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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 22:40 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Tilt switch Reply with quote

I am experiencing a problem keeping my front wheel down when I launch on the sprint or drag strip. I have the gearing higher than it was and it feels right for the 1/4 mile but I have trouble off the line. I have reverted to sitting right forward on the tank and laid forward over the bars but a few too many revs with a dumped clutch and I am standing on the back wheel and because of my body position it is not easy to control when she comes back down ( I will get hurt or a spectator will get hurt).
I know that the Moto GP riders have devices to kill the motor if they lift, could I just fit a tilt switch into my kill switch circuit or will this set me off like a kangaroo as it cuts in and out?
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Howling TerrorOutOfOffice
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PostPosted: 22:57 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does your bike have an ECU? Razz

I don't need to be an expert to know that a tilt switch wouldn't be sophisticated enough.

Practise more...Buy more friction plates. Smile
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 23:02 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

HT wrote:

I don't need to be an expert to know that a tilt switch wouldn't be sophisticated enough.


A tilt switch, properly setup and connected to the coil will do the job. It will not be smooth at all but it'll keep the wheel down. The only problem you will have is if there is any sort of incline.
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misscrabstick
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PostPosted: 23:03 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Longer swinging arm and more weight over the front is the best I can do, I'd have though any electronic solution will slow you down.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 23:06 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

At work I carry about 40 Gig of memory in my pockets in memory sticks, the Moon Landing Apollo 11 in 1967 had 78K of RAM and ROM combined, my bike has an on off switch (1 byte) Mr. Green
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 23:10 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

misscrabstick wrote:
Longer swinging arm and more weight over the front is the best I can do, I'd have though any electronic solution will slow you down.


I agree about the longer wheelbase ( I have no swing arm as my bike was built in 1936) BTW is that your real photo and are you good at holding an umbrella?
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 23:12 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ichy wrote:


A tilt switch, properly setup and connected to the coil will do the job. It will not be smooth at all but it'll keep the wheel down. The only problem you will have is if there is any sort of incline.

WTF is a coil? My bike has a Joseph Lucas racing magneto but I can kill the spark with a single switch.
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Last edited by Ariel Badger on 23:20 - 18 Oct 2013; edited 1 time in total
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bladerunner
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PostPosted: 23:14 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tilt switch ......not a good idea! Might as well use the kill switch! It wheelies....hit the kill switch...front comes down....hit run.......that's going to cause a massive wheelie! Better technique on the launch required. I always used to slip the clutch like a 2 stroke keep the engine at peak power and feed it in using the clutch...on the bigger bikes 900cc plus....it was dump the clutch with say 1/4 throttle and control the wheelie/ wheel spin with the throttle....std jap sports bikes with wet clutches mind! I don't know what era or spec your machine is but some methanol burning classic springs to mind!
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 23:19 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ariel Badger wrote:
Ichy wrote:


A tilt switch, properly setup and connected to the coil will do the job. It will not be smooth at all but it'll keep the wheel down. The only problem you will have is if there is any sort of incline.

WTF is a coil? My bike has a Joseph Lucas racing magneto.


Common sense applies. Like the fuck I know, or care, what your bike is.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 23:23 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

bladerunner wrote:
Tilt switch ......not a good idea! Might as well use the kill switch! It wheelies....hit the kill switch...front comes down....hit run.......that's going to cause a massive wheelie! Better technique on the launch required. I always used to slip the clutch like a 2 stroke keep the engine at peak power and feed it in using the clutch...on the bigger bikes 900cc plus....it was dump the clutch with say 1/4 throttle and control the wheelie/ wheel spin with the throttle....std jap sports bikes with wet clutches mind! I don't know what era or spec your machine is but some methanol burning classic springs to mind!


What are your 60ft times like? On a good day I hit 2.2 secs and do not want to lose that advantage.
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Howling TerrorOutOfOffice
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PostPosted: 23:33 - 18 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hope Pete. and Kickstart chip-in as they are experienced draggers, I suspect they will say increase wheelbase...so maybe fit the lump into something more suitable?
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bladerunner
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PostPosted: 01:00 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ariel Badger wrote:
bladerunner wrote:
Tilt switch ......not a good idea! Might as well use the kill switch! It wheelies....hit the kill switch...front comes down....hit run.......that's going to cause a massive wheelie! Better technique on the launch required. I always used to slip the clutch like a 2 stroke keep the engine at peak power and feed it in using the clutch...on the bigger bikes 900cc plus....it was dump the clutch with say 1/4 throttle and control the wheelie/ wheel spin with the throttle....std jap sports bikes with wet clutches mind! I don't know what era or spec your machine is but some methanol burning classic springs to mind!


What are your 60ft times like? On a good day I hit 2.2 secs and do not want to lose that advantage.


Erm tbh I would have to drag out my time sheets...I know 0-100mph was in 5.5 seconds tho! And I do tend to wheelie a bit but not to the point of having to throttle off...I find that way the bike dropping the front when selecting the next gear converts the kinetic energy into a bit of extra thrust !
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misscrabstick
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PostPosted: 08:03 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ariel Badger wrote:
misscrabstick wrote:
Longer swinging arm and more weight over the front is the best I can do, I'd have though any electronic solution will slow you down.


I agree about the longer wheelbase ( I have no swing arm as my bike was built in 1936) BTW is that your real photo and are you good at holding an umbrella?


Oh yes it's my photo, no can do with the umbrella though I have a habit of ramming them up sexists arse's.
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Old Git Racing
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PostPosted: 08:22 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watch the speedway riders launching. They get the clutch adjusted so its right at the end of the adjustment without slipping then 'fan' the lever as they are launching to get a bit of slip and control the front wheel.

OGR
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 09:17 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

bladerunner wrote:
Tilt switch ......not a good idea! Might as well use the kill switch! It wheelies....hit the kill switch...front comes down....hit run.......that's going to cause a massive wheelie! Better technique on the launch required. I always used to slip the clutch like a 2 stroke keep the engine at peak power and feed it in using the clutch...on the bigger bikes 900cc plus....it was dump the clutch with say 1/4 throttle and control the wheelie/ wheel spin with the throttle....std jap sports bikes with wet clutches mind! I don't know what era or spec your machine is but some methanol burning classic springs to mind!


It is a 1936 Methanol bike and the real problem is lack of wheelbase causing bad weight distribution. I am not alone in my class with this problem, my mate John almost flattened the tree at Shakespeare Raceway recently. When I launch well it is fine but the margin is fine and there is no time for me to do anything other than weight shift to control it.
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lihp
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PostPosted: 09:27 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

The way to do this is to use a variable potentiometer.

https://www.instrumentationtoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/Linear-Potentiometer-Transducer.jpg

Attached to the forks so that you can measure when they reach full extension. What you then do is run it through a control circuit that reads the resistance and gradually delays the low voltage signal going to the coil so that you end up with a smooth kill. Faster the extension the faster it cuts the ignition.
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misscrabstick
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PostPosted: 12:28 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhilDawson8270 wrote:
The way to do this is to use a variable potentiometer.

https://www.instrumentationtoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/Linear-Potentiometer-Transducer.jpg

Attached to the forks so that you can measure when they reach full extension. What you then do is run it through a control circuit that reads the resistance and gradually delays the low voltage signal going to the coil so that you end up with a smooth kill. Faster the extension the faster it cuts the ignition.


I think he said he had a magneto, this is a ignition device from Victorian times involving magnets and stuff, no coil.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 12:36 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is mag not coil (although I may put an electronic unit into the mag casing at some time) I think I will fit a tilt switch but set it so that it cuts only when the front is stupidly high. I can handle a six inch lift at launch but anything higher that a foot and it will come down out of shape and cost me time anyway
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misscrabstick
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PostPosted: 17:10 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd like to see a pic of this museum piece your racing please Mr Badger, are there any on here anywhere?
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 17:55 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

My pleasure
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misscrabstick
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PostPosted: 18:06 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, I can see that would be very likely to wheelie a lot, it's almost trials bike like in wheelbase and geometry.
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misscrabstick
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PostPosted: 18:09 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thinking about the wheelie thing, thought about lopping a few teeth off the back sprocket to reduce the acceleration off the line?
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Fisty
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PostPosted: 18:22 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fit a wheeilie bar?
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 18:52 - 19 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fisty wrote:
Fit a wheeilie bar?


A four-wheeled bike? That would be a car Smile
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