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A question about Advanced Stop Lines and Bus lanes.

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c_dug
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PostPosted: 11:23 - 31 Aug 2014    Post subject: A question about Advanced Stop Lines and Bus lanes. Reply with quote
So firstly, it's been pointed out in recent threads that an ASL only counts for cyclists if there is a gate from the cycle lane into the box. My question is this: If the cycle lane leading up to the ASL is of the dashed line variety, and I am legally riding down the cycle lane to the front of a queue, am I allowed to enter the ASL box through the "gate"?

My second question is not related to the first. Are you legally allowed to cross the solid white line to enter a bus lane, or should it be entered at the dashed line at the beginning of it?
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 11:31 - 31 Aug 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Crossing the solid one nearest you if there are double white lines is an offence. Don't think there's any law saying you can't cross a single solid line (unless it's solid chevrons etc). One example is Blackwall Tunnel northbound - one single solid line down the middle.
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iooi
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PostPosted: 11:52 - 31 Aug 2014    Post subject: Re: A question about Advanced Stop Lines and Bus lanes. Reply with quote
c_dug wrote:
am legally riding down the cycle lane to the front of a queue, am I allowed to enter the ASL box through the "gate"?


No.. Unless you are on a cycle. Motorbikes/scooters are not allowed in cycle lanes.

c_dug wrote:

Are you legally allowed to cross the solid white line to enter a bus lane, or should it be entered at the dashed line at the beginning of it?


If it is legal to enter a bus lane you can do it at any point (timed or if you are allowed) The solid line is to define the bus lane. It is NOT the same as a solid line in the middle of the road.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 12:04 - 31 Aug 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
c_dug wrote:
So firstly, it's been pointed out in recent threads that an ASL only counts for cyclists if there is a gate from the cycle lane into the box. My question is this: If the cycle lane leading up to the ASL is of the dashed line variety, and I am legally riding down the cycle lane to the front of a queue, am I allowed to enter the ASL box through the "gate"?

You can cross the ASL only if you're on "a pedal cycle proceeding in the cycle lane".

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2002/3113/regulation/43/made

There is an issue of whether it's really an ASL if it's got a dashed (advisory) cycle lane feeding into it, and if not, when which of the two lines is the real stop line.

Correcting myself, an advisory lane with a dashed line is OK. In fact, there's actually no permitted variant for a mandatory cycle lane with a solid line. Wink



Pete. wrote:
Don't think there's any law saying you can't cross a single solid line (unless it's solid chevrons etc). One example is Blackwall Tunnel northbound - one single solid line down the middle.

I agree. The issue is whether you can use the lane. The line itself serves only to delimit it.

None of which stops the tools of the state from sending out blackmail demands or even prosecuting, but I'd certainly have a day on court under those circumstances.

Now, off topic...

Pete. wrote:
Crossing the solid one nearest you if there are double white lines is an offence.

Only if crossing from left-to-right.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2002/3113/regulation/26/made

Regs wrote:
every vehicle proceeding on any length of road along which the marking has been so placed that, as viewed in the direction of travel of the vehicle, a continuous line is on the left of a broken line or of another continuous line, shall be so driven as to keep the first-mentioned continuous line on the right hand or off side of the vehicle.


I mention this because while double solids are used with the clear intent of stopping any lane changing...

https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/images/0/0b/Clyde_Tunnel_A739_-_Coppermine_-_10115.jpg

...what the law actually says is that every car in the right hand lane here is a being driven by a criminal.

I believe (possibly erroneously) that Glasgow Cooncil obtained magical superpowers from the Secretary of State to use those lines, but that doesn't mean that you commit an offence by crossing them going right-to-left.

Again though, people do get blackmail letters for it, but I'd we well up for asking the Fiscal to point at the offence in front of a Sheriff.
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Last edited by Rogerborg on 12:09 - 01 Sep 2014; edited 2 times in total
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Andy_Pagin
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PostPosted: 12:09 - 31 Aug 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
From the highway code

Quote:
140

Cycle lanes. These are shown by road markings and signs. You MUST NOT drive or park in a cycle lane marked by a solid white line during its times of operation. Do not drive or park in a cycle lane marked by a broken white line unless it is unavoidable. You MUST NOT park in any cycle lane whilst waiting restrictions apply.


So solid white line cannot be crossed, dotted line shouldn't be crossed, argue the toss with plod if you get stopped. Personally I stay clear of them since cyclists are so bloody unpredictable.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 10:07 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Since we're on the subject of cycle lanes, I thought I'd put this one up for the amusement of the panel.

The Lake District likes to give itself airs and have clearly deciuded they would like to have more cycle lanes because bicycles are fashionable. So they have duly marked out cycle lanes down the main North-South road through the lakes. I'm certain it was the subject of much discussion at council meetings.

The thing is, this is a really narrow road. Their (laughable if it wasn't fo the fact our taxes just paid for these miles of soon to be worn off green paint) implimentation of the cycle lanes leads to one very interesting question.viz If one is not to drive in the cycle lanes, where CAN one drive?
https://www.bikechatforums.com/download.php?id=93561

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SteveSmith
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PostPosted: 10:22 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
stinkwheel wrote:
If one is not to drive in the cycle lanes, where CAN one drive?


Those are advisory cycle lanes (dashed lines), not mandatory ones (solid lines) so you can drive in them. They are just there to "advise" the cyclists where they should be.

Steve.

Last edited by SteveSmith on 11:30 - 01 Sep 2014; edited 1 time in total
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FLV
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Joined: 18 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: 10:29 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
stinkwheel wrote:
Since we're on the subject of cycle lanes, I thought I'd put this one up for the amusement of the panel.

The Lake District likes to give itself airs and have clearly deciuded they would like to have more cycle lanes because bicycles are fashionable. So they have duly marked out cycle lanes down the main North-South road through the lakes. I'm certain it was the subject of much discussion at council meetings.

The thing is, this is a really narrow road. Their (laughable if it wasn't fo the fact our taxes just paid for these miles of soon to be worn off green paint) implimentation of the cycle lanes leads to one very interesting question.viz If one is not to drive in the cycle lanes, where CAN one drive?
https://www.bikechatforums.com/download.php?id=93561

Streetview.


Thats rather silly isnt it.!
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:36 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
stinkwheel wrote:
https://www.bikechatforums.com/download.php?id=93561

Looks pretty dangerous, needs solid double-whites down the centre. Whistle
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map
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Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 11:08 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Re: A question about Advanced Stop Lines and Bus lanes. Reply with quote
iooi wrote:
c_dug wrote:
am legally riding down the cycle lane to the front of a queue, am I allowed to enter the ASL box through the "gate"?
No.. Unless you are on a cycle. Motorbikes/scooters are not allowed in cycle lanes.

Errr, yes they are. Exception being if cycle lane bounded by unbroken white line. When you don't cross over the white line (as you don't cross if in middle of road). Line defines the type of vehicle allowed. To add a caveat, I understand these types of cycle lanes must be created with a Traffic Regulation Order (TRO), no TRO then no offence.

If broken white line then cycle lane is only 'advisory'. In effect it's just another lane on the carriageway.

...although if riding down cycle lane I understand only pedal cycles can pass through the (star)gate (even though your soon to be redundant tax disc says you're on a bicycle).
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 12:11 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Re: A question about Advanced Stop Lines and Bus lanes. Reply with quote
map wrote:
...although if riding down cycle lane I understand only pedal cycles can pass through the (star)gate

Well, that's what the law says.

In practice, Dibble are happily turning a blind eye to cyclists entering the cycle box, and indeed riding straight past the 2nd stop line and through the lights. This, while they berate drivers and motorbikers for stopping in the cycle box, because SAFETY!
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Andy_Pagin
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PostPosted: 15:02 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Re: A question about Advanced Stop Lines and Bus lanes. Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
In practice, Dibble are happily turning a blind eye to cyclists entering the cycle box, and indeed riding straight past the 2nd stop line and through the lights.


Not in London they don't.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 16:57 - 01 Sep 2014    Post subject: Re: A question about Advanced Stop Lines and Bus lanes. Reply with quote
Andy_Pagin wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
In practice, Dibble are happily turning a blind eye to cyclists entering the cycle box any way they like, and indeed riding straight past the 2nd stop line and through the lights.


Not in London they don't.

Oops, sorry, added emphasis and important missing clause. Embarassed

I'm referring to Dibble and Plastic Dibble stopping drivers and riders in London and giving it Tut Tut while pedalists ride past breaking the exact same laws that the motorists are being regaled about.
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