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BikerGirlNI
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Joined: 19 Jul 2013
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PostPosted: 10:02 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: need some urgent advice. Reply with quote

going to see a bike very soon and need some help. the bike in question is a 1985 Kawasaki Zx750-g2. guy says it needs a set of pick ups or pick up or something? says the bike starts and runs fine but the pick up warms up and stops her.

anyone be able to give me some advice on it as ive never heard of this before and have only a little knowledge on bikes.

sorry if its a stupid question

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Timmeh
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PostPosted: 10:16 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like a load of bollocks to me.

I'd avoid it tbh, save your pennies and buy a bike that works.
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von1papen
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PostPosted: 10:21 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps he means the coils?

If these are done then they may overheat and cause the bike to cut out.

I honestly would be careful of buying a bike with possible dodgy electrics if you have little experience of working on them. If you really want it get an experienced mate/someone off here to go look at it.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 10:22 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ask him to post the problem on here, no such thing as a "Pick up" that will stop a bike.
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BikerGirlNI
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PostPosted: 10:27 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

von1papen wrote:
Perhaps he means the coils?

If these are done then they may overheat and cause the bike to cut out.

I honestly would be careful of buying a bike with possible dodgy electrics if you have little experience of working on them. If you really want it get an experienced mate/someone off here to go look at it.


@ timmeh. yeah ano what you mean, im really only lookin a project and its goin very cheap so not sure what to do.

@von1papen yea thats what i was thinking, my uncle is a mechanic but im just wondering if coils were the case. how much would it cost to replace and is it a big job?
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J.M.
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PostPosted: 11:08 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

My thoughts would be: if it starts and runs nicely before cutting out, it's very unlikely that there's anything too terminal wrong with it. You're unlikely to have to start stripping the engine and rebuilding the thing.

However pick-ups don't just stop working at temperature and require replacement. So that means he's either trying to fob off a more serious problem to someone who'll go "ooh, that sounds like an easy fix!" or he doesn't really know what he's talking about and can't get it running, hence the sale.

When buying a cheap project, always ask yourself some questions:
"If it's 90% complete and just needs a few small jobs, why doesn't the owner do the few small jobs to finish their beloved project and earn more money on it?"
"If it's an easy fix, why doesn't the owner fix it and sell it for more money? If they know it's an easy fix, they obviously know what's wrong with it?"

Coils have been easy to replace on every bike I've ever owned, but I've never owned that bike. Check eBay for the price of some used ones or wemoto for the price of new ones to give yourself an idea for the cost of those.

Dodgy electrics make for a mostly easy fix, but you'll have to learn to get handy with a multimeter and a wiring diagram to trace down the faults. There are also other possibilities of things that could be wrong with it. Perhaps the fuel tank has a blocked breather?

If your uncle is a mechanic, I'd take him with you to view the bike and ask for his thoughts on the machine.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 11:15 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

G model ZXR750s are dirt cheap anyway. I expect you could pick up a near mint one for £1500. My advice is walk away.
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BikerGirlNI
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PostPosted: 11:29 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

J.M. wrote:
My thoughts would be: if it starts and runs nicely before cutting out, it's very unlikely that there's anything too terminal wrong with it. You're unlikely to have to start stripping the engine and rebuilding the thing.

However pick-ups don't just stop working at temperature and require replacement. So that means he's either trying to fob off a more serious problem to someone who'll go "ooh, that sounds like an easy fix!" or he doesn't really know what he's talking about and can't get it running, hence the sale.

When buying a cheap project, always ask yourself some questions:
"If it's 90% complete and just needs a few small jobs, why doesn't the owner do the few small jobs to finish their beloved project and earn more money on it?"
"If it's an easy fix, why doesn't the owner fix it and sell it for more money? If they know it's an easy fix, they obviously know what's wrong with it?"

Coils have been easy to replace on every bike I've ever owned, but I've never owned that bike. Check eBay for the price of some used ones or wemoto for the price of new ones to give yourself an idea for the cost of those.

Dodgy electrics make for a mostly easy fix, but you'll have to learn to get handy with a multimeter and a wiring diagram to trace down the faults. There are also other possibilities of things that could be wrong with it. Perhaps the fuel tank has a blocked breather?

If your uncle is a mechanic, I'd take him with you to view the bike and ask for his thoughts on the machine.


was just talking to him there again and he said its one of the 2 boxes down by the fly wheel, still insists on calling them pick ups tho lol
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J.M.
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PostPosted: 11:44 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

BikerGirlNI wrote:
was just talking to him there again and he said its one of the 2 boxes down by the fly wheel, still insists on calling them pick ups tho lol


Those boxes would be pickups, the coils will be near the head, attached to the spark plugs by HT leads.

See the attached photo to this post.

210007/A is basically a wheel with a tab on it. This spins around.
59026 has the two pick-ups attached to it. When the tab passes one of the pick-ups, the corresponding coil fires. This will spark the spark plug of the two cylinders which are ready to fire (the other two cylinders will be venting their gasses out during this stroke).

The issue is that I personally know of no reason why these would stop working at temperature. If they were faulty, I'd expect them to be faulty regardless of temperature.

Also if 1 was faulty, the bike would still run, just poorly (2 cylinders would drop out). If you let the revs get too low it would stall, but if you keep them up it should sound a bit like a twin and still run. If both were faulty then all 4 would cut out. However to have the engine get hot perfectly and then both pick-ups stop at the same time? I don't buy that.

My mechanical knowledge isn't extensive, so there's a possibility that I'm wrong and this is plausibile.
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BikerGirlNI
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PostPosted: 11:58 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

J.M. wrote:
BikerGirlNI wrote:
was just talking to him there again and he said its one of the 2 boxes down by the fly wheel, still insists on calling them pick ups tho lol


Those boxes would be pickups, the coils will be near the head, attached to the spark plugs by HT leads.

See the attached photo to this post.

210007/A is basically a wheel with a tab on it. This spins around.
59026 has the two pick-ups attached to it. When the tab passes one of the pick-ups, the corresponding coil fires. This will spark the spark plug of the two cylinders which are ready to fire (the other two cylinders will be venting their gasses out during this stroke).

The issue is that I personally know of no reason why these would stop working at temperature. If they were faulty, I'd expect them to be faulty regardless of temperature.

Also if 1 was faulty, the bike would still run, just poorly (2 cylinders would drop out). If you let the revs get too low it would stall, but if you keep them up it should sound a bit like a twin and still run. If both were faulty then all 4 would cut out. However to have the engine get hot perfectly and then both pick-ups stop at the same time? I don't buy that.

My mechanical knowledge isn't extensive, so there's a possibility that I'm wrong and this is plausibile.


thanks for the diagram. just out of interest what are the offical names of the two boxes?
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J.M.
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PostPosted: 12:03 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pulsing coil, I believe, but don't quote me on that.

The names everybody seems to use are 'pick-ups' or 'pick-up coils' though. Replace the word coil with sensor at your leisure too.

If those do need replacing, you could be looking at $120 USD for an OEM one. Maybe there's one on eBay, used, cheaper. I often buy used spares as they're often fine and ridiculous amounts cheaper.

But I still don't believe that would be the issue.
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BikerGirlNI
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PostPosted: 12:11 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

J.M. wrote:
Pulsing coil, I believe, but don't quote me on that.

The names everybody seems to use are 'pick-ups' or 'pick-up coils' though. Replace the word coil with sensor at your leisure too.

If those do need replacing, you could be looking at $120 USD for an OEM one. Maybe there's one on eBay, used, cheaper. I often buy used spares as they're often fine and ridiculous amounts cheaper.

But I still don't believe that would be the issue.


yeah good idea, im trying to think what would make the bike stop when it gets warm. something to do with the cooling system perhaps?
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MarJay
But it's British!



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PostPosted: 12:22 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

BikerGirlNI wrote:
yeah good idea, im trying to think what would make the bike stop when it gets warm. something to do with the cooling system perhaps?


Some electrical components do break down when warm, but I wouldn't trust this diagnosis. If the bike doesn't run for all you know the engine could have no pistons or something.

I heard an anecdote once about a guy who bought a non runner Kawasaki H1 triple, and he bought it on the basis it had compression on all three cylinders. When he stripped down the engine, he found that there were two pistons, and the third was missing with half a tennis ball there instead!!
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 12:22 - 19 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

BikerGirlNI wrote:
just out of interest what are the offical names of the two boxes?


I've always called them pick ups; I broke mine on my XJ900.
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BikerGirlNI
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PostPosted: 00:44 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok little update guys. decided to just buy the bike anyway as it was very cheap. possibly a mistake but meh, ive wasted alot more than the bike cost in the pub Razz anyway. anyone have any ideas on whats the first thing i should do or check to try and sort the dying when it gets hot problem?
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J.M.
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PostPosted: 01:01 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

BikerGirlNI wrote:
ok little update guys. decided to just buy the bike anyway as it was very cheap. possibly a mistake but meh, ive wasted alot more than the bike cost in the pub Razz anyway. anyone have any ideas on whats the first thing i should do or check to try and sort the dying when it gets hot problem?


Run it till it dies, check the plugs for a healthy blue spark.
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BikerGirlNI
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PostPosted: 01:12 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

J.M. wrote:
BikerGirlNI wrote:
ok little update guys. decided to just buy the bike anyway as it was very cheap. possibly a mistake but meh, ive wasted alot more than the bike cost in the pub Razz anyway. anyone have any ideas on whats the first thing i should do or check to try and sort the dying when it gets hot problem?


Run it till it dies, check the plugs for a healthy blue spark.


it lasts 10 mins before it dies out lol yea will do
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Efes123
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PostPosted: 07:08 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try to make sure you know exactly which model it is, you can find out using the frame and engine numbers. I bought a 1986 GPX750R (as a project bike), which is probably what yours is. They were called different things in different countries. Mine is also known as a ZX750 with an F1 frame, and an F2 engine, they were also known as ninjas in the good ole USA.

Have fun with the project, make sure you put a thread up in Show & Tell. Good luck with getting the carbs in and out. I lost so much skin I ended up swapping out the box for some generic K&N air filters that make life sooo much more easier. Oh, and don't talk to me about the radiator, what a bloody stupid design Evil or Very Mad
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jeddy11
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PostPosted: 10:30 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm if it was an easy fix why hasn't the seller done this it would have to be worth a lot more ?? Thinking

Unless he knows how expensive it will be..

Edit - just seen someone else had already mused these thoughts ... Thumbs Down
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Timmeh
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PostPosted: 10:50 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh well, good luck.
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Marmalade
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PostPosted: 11:13 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always avoid the ones with 'easy fix' mentioned. If it's cheap and easy then do it and sell it.

If it is the case that the seller has no cash to fix it then it's not going to have been serviced or repaired when needed or the seller has tried to fix it, gone through everything and it's going to take a team of factory mechanics the rest of the year to find the actual fault.


Unless it's panel damage or physically broken bits that you can see what you are dealing with.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 12:44 - 20 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have no idea on the exact model of bike the OP has brought? ZXR/GPX or something else?

But if it was cheap enough and the OP has some time and enough cash to treat the machine as a project, then if all the important stuff is ok, like matching frame/engine number's, log book present, and no signs of serious accident damage, then a bike that runs even for a few mins at a time is potentially a good buy for the right price!

Even if it didn't run at all for pennies some bikes a still very much worth having.

From reading most comments on this thread it would seem to me that most of you expect a good running bike with no mechanical or electrical faults even as a project bike? Yes it'd be very different if you were after a cheap winter commuter or a bike to run for a year and sell, or a quick stop gap machine between bikes.

But the OP said it was a Project that they wanted, and again depending on the bike and the price, then I consider something that runs even intermittently a bonus!

You wouldn't wan't some bikes to run even as a project. If you brought an old two stroke multi that has been sat for 15years or so, and tried to start it, then your no better off if it does run, as the crank seals will be buggered straightaway or soon after.
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volvodai
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PostPosted: 19:55 - 24 Jul 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

i also had a problem with a gpz600r would only run for about 10 mins, my problem was with the two water pipes going into the head, the o rings had gone and were squirting water all over the plugs
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