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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 12:56 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Banned BNP campaign broadcast Reply with quote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=9jSzj1h3xW8

The only thing I found interesting was at the end where a woman mentions a school was offering to teach English as a foreign language. Just scaremongering though. English is the language of the world, after all Laughing
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map
Mr Calendar



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PostPosted: 13:08 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Re: Banned BNP campaign broadcast Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
...English is the language of the world, after all Laughing

...and French Wink ...and I believe if you want to do worldwide business, Cantonese Very Happy Thumbs Up
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 13:10 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:

The only thing I found interesting was at the end where a woman mentions a school was offering to teach English as a foreign language. Just scaremongering though. English is the language of the world, after all Laughing



Except it is, it used to be only Universities then colleges that offered EAP (English for academic purposes). As the foreign student market is super lucrative.

However due to mass migration children from all over who were not born in the UK or were exposed to whatever language as a child (and therefore it is their L1). They need to be taught English as a second language.

You get EAP assistants and entire EAP classes which happen over lunch time and after school as well.

The difference is the last 20 years have had uber migration.


My sister is a prime example, she was raised in Germany till she was 4, so her L1 is German, but then mum and her moved out to live with my dad who was working overseas till she was 8 so her L2 is Portuguese.

When they moved back to the UK she came to a UK school, the teacher essentially asked if she was retarded because she was multilingual but not in English.

BTW English is in its twilight years, RP and British English is actually a minority dialect, the L2 English speakers are modifying the language heavily and it is effectively breaking off into a related but different language. I had a Polish girl in my class and they don't use present perfect, they use vast amounts of Elision such that sentences seem to be missing adverbs and adjectives.
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 13:11 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Re: Banned BNP campaign broadcast Reply with quote
map wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:
...English is the language of the world, after all Laughing

...and French Wink ...and I believe if you want to do worldwide business, Cantonese Very Happy Thumbs Up


Cantonese? Cantonese is actually a minority language/dialect, 55million speakers and diminishing, esp since HK area is now teaching Mandarin instead of Cantonese.
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 14:34 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Weird bit at the start, but I'm sure they will do well up North well the government dumped all the migrants.
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Mr Calendar



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PostPosted: 14:36 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Re: Banned BNP campaign broadcast Reply with quote
fatpies wrote:
map wrote:
...and French Wink ...and I believe if you want to do worldwide business, Cantonese Very Happy Thumbs Up
Cantonese? Cantonese is actually a minority language/dialect, 55million speakers and diminishing, esp since HK area is now teaching Mandarin instead of Cantonese.

I sit corrected. Obviously I'm working from old info.
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covent.gardens
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PostPosted: 14:54 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I found the lies in the Labour one much more offensive, why didn't they ban that?
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 15:55 - 30 Apr 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
covent.gardens wrote:
I found the lies in the Labour one much more offensive, why didn't they ban that?


The system doesn't ban it's own propaganda.
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Tracey Suntan-King
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PostPosted: 12:43 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Until Nick Griffin popped up in the flesh (euw), I thought it was a spoof. I was waiting for the dog to pee up someone's leg!

If it's real, they've definitely overestimated their target audience. I doubt any BNP supporter has an attention span stretching to a full 4 mins and 59 seconds.

Edit : On the plus side though, it's always nice to see a 1967 Ford Corsair convertible. The chosen vehicle of child groomers. Who knew?
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Last edited by Tracey Suntan-King on 14:07 - 01 May 2014; edited 1 time in total
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 13:55 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
The only thing I found interesting was at the end where a woman mentions a school was offering to teach English as a foreign language. Just scaremongering though. English is the language of the world, after all
I don't have specific info on this. But wouldn't be suprised if its taken from a single case of x-Islamic school expelling English as its primary teaching language ''because Islam'' to stir up trouble.

However - its ironic after all the complaints people have about foreign families settling in the UK this is jumped upon by a lot of people. The same people that rant about kids not being taught/able to speak English. If you have, lets say; 30 x-istan foreign kids unable to speak English - which is more sensible, send them to a British school to learn nothing, require extra teaching/translation staff, or make a school for them to learn English alongside the current curriculum with a single multi languistic teacher for a period of time. [But hey now, that sounds like some sort of extremist teaching centre doesn't it Thinking is it safe...]

As for the BNP, its laughable they're still campaigning, they've already been outdone but their more smartly dressed courter-parts in UKIP. Better to head back to their roots of making conspiracy films and stirring hatred - that is if they have enough time after outlining their policies and intentions in every other area of politics, should they get in power Rolling Eyes . I'll happily take a corrupt, incompetant, self-serving government anyday over one driven by hate Thumbs Up

Last edited by -Matt- on 14:04 - 01 May 2014; edited 1 time in total
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 14:49 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
-Matt- wrote:
As for the BNP, its laughable they're still campaigning, they've already been outdone but their more smartly dressed courter-parts in UKIP.


Correct me if I'm wrong but UKIP and BNP are pretty opposite in terms of policies. BNP policies are mainly left-wing socialist ones, whereas UKIP are right-wing, conservative ones. The share a distaste for furrnurrs, but that is about where similarities end.
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 14:57 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Policies on paper perhaps - underlying core values, I doubt differ much. You don't hear either party focusing on much outside the spectrum of immigration, foreigners, working class rights, and anti-euro issues amongst the other usual recycled political babble 'real people, for the people' type nonsense.
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 20:34 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tracey Suntan-King wrote:
Until Nick Griffin popped up in the flesh (euw), I thought it was a spoof. I was waiting for the dog to pee up someone's leg!
If it's real, they've definitely overestimated their target audience. I doubt any BNP supporter has an attention span stretching to a full 4 mins and 59 seconds.
Edit : On the plus side though, it's always nice to see a 1967 Ford Corsair convertible. The chosen vehicle of child groomers. Who knew?


So the average BNP supporter is intellectually superior to the average Lib Dem or Green. Interesting analysis Cool

smegballs wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong but UKIP and BNP are pretty opposite in terms of policies. BNP policies are mainly left-wing socialist ones, whereas UKIP are right-wing, conservative ones. The share a distaste for furrnurrs, but that is about where similarities end.


It's a real elephant in the room, isn't it? Generally liberals and socialists are on the left, and so they like to categorise everyone they don't like as being on the right, regardless of how inaccurate the definition is. The Nazis and the BNP are prime examples, they are on the left by any sensible definition, they are as you say, essentially the complete opposite of UKIP and proper conservatives. The Nazis hated the Jews because they had all the money, and the socialists feel much the same way about the rich, not that this should be a surprise as Nazi means national socialist. The BNP are essentially old Labour with racism. UKIP is somewhere between conservatism and libertarianism, which definitely doesn't involve hating rich people, nor nationalising factories.

The modern left is essentially about free stuff, the right about not free stuff. The left tries to buy votes, UKIP is trying to attract voters by not bribing voters with their own money, an almost impossible task. The policies of the right are those of long term benefit for all, rather than short term benefit at the expense of someone else, something that doesn't sell well in a 3 minute sound bite.

-Matt- wrote:
Policies on paper perhaps - underlying core values, I doubt differ much. You don't hear either party focusing on much outside the spectrum of immigration, foreigners, working class rights, and anti-euro issues amongst the other usual recycled political babble 'real people, for the people' type nonsense.


Of course you don't hear it, because every TV interview starts off with the interviewer going on some kind of fishing expedition hoping to provoke some kind of racist comment. The first topic they being up is immigration, then they imply racism, then they go back to immigration again. Any attempt by the UKIP representative to talk about anything else is claimed to be avoiding the question of immigration asked by the interviewer.

UKIP on grammar schools
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZ6M5neGvRE

HS2, education, energy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCYso1Ntnkk

UKIP on Green energy (case in point on the interviewers)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TCXUQD4G88

UKIP on excessive taxation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gmHbwbo3hI

UKIP on Syria
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ayIPvUMvYw

Yup, just immigration eh? Rolling Eyes

Contrast this with Caroline Lucas who only ever wants to talk about green energy and nuclear weapons.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
UKIP is somewhere between conservatism and libertarianism, which definitely doesn't involve hating rich people, nor nationalising factories.


Which is the main reason I've got some time for UKIP, not due to their immigration policies, but because they are the nearest thing the UK has to a right-libertarian party.

I like the open migration in the EU thing, why can't the UK just sign mutual freedom-of-movement agreements with specific countries though? As opposed to the take-it-or-leave-it EU membership.
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 21:02 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
Of course you don't hear it, because every TV interview starts off with the interviewer going on some kind of fishing expedition hoping to provoke some kind of racist comment. The first topic they being up is immigration, then they imply racism, then they go back to immigration again. Any attempt by the UKIP representative to talk about anything else is claimed to be avoiding the question of immigration asked by the interviewer.
[Policies]
Yup, just immigration eh? Rolling Eyes

Going by their latest party political broadcast on TV they dont need anyone to fish. I'm not nescessarily crying "omg racist!" at everything they say, but as per todays broadcast, they seem to rely solely on euro/immigration scare-mongering and display little else policies wise on the face of their campaigning - doesn't really inspire confidence in a party hoping to run an entire country in every other respect.

Not saying I have much faith in the other parties running of the country either Laughing but the racially stirred undertone of some UKIP stuff I find pretty off putting personally.
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 22:34 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
-Matt- wrote:
Not saying I have much faith in the other parties running of the country either Laughing but the racially stirred undertone of some UKIP stuff I find pretty off putting personally.

That's understandable, but it's difficult to question any aspect of immigration or multi-culturalism in "respectable" middle-class society without feeling guilty that you might be racist. That's not healthy - the subject is too important to be turned into a taboo.
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 22:50 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
slowlydoesit wrote:

That's understandable, but it's difficult to question any aspect of immigration or multi-culturalism in "respectable" middle-class society without feeling guilty that you might be racist. That's not healthy - the subject is too important to be turned into a taboo.


Then you just use simple economics to explain to them, supply vs demand for workers for instance.

While you can argue all you like about the multiculturalism etc, you can't argue about the basic economic theory about it. UKIP did exactly this with their unlimited supply of cheap labour adverts.

Labour and Tory decided to call them racists because it was impossible to argue otherwise on the real points.
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 23:22 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
fatpies wrote:
While you can argue all you like about the multiculturalism etc, you can't argue about the basic economic theory about it. UKIP did exactly this with their unlimited supply of cheap labour adverts.

I think you may have slightly misunderstood my point. It's not that people disagree with the arguments, it's that for many - I'm thinking of the prototypical slightly left-of-centre middle classes who dominate the media and the professions - the issue isn't open to question. It's a bit like an atheist trying to pick holes in Christianity by suggesting that Jesus, logically, must have been human. Irrespective of the validity of the argument, believers are going to smile politely and ignore it.

In a similar way, immigration has become a topic that can't really be debated rationally any more. If you argue against it in any way, you're a reactionary right wing bigot. If you argue for it in any way, you're a politically correct bleeding heart leftie. Neither side listens to the other's arguments.
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 23:25 - 01 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I totally agree its an important topic and should remain debatable - from any viewpoint. But i dont think UKIP debate it - as with the BNP they try stir it up into anxiety/fear/hate by scaremongering around the same key points over and over.
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krarkol
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PostPosted: 03:06 - 02 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I believe there's a national campaign just to make UKIP look like tits.

If you constantly film and confront people, you'll eventually have footage of them doing or saying things they shouldn't because it was on the spot.

The other parties fear them IMO.

Cameron cocks up, its no biggie. Farage fucks up and suddenly "omg he's a racist bigot, do you really want this guy running our country?!"
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slowlydoesit
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PostPosted: 05:50 - 02 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
-Matt- wrote:
I totally agree its an important topic and should remain debatable - from any viewpoint. But i dont think UKIP debate it - as with the BNP they try stir it up into anxiety/fear/hate by scaremongering around the same key points over and over.

The way I look at it is that the refusal of the other parties to debate immigration seriously has created a "discussion vacuum", which allows more extreme views get air time they wouldn't normally get. I suspect that the UKIP contains both moderate and extreme views on immigration, but that it's the wilder views that the media chooses to report.

The media exists to sell stories and there is a general tendency for them to focus on any sensationalist material they can find and to ignore the boring, sensible stuff. Somebody else has already suggested that the UKIP do have views on a range of topics, but that those views seldom get the exposure because the media are too busy poking UKIP with a pointy stick in the hope of getting some outrageous comments. I suspect they're correct.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 08:43 - 02 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
krarkol wrote:
I believe there's a national campaign just to make UKIP look like tits.


Yeah the media seems to be in full damage-control mode.

It is a stupid way to deal with it. Lots of the "lefties/progressives" think that just by shouting "Racist!", "Fascist!" loud enough will be enough to shame them/shut them up. The problem is though that lots of people seem to have some genuine concerns that UKIP appear to at least be giving some attention to. If people genuinely feel concerned, trying to shame them out of those views without actually addressing the root of their problems is just going to foster more resentment and escalate tensions. Rather than opening a dialogue with them to discuss why they feel concerned in the first place and take measures to assuage their fears.
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orangepeeleo
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PostPosted: 10:02 - 02 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I thought this was a piss take until Nick Griffin pops up telling me how much I must have enjoyed the last 2 minutes!

The singing voice went right fucking through me!

Why are the BNP still bothering lol what a joke they are.

Unrelated though, I've enjoyed reading the comments on here about UKIP, I honestly don't know where I sit on the political spectrum at the moment and really need to educate myself on it.
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The Wobbly Orange
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PostPosted: 20:42 - 07 May 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I also have some time for UKIP. It's unlikely I would vote for them but I think British politics and is more balanced and is better for having a party with that standpoint in it.
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