TEFL

[Eddie Hitler]

Has anyone done a TELF course then successfully found work abroad? Looking at some courses and they're around £200. Are they worth the money? Any advice?

Thanks in advance.

[james1988]

[angryjonny]

[Eddie Hitler]

Certainly worth doing then. I'm considering a total change in my life, after reading up about it getting a degree in foreign languages would bolster my chances. Not sure if it's worth the money though, versus a higher chance of work.

[james1988]

I was told by my work colleague that his wife is earning £20hr after it. It seems like a bargain to me.
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Honda XL1000VA '07

[shereen]

[Eddie Hitler]

I mean going to university . If a TELF course is enough then I'm sorted.

Nice one Shereen, will have a read!

[fatpies]

I train CELTA students as one of my day jobs, it costs £1400, takes 4 solid weeks (8am to 6pm), it has 6 pieces of course work, 6 observed lessons (you must pass 5 of them).

The CELTA is graded level 5 (4 pre 2008) (out of 8). The important point to note is that it is at least 120 hours, 150 even better.

The cheaper courses advertised online or with no observed teaching requirements aren't very useful.

With none or a level 2 (and white skin) sure you can get a job in some hell hole in China, but they won't sponsor you so you're effectively an illegal immigrant. Plus the pay will suck and you are completely replaceable at the drop of a hat you think about that....

Finally unqualified teaching isn't actually considered teaching.

Its quite funny watching some come for interview proclaiming they've taught in China for years. You ask them about lesson plans, curricula references, schemes of work and they tend to go pale. While it is comparatively sweet for a short time, these 'teachers' have no real leverage, i.e. because they are so easily replaced they can't really demand anything.

People qualified and experienced tend to stay in the UK (ESOL jobs are rare in the UK but pay fairly well), or go to Saudi, or Japan, Taiwan and Korea in the state system.

As an ATL for instance in Japan you can get 180,000 Yen (its gone down from 250,000 yen because there are too many applicants). While a proper teacher somewhere like Hanamatsu qualified to level 7 (DELTA) you can pull 7-8 million yen (£45K) + bonus + apartment.
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"It's easy to attack and destroy an act of creation. It's a lot more difficult to perform one"

[MCW]

Fatpies is right. Celta is internationally recognised and, in most language schools, a minimum requirement. It is intensive and expensive but, at the end of it, you will be equipped to go and teach.

I did mine years ago when it was the RSA Cert. I then went to Portugal, had a blast, was never without work for the 7 years I was there, and I came back pregnant! (Although I don't think that is mandatory).

I honestly wouldn't waste time and money on a lesser course.

[Eddie Hitler]

Potentially silly question - would I have to choose a particular language when taking CELTA? Or is it more of a broad range of teaching skills I can use in multiple countries?

Just found the Wiki page, don't worry.

[MCW]

[fatpies]

[Eddie Hitler]

I asked before I googled CELTA, do'h.

CELTA looks like my ticket. Looking at other TELF sites with 20 hour courses looked a bit dodgy. The fact I can start the course in November gives me some time to save, too.

Much more research to be had, but this is a great start. Thanks guys.

[MCW]

[Eddie Hitler]

[fatpies]

[MCW]

[Lord Percy]

[MCW]

^^^^^^^^
Absolutely agree with this. The most fun and fulfillment is in being part of the culture. The worst, most embarrassing bit is witnessing ignorant Brits behaving like arrogant morons. I used to cringe and wish I didn't look so bloody English on those occasions.

[fatpies]

[charlie74]

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/boredhousehubby/311641_3937949340257_1659158089_n.jpg


have fun ) and good luck

[Visitor Q]

Fatpies, I take it you teach in England? I'd be curious how much overseas TEFL stuff you've done?

I agree with the broad stroke of your points, but so far as I can tell anywhere I've taught/looked in to (Thailand, China, Vietnam, Cambodia, South Korea, Taiwan) there are jobs available for pretty much any white face.

It's more about moxy.

I have a Bulgarian friend (and sparring partner) whose Chinese is far better than his English, he supports a family happily on a tourist visa.

Where I am, LOADS of Ukrainians and Africans teach English too.

You're absolutely right, you really need a degree for most countries to work legally. But almost every country can and will work around that, due to supply and demand.

Come to think of it, asides from Australia, I haven't really worked legally in 5 years, usually because the tourist visa is much easier and cheaper

Also, it depends very much on what style of teaching you want to do, where you want to go, what hours you want. Etc etc.

For instance, general mug off the street will get $15-20/teaching hour, but usually only get 20 hours a week work.

The grammar points up top are well and truly moot, NESs are not expected to know grammar. Same as average native Mandarin speakers can't explain the myriad uses of 了／的 etc. It obviously helps to know them, and be able to explain them, but we all know them 100% anyway. They 'sound right'. And to be fair, whenever someone chucks a 'whom' in to a sentence it cracks me up.

But the link is just experience. Yes, you'll pull in more money, but there's no need to do that route before you know if you'll enjoy it or not.

I may go teaching route in my future, and if I do... I'll cert up. That's fine. But I never really advise people to lose too much sleep over it.

For the OP. You can teach in 101 different places with no course. The course would help. A uni degree would have been a big bonus, but is not necessary.

Most places provide lessons plans/curriculum, and they provide a framework. Professional establishments want them, yes... but NESs should really just be there to provide conversation practice and highlight (and correct) mistakes.

As for language, as Lord Percy said, take it as a point of pride to order things confidently in the local language without resorting to sock puppet theatre. You will pay an 'English-tax' everywhere you go otherwise, and your students won't respect you. I'm constantly appalled by 'language teachers' married to locals, who can't do basic conversation. The only killer is after you go a few countries and start picking up less useful languages. Thai and Vietnamese, for instance, are very rarely that useful. Except for travelling. I'm bar-working Cambodia while I avoid the Chinese summer, and I'm not going to learn any, really. Whereas Chinese... damn handy. But that means getting well out of your comfort zone and spending time with the locals, being the only white guy in the room, and finding friends with terrible English.

The guy I think would be best man at my wedding, who loves me more than any man in the world, has only just started speaking English. Before that it was all (terrible) Thai.

So, that's my take on it, I suppose. I'll check the thread in a few days for questions/PM's), but you have the professional life-long approach that Fatpies is advocating (which can work very well in the right school/country, but often gets exactly the same pay band/deal as me).

I also just realised how much I posted in the other thread, so meh... have a look at that too.

And Fatpies, you may be interested in this website. My old housemate from Vietnam (who was a TESOL trainer and highest qualified bloke I've met) set it up - ESL teachers united. Trying to start up some kind of union.
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China traffic/travel bike vid - When I make a sweeping statement, please add the word 'statistically' in to the sentence before you bitch...
From September 2014 to January/February 2015 I will not be using any English, nor reading any. As such, I won't be on here. PM at will, but I won't be checking/posting unless in emergencies. Certainly not for the first couple of months. Please berate me savagely if I break that rule...

[Lord Percy]

@ Fatpies - correct on most points, although I didn't actually really want to specifically mention Korean, but I had to for my example .

But yeah you're right about Korea and the flip-floppers. Korea is a richer and more business-oriented country than a lot of their Asian cousins, so all this piss-take holiday-making attitude of foreigners has pushed them to the edge. A couple of years ago a Korean student was interviewed for an article on 'what Koreans really think of foreign English teachers', where her words can basically be condensed down to, "Flip-floppers." It kicked up a huge stink in the ex-pat world, a load of retaliative blog posts from the hard-working fully qualified teachers, and general complaining at the stubbornness of Koreans and their 'racist' attitudes, but anyway whatever happened, it's true that the Seoul government is now kicking out a lot of foreigners in favour of using Korean English teachers instead.

I agree with Bonny too though. I imagine the vast majority of English teaching in Asia is far easier to do, albeit most-likely illegal. When I was in Vietnam I was told I could easily rock up and get a high paid job (not just in teaching) simply because I speak English. No idea how true that is, but it's what some locals told me. But that's not really on topic. Just thought I'd throw it in to make my post more interesting

[Visitor Q]

[fatpies]