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Celera
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PostPosted: 12:21 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Tyres advice Reply with quote

Morning all.

I've come to the point where I'm going to have to change my tyres for the first time and I'd really appreciate it if there are any pointers or advice you could give.

I've got a Z800 and most of my mileage, unfortunately, is motorway/main road commute. I'm after something that will have a decent amount of durability in them, but I don't want it to be something that doesn't allow me to enjoy tilting the bike in either. Possibly looking for conflicting things, I don't know.

So, is there anything in particular I should look out for, or any specific recommendations people can make?

Cheers
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Musketeer
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PostPosted: 12:32 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a non-sport road bike used for commuting mainly on motorways I would go for Michelin Pilot Road 4. Longevity is good, dual compound give you decent levels of grip, they are awesome in wet. Look no further.

No fun in buying a sport tyre that will square off in no time. PR4 has a very durable compound in the middle of its profile.

If your bike was a weekend toy for twisties (like mine) then I would say Pilot Power 3, Battlax S20 etc.
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Wonko The Sane
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PostPosted: 12:54 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've just put road pilot 3s on my ZZR for the intended same use. Happy with them so far and people claiming some decent millage out of them.
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stonesie
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PostPosted: 13:20 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have just put Metzeler Z8's on my Street Triple and they are a great tyre, I haven't noticed any lack of agility or feedback and they should last well. In fact they give me more confidence than the Rosso Corsas.
If you go to a tyre fitter that knows what they are doing then they should be able to get the slightly revised version with a duel compound rear, it doesn't look like I got that but I did get 6K out of the Rosso Corsas so should be up near 10 on these.

They were also rated better than the PR3 for wet grip by the Germans




The thing with Tyre threads is that everyone has a different opinion, stick with a big name sport touring tyre and it will do anything you ask of it, just NOT MAXXIS DIAMONDS!!! The one guy I know personally who tried them thought they were alright, until he rode in the wet then he was doing a burnout at most traffic lights to get rid of them.


Last edited by stonesie on 13:38 - 28 Oct 2014; edited 2 times in total
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iooi
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PostPosted: 13:24 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just swopped from Pr3's to Avon Storm 3d x-m.

Difference is like night and day..... Avon all the way. Thumbs Up
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Dibble
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PostPosted: 13:36 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

stonesie wrote:
I have just put Metzeler Z8's on my Street Triple and they are a great tyre, Germans


Done a couple of thousand miles mostly in the wet on my Z8s and they are amazing compared to the old Bridgestones. Only one slight moment which was accelerating on a bend(VFR800)
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weasley
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PostPosted: 13:54 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

-.. wrote:
I've just put road pilot 3s on my ZZR for the intended same use. Happy with them so far and people claiming some decent millage out of them.


Ditto (except for "ZZR" read "Thundercat"). Since the PR4 has been launched there are some good deals on PR3s.
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Bubblin77
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PostPosted: 14:57 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Go for the pr3 or 4's and you'll never look back, I have the same bike and it transformed the handling in the wet, plus last linger than the 2000 miles I had out the d214's it comes fitted with.
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 15:07 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

iooi wrote:
Just swopped from Pr3's to Avon Storm 3d x-m.

Difference is like night and day..... Avon all the way. Thumbs Up


What the...

What were your problems with the PR3?

OP, PR3 all the way.
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iooi
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PostPosted: 16:43 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paddy. wrote:


What the...

What were your problems with the PR3?


Far too vague feel, gave no confidence at all, as there was little feedback when they were starting to lose grip. Especially in the wet. I put that down to the softness caused by all the small slits in the tyres.

I know many people like them, (even Versys riders) but too me they were the worst tyres I have had on my Versys. And that includes
Pr2's Great
Avon Storms 2 pairs, says it all
Avon Distenza's (by far the best) SM front and std rear (10K miles)
Pr3's. (11k miles and still life left in both) Just could not stand the thought of having to ride over winter on them.
Now the new Avon storms. Only 200 miles on them, but the grip and feedback is great.
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Karl Bird
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PostPosted: 16:58 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Avon Storm 3d x-m Reply with quote

I have a Z750 and have gone from Pirelli Angel st which square off to quick for my liking, to Avon Storm 3d x-m and love them. Only been on for about 300 miles but the grip is good wet or dry.
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Fizzer Thou
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PostPosted: 19:23 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

A friend has PR3s on his '07 Blade and is able to keep up with me when we 'make good progress'.So I put a PR3 on the back just before I went to France and it gave a vague feedback as has been said above.Not in any way as positive as the Pirelli Diablo Corsa 3 that I normally have on the back wheel.But in the 2,200 miles that i rode around the Continent,it never gave me any cause for concern,even at ***mph on a certain three lane road going towards Millau Twisted Evil
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evoboy
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PostPosted: 20:03 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

iooi wrote:
Paddy. wrote:


What the...

What were your problems with the PR3?


Far too vague feel, gave no confidence at all, as there was little feedback when they were starting to lose grip. Especially in the wet. I put that down to the softness caused by all the small slits in the tyres.



Careful. I get slated for liking Avon's. Laughing

It depends on the OP's budget. If the majority of your mileage is motorway then the Avon Storms would be perfect. The Storm 2 can be had for quite cheap now.

I've been wanting to put the latest Sava Sportforce tyres on my ZRX11 to try, but after talking to them, they wont be re released for a while yet Sad . As the ZRX tends to eat sports rubber, I will most likely go for a set of Storms next. Good balance of mileage, wet grip and price.

Michelin's tend to have soft side wall's which do give a vague feel on the limit. Pilot Power's are the worst for it. The Road 2/3/4 arent quite as bad, but compared to other 'touring' rubber on the market, they do still feel alot softer and respond in a similar way to the Power's.

This is coming for a fitters point of view.
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 20:10 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Couldn't fault the Avon vipers I had on the GSXR, however for the money I'd have others. Thumbs Up
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Musketeer
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PostPosted: 20:16 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fizzer Thou wrote:
A friend has PR3s on his '07 Blade and is able to keep up with me when we 'make good progress'.So I put a PR3 on the back just before I went to France and it gave a vague feedback as has been said above.Not in any way as positive as the Pirelli Diablo Corsa 3 that I normally have on the back wheel.


I hate Pirellis. I had Diablos and Diablo Corsas and they were giving me a wooden feel.
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bikertomm
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PostPosted: 20:28 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

I too need tyres for my hornet early next year...

I would get PR3's but I don't ride in the wet at all.. would PR2's be good for more summer road?

Thumbs Up
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evoboy
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PostPosted: 20:46 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paddy. wrote:
Couldn't fault the Avon vipers I had on the GSXR, however for the money I'd have others. Thumbs Up


Vipers are at least 10 years old now. Laughing

The latest range has all the 'features' that all the other brands are offering.

Quote:
I too need tyres for my hornet early next year...

I would get PR3's but I don't ride in the wet at all.. would PR2's be good for more summer road?


(IMO)For dry weather the PR2 feels better than the PR3 or even the PR4. The more cuts that are put into the tread the more vague feel due to the cuts moving around on the surface of the road.

A sport bias tyre would be the best option, but at the sacrifice of overall mileage.
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 20:50 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

evoboy wrote:
Paddy. wrote:
Couldn't fault the Avon vipers I had on the GSXR, however for the money I'd have others. Thumbs Up


Vipers are at least 10 years old now. Laughing


Bought "new" in 2011, made (3210) so were still fairly decent when fitted. Couldn't complain, they weren't slippy at all and was around January time Thumbs Up
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evoboy
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PostPosted: 20:57 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paddy. wrote:


Bought "new" in 2011, made (3210) so were still fairly decent when fitted. Couldn't complain, they weren't slippy at all and was around January time Thumbs Up


I meant that the design is 10 years old. You can still buy Pilot Road 1's with a '14 year date on them....

Laughing
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Fizzer Thou
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PostPosted: 21:09 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

mJZ wrote:
Fizzer Thou wrote:
A friend has PR3s on his '07 Blade and is able to keep up with me when we 'make good progress'.So I put a PR3 on the back just before I went to France and it gave a vague feedback as has been said above.Not in any way as positive as the Pirelli Diablo Corsa 3 that I normally have on the back wheel.


I hate Pirellis. I had Diablos and Diablo Corsas and they were giving me a wooden feel.


I agree that when new,the Diablo that I had on the rear of the Exup gave very strange feedback.Once inflated to 41psi as specified,instead of the 39psi that I had it at initially,it was better but not what i was expecting.
Strangely,the Pirelli Dragon GT worked brilliantly on the Exup and the Dragon that I had on the back of the R1 all around Europe back in 2006 were both excellent,with no slips or slides wet or dry.

But more recently I bought some Pirelli Diablos in standard compound,ready for a ride around Europe this year.But just as I was about to fit the rear,I noticed that it was made in chinkyland,so they were exchanged for PR3s.I am now a lot more careful about where my tyres come from.Apparently,Metzeler road tyres are now made in chinkyland as well.Not sure which version Metzelers though.
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Pigeon
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PostPosted: 21:50 - 28 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

mJZ wrote:

I hate Pirellis. I had Diablos and Diablo Corsas and they were giving me a wooden feel.


Had Rosso Corsa's on the ST and for 5k miles I could never tell what the front was doing. Got to wales, did 1k miles going much faster than usual, really throwing the bike around, drifting between sweeping bends at 100+
A revelation, the tyres came alive. In the end I concluded that for the past 5k miles, I'd just not been going fast enough for them, hadn't got them up to temperature.
This was sort of confirmed when returning to local roads meant much slower riding and that loss of feeling.

Corsa's less than 1mm tread and squared off, so got PR4's fitted and they are stunning. The turn in is so sharp, quick and stable I'm barely leaning the bike compared to the Corsa's
Almost zero time to warm up, yet even though the tread is fairly cut, the tyres don't move around mid-corner or under hard acceleration.
Now have loads of confidence in both the front and rear.

In theory the dual compound should make them last longer. 5/6k miles form Corsa's, hoping for 8-10k from the PR4's

I am a noob so can't draw comparisons across lots of experience and branded new tyres will always feel better than ones that are squared off with 1mm of tread left. Proof will be in the next 5k mile pudding.
But the next tyres I buy for the SV will be PR4's, no hesitation!
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iooi
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PostPosted: 05:57 - 29 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

evoboy wrote:


Careful. I get slated for liking Avon's. Laughing .


If someone said they were fitting Avon RoadRiders to their bike I would as well......

The only resemblance they have to tyres is that they are round and black.....
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 14:04 - 29 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

OP. What you should take from this thread is that everybody has a different opinion on tyres, and that it might take you a few go's to find something you are comfortable with.

What I will add, and that nobody seems to have touched upon, is that the age of a tyre itself has a fair effect on the grip it offers, in the case of BT023's the difference is Night and... err... dusk?

I quite recently replaced a punctured rear BT023 with a part warn BT023 with very similar wear to my original. The part worn had lost it's black look though, it was a faded grey colour. When I got around to checking the date of the replacement it turns out it is over 10 years old!

In the dry I haven't noticed any difference in feel between the original fresh tyre and the old replacement, though visibly the rubber snots up a lot more on the fresh one than the old one which would suggest something is different, but, in a blind test I don't think I would know the difference.

In the wet the old rubber locks a lot easier and feels more vague. I find myself riding a lot more cautiously too, I can't seem to trust the tyre. I'm not entirely sure how much of it is what I am feeling through the bike and how much of it is placebo effect from just knowing that it is old rubber. Still, I can't help but feel that in a blind test I would know the difference.

If it was the front tyre I think I would have changed it now, just to feel safer if nothing else.
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weasley
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PostPosted: 14:17 - 29 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

c_dug wrote:
I quite recently replaced a punctured rear BT023 with a part warn BT023 with very similar wear to my original. The part worn had lost it's black look though, it was a faded grey colour. When I got around to checking the date of the replacement it turns out it is over 10 years old!


But the BT023 was only launched in 2010.... are you in the future? Shocked
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 14:19 - 29 Oct 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

bikertomm wrote:
I too need tyres for my hornet early next year...

I would get PR3's but I don't ride in the wet at all.. would PR2's be good for more summer road?

Thumbs Up


PR2s are a very good tyre. Wet weather grip I can't fault, and cos there are now the 3s and 4s, you can pick em up pretty cheap. Even if you don't ride in the wet much, I'd still recommend them. I get about 6k out of a rear, FZS1000, mostly dry weather fun riding, so some fairly hard usage in that figure. Can't comment on lots of motorway use though.
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