similar thread about using karting helmets on the road. I have 3 karting helmets, 2 arai's (one painted) and one v2 pro.
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radicalrabit
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PostPosted: 02:04 - 08 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I threw one of them away when I moved house, an Old Bell helmet with a press stud vizor was ugly when I bought it and a gobbin shade of blue
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PostPosted: 02:21 - 08 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mate, I ride with a Bandit Alien ll (not street legal) airbrushed up with teeth and shit on it and a Predator helmet with dreadlocks and a a very small visor and red LED lights on it.

Never been pulled with either of them on and in fact got thumbs up from plod a few times with the Predator.

I wouldn't worry about it!
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deadwolf
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PostPosted: 11:30 - 08 Apr 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

DOTTYDUCK wrote:
nevermind the helmet i like the coke can holder for the handle bars! Smile

p.s i kind off like that helmet :O Sick


I saw it first Twisted Evil

pits wrote:
Always thought you could wear what you wanted as long as you expect it to give reasonable protection the same as any other lid.


Makes sense, but I guess different sorts have different expectations as to what reasonable protection looks like.

ZX Jay wrote:
Mate, I ride with a Bandit Alien ll (not street legal) airbrushed up with teeth and shit on it and a Predator helmet with dreadlocks and a a very small visor and red LED lights on it.


And here I was thinking stuff like that only existed in my dreams.. would be nice seeing more of that stuff on the roads, lol. Brightens up the day (hah).

illuminateTHEmind wrote:
I was about to make a similar thread about using karting helmets on the road. I have 3 karting helmets, 2 arai's (one painted) and one v2 pro.


The moment you mentioned karting helmets I was hoping like hell that you'd wear one of these on a bike on the road:

https://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/Url.do?r=karting/helmet-visors-fitting-kits/demon-tweeks-turbo-visor&utm_source=KART1246&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=TurboVisor
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