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WHAT IS A SUPER BIKE

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The Artist
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PostPosted: 12:49 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
They are categories of bike type.
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 12:51 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Marketing hyperbole.
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The Artist
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PostPosted: 12:55 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
fatpies wrote:
Marketing hyperbole.


As opposed to an American Superbole which they hold every year.
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XanderZZR
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PostPosted: 12:56 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
A super bike is a scalpel sharp track beast with a seat that's designed to not be sat on as you clamber over the thing like a monkey on LSD. Hyper sports were about being the fastest bikes going with a a larger displacement to match.... These then became sports tourers when 30+ something's realised you got the straight line performance of a big capacity sports bike with a more forgiving riding position.

The more interesting debate would be which is better on the road...
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 12:57 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
XanderZZR wrote:
A super bike is a scalpel sharp track beast with a seat that's designed to not be sat on as you clamber over the thing like a monkey on LSD. Hyper sports were about being the fastest bikes going with a a larger displacement to match.... These then became sports tourers when 30+ something's realised you got the straight line performance of a big capacity sports bike with a more forgiving riding position.

The more interesting debate would be which is better on the road...


Push bikes.
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pepperami
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PostPosted: 13:00 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
If you think it`s Super! , then it`s a superbike Wink

1L+ , over 150mph top speed , Very expensive = superbike Thumbs Up
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 13:07 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
pepperami wrote:
If you think it`s Super! , then it`s a superbike Wink

1L+ , over 150mph top speed , Very expensive = superbike Thumbs Up


Nope. Technically it's a 750cc four or 1000cc twin, but the line has been blurred slightly by the addition of 1000cc bikes into WSB and BSB.

So, I'd say it's a 750cc+ four, 900cc+ triple or 1000cc+ twin sportsbike.
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Last edited by MarJay on 13:09 - 14 Aug 2013; edited 1 time in total
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 13:08 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Re: WHAT IS A SUPER BIKE Reply with quote
radicalrabit wrote:
AND WHAT IS A HYPER SPORT OR HYPER TOURER


Superbikes are red with stickers. Hyper sports are red with more stickers. Hyper tourers are silver or black with no stickers.
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pepperami
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PostPosted: 13:10 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
MarJay wrote:

Nope. Technically it's a 750cc four or 1000cc twin, but the line has been blurred slightly by the addition of 1000cc bikes into WSB and BSB.

So, I'd say it's a 750cc+ four, 900cc+ triple or 1000cc twin sportsbike.


I`m absolutely sure you`re 100% right.

I was being tounge in cheek Smile
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G
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PostPosted: 13:30 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Superbikes are big capacity bikes made to be fast in all aspects.

Hyperbikes are big capacity bikes made to be fast in a straight line with even less effort than a superbike, but at the expense of handling.

The graph I adjusted in the other thread came from the 'motorcycle-usa' 2012 hyperbike shootout.
They not unreasonably decided to include the S1000RR in there as it had fairly similar peak power to the big bikes.
https://www.motorcycle-usa.com/9/12922/Motorcycle-Article/2012-Hypersport-Motorcycle-Shootout.aspx
They placed it second.

However, it's still definitely a 'superbike' I'd say; as it also does the corners very well too.
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XanderZZR
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PostPosted: 13:56 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
Superbikes are big capacity bikes made to be fast in all aspects.

Hyperbikes are big capacity bikes made to be fast in a straight line with even less effort than a superbike, but at the expense of handling.

The graph I adjusted in the other thread came from the 'motorcycle-usa' 2012 hyperbike shootout.
They not unreasonably decided to include the S1000RR in there as it had fairly similar peak power to the big bikes.
https://www.motorcycle-usa.com/9/12922/Motorcycle-Article/2012-Hypersport-Motorcycle-Shootout.aspx
They placed it second.

However, it's still definitely a 'superbike' I'd say; as it also does the corners very well too.


All aspects except two up or touring unless you have a butt of steel.

Talking of speed/fast is only one part of the picture, comfort and low down drive in the real world, on the road is a different proposition. As you have alluded to its easier to go fast on a hyperbike.

No question on a track though, but that is what a superbike is designed for.

As mentioned hyperbikes are set up for pure speed, if you removed the 189 speed limiter the picture is much clearer - the s1000rr starts to waggle it's head increasingly over 170mph whereas a hyperbike will stay planted... And yes this is down to the aerodynamics, longer wheelbase etc.

And as for power, your looking at a good 10hp more on the ZZR14 with 30ft-lb more torque. The power is more usable in the real world coming lower in the revs. You need to wring the balls on a superbike to get the super figures.

Handling there is no question, the superbikes are lighter, shorter wheelbase and flick/hold a line much better.

But how many of us ride on a racetrack every day?
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 14:15 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
XanderZZR wrote:
All aspects except two up or touring unless you have a butt of steel.

You need to wring the balls on a superbike to get the super figures.

But how many of us ride on a racetrack every day?


Just quoting the dubious bits.

I did a 2500 mile tour of Spain on 2001 R1, my bum wasn't sore as such, it just got boring sitting in 1 position... then it aches because my wrist is wankered anyway. So I'd tour on the R1 again or use my TL1000S for it.

I didn't need to wind up the R1 to get to super speeds, it did nearly 100mph in 1st gear and it got there in seconds.. Put it in 3rd, 4th... open the throttle and the numbers climb, it barely works up a sweat. Neither do I as its not a barge to hustle round corners.

Shit, even the TL climbs the speedo without increasing revs...

M25 is a racetrack. Thumbs Up

Last edited by P.addy on 14:16 - 14 Aug 2013; edited 1 time in total
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 14:16 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
XanderZZR wrote:


All aspects except two up or touring unless you have a butt of steel.

Talking of speed/fast is only one part of the picture, comfort and low down drive in the real world, on the road is a different proposition. As you have alluded to its easier to go fast on a hyperbike.

No question on a track though, but that is what a superbike is designed for.

As mentioned hyperbikes are set up for pure speed, if you removed the 189 speed limiter the picture is much clearer - the s1000rr starts to waggle it's head increasingly over 170mph whereas a hyperbike will stay planted... And yes this is down to the aerodynamics, longer wheelbase etc.

And as for power, your looking at a good 10hp more on the ZZR14 with 30ft-lb more torque. The power is more usable in the real world coming lower in the revs. You need to wring the balls on a superbike to get the super figures.

Handling there is no question, the superbikes are lighter, shorter wheelbase and flick/hold a line much better.

But how many of us ride on a racetrack every day?


Top speed yes, the superbikes are much lighter than hyperbikes, so accelerate far quicker. The Superbikes also have lower gearing for drive out of corners, whereas the hyperbikes are set up for comfortable cruising.

Buy whatever floats your boat, afterall how many of us work at one end of a 200 miles autobahn and live at the other?
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XanderZZR
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PostPosted: 14:19 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wafer_Thin_Ham wrote:
XanderZZR wrote:


All aspects except two up or touring unless you have a butt of steel.

Talking of speed/fast is only one part of the picture, comfort and low down drive in the real world, on the road is a different proposition. As you have alluded to its easier to go fast on a hyperbike.

No question on a track though, but that is what a superbike is designed for.

As mentioned hyperbikes are set up for pure speed, if you removed the 189 speed limiter the picture is much clearer - the s1000rr starts to waggle it's head increasingly over 170mph whereas a hyperbike will stay planted... And yes this is down to the aerodynamics, longer wheelbase etc.

And as for power, your looking at a good 10hp more on the ZZR14 with 30ft-lb more torque. The power is more usable in the real world coming lower in the revs. You need to wring the balls on a superbike to get the super figures.

Handling there is no question, the superbikes are lighter, shorter wheelbase and flick/hold a line much better.

But how many of us ride on a racetrack every day?


Top speed yes, the superbikes are much lighter than hyperbikes, so accelerate far quicker. The Superbikes also have lower gearing for drive out of corners, whereas the hyperbikes are set up for comfortable cruising.

Buy whatever floats your boat, afterall how many of us work at one end of a 200 miles autobahn and live at the other?


Superbikes accelerate quicker? The zzr1400 is the fastest accelerating production motorcycle with a smidge over 9 second 1/4 mile time out of the crate...
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 14:21 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'd love to see one hit anywhere near 10s as standard.

It depends on the launch. IMHO, the 1000cc supers are more than enough for the road, the hyper things belong in America where they need engine sizes to brag about.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 14:24 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Can't be arsed. I see you've already had this debate with G in another thread. And that's over a quarter of a mile, perhaps I've being too ambiguous.

Over a quarter of a mile, the increased weight and differing CoG of the ZZR allow it to exploit more of it's power before the front wheel comes up.

In the same way that an S1000RR with those plates to stretch the swingarm by 4 - 5 inches would be faster again.
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swampy
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PostPosted: 14:25 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
MarJay wrote:
Nope. Technically it's a 750cc four or 1000cc twin, but the line has been blurred slightly by the addition of 1000cc bikes into WSB and BSB.

So, I'd say it's a 750cc+ four, 900cc+ triple or 1000cc+ twin sportsbike.


Yay, I've got a superbike.... Its also red, which makes it even faster Dance!
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G
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PostPosted: 14:25 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:

And as for power, your looking at a good 10hp more on the ZZR14 with 30ft-lb more torque. The power is more usable in the real world coming lower in the revs. You need to wring the balls on a superbike to get the super figures.

So just over 5% more power - not a massive amount.
Torque figures are irrelevant as previously discussed Wink.
In a gear with a similar speed the S1000RR is slightly behind as far as power goes. However, when either should lift the front in low gears with a flick of the wrists, I wouldn't say you have to 'wring the balls'. Far from it - modern litre bikes can be ridden lazily and fast.

Quote:
But how many of us ride on a racetrack every day?

Race tracks aren't the only place you might want a light and agile bike.
I got my GSXR1000 for commuting - I wanted loads of low down power, while being narrow and manoeuvrable with excellent brakes. It was that lazy and fast bit that I wanted, but without the compromise of size.

Comfort is in the arse of the rider and I know plenty that don't like the longer reach on a hyperbike.

Ham; looking in to it on another thread, comparing a 2000 Busa with a 2006 GSXR1000, the 1000 actually has a lot taller gearing! (About 25% faster than the bigger bike.)
That's going to be partly due to power to weight as the GSXR doesn't have as much mass to get moving.
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lihp
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PostPosted: 14:33 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Superbikes CoG is too high, and they're too short for super quick acceleration.

Sports and superbikes are NOT designed for standing start acceleration, but for high corner speeds.

The big ZZR1400 are lower, have more weight lower down, and are much longer to prevent wheelieing and thus accelerate faster
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radicalrabit
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PostPosted: 18:18 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks for all the responses. I didnt get a blackbird for any other reason than it was what I could get as a trade deal for the R1200RT
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 20:00 - 14 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
https://rogerborg.dnsd.me/superman-monkey-bike.jpg
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lihp
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PostPosted: 11:27 - 15 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
PhilDawson8270 wrote:
Superbikes CoG is too high, and they're too short for super quick acceleration.

Sports and superbikes are NOT designed for standing start acceleration, but for high corner speeds.

The big ZZR1400 are lower, have more weight lower down, and are much longer to prevent wheelieing and thus accelerate faster


XanderZZR,

How do you disagree when what I put is the same as you wrote? Or which bit do you disagree with?

The limiting factor for sports bikes is when the wheel lifts under acceleration. The zzr1400 which you have for example, is heavier, lower and longer which allows more power to be used.

And as you know, makes it accelerate far quicker than a sports bike would do, but, the ZZR will not hold the same corner speeds as these sports bikes.
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G
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PostPosted: 11:33 - 15 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
PhilDawson8270 wrote:

And as you know, makes it accelerate far quicker than a sports bike would do, but, the ZZR will not hold the same corner speeds as these sports bikes.

https://www.motorcycle-usa.com/9/12922/Motorcycle-Article/2012-Hypersport-Motorcycle-Shootout.aspx
BMW is between the two hyperbikes - not much in it for 0-60.
BMW wins the standing quarter mile and braking test.
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 11:34 - 15 Aug 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
PhilDawson8270 wrote:
XanderZZR,

How do you disagree when what I put is the same as you wrote? Or which bit do you disagree with?

The limiting factor for sports bikes is when the wheel lifts under acceleration. The zzr1400 which you have for example, is heavier, lower and longer which allows more power to be used.

And as you know, makes it accelerate far quicker than a sports bike would do, but, the ZZR will not hold the same corner speeds as these sports bikes.


He is a lardy tourer fanboy. He disagreed with me also. Lardy tourers are shite for anything other than bragging rights on engine size and going on long trips.
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