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Todays - What grinds my gears *ARCHIVE*

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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 09:39 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
duhawkz wrote:
For sure it won't help, but it's not the show stopper people keep making it out to be.

It would be for lots of buyers.
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duhawkz
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Joined: 03 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: 09:54 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
duhawkz wrote:
If you can't provide those then obviously you stand to loose your buyer which might cost you some money depending on how far along in the process, however what is more likely is that you will be made to purchase an indemnity policy to cover the issue.

It's going to cost him the price of having a new boiler installed by someone who's gas safe registered, be it when King20 is living in the property or when a potential buyer finds out and subsequently wants it sorting before completing the purchase.

If a buyer finds out that a replacement was done on the cheap by someone unqualified then it wouldn't be surprising if they then wanted to inspect stuff in more detail to find out if anything else has been done on the cheap.

Neutral


The surveys and searches cover that stuff, once the sale completes its very much a case of caveat emptor. If there were any legal recourse it would be with survevorys or the conveyancing solicitors not the vendor.

And as I said the buying solicitors would most probably require a indemnity policy in place to cover problems with the boiler.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 09:58 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Who's going to sell an indemnity policy when it's already known that the boiler needs replacing?
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duhawkz
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Joined: 03 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: 10:29 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
In my case it would have been arranged through my solicitors.

https://goodmove.co.uk/blog/indemnity-insurance-property/

I'm not suggesting in anyway that the lack of a gas safe certificate is acceptable, there literally no reason a legit gas fitter shouldn't be able to register the installation.

Just that its not the be all and end all when it comes to selling the property and there are bigger issues to worry about first.
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King29
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Joined: 18 Oct 2017
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PostPosted: 10:38 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
A100man wrote:
Basic safety checks pending your decision.

1) Turn off all appliances and watch your gas meter. Does it turn? Yes = bad

2) Check for leaks on Mr Singh's gas joints with soapy water or some forming kitcjhen spray - any bubbles? Yes= bad.

3) Get a CO meter with a numeric display showing accurarte ppm (or whatever appropriate units are) and check boiler area against normal background readings

4) Make your decision.


OK turned off all appliances, all I have is gas hob as cooker is electric and the boiler. There is no wheel on the meter as when we bought the house it had a Quantum meter fitted but a pay quarterly electric meter? I left everything off for an hour and the same amount of credit was showing on the meter.


Put soapy water around the joints, no bubbles so that's OK. I don't have a CO meter, when Singh fitted the boiler he went to the gas meter with a device and unscrewed something, the meter was fitted to the gas meter and he was happy with the results, what he was checking for I don't know how good the readings were, he seemed happy though.


I'll check the online sites for registration. All appears good so far.
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grr666
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Joined: 16 Jun 2014
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PostPosted: 10:45 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
duhawkz wrote:
For sure it won't help, but it's not the show stopper people keep making it out to be.

It would be for lots of buyers.

And it certainly is for landlords. I have to pay for a gas safety test annually (about £70-80) at each property and
all my insurances and whatnot are invalid unless I can prove I am doing this all by the book. I'm also liable to action and
inspections by the local authority if any of my properties are reported for dodgy gas or electrics for that matter. Electric safety
checks is once every 5 years or after a change to the electrics. That one is about £120 to 150 depending on the fuse board.
It's a costly business sometimes as the missing 3k from my bottom line after the last boiler I had to buy would confirm.
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Ste wrote: Avatars are fine, it's signatures that need turning off. Thumbs Up
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 10:53 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
duhawkz wrote:
In my case it would have been arranged through my solicitors.

https://goodmove.co.uk/blog/indemnity-insurance-property/

I'm not suggesting in anyway that the lack of a gas safe certificate is acceptable, there literally no reason a legit gas fitter shouldn't be able to register the installation.

Just that its not the be all and end all when it comes to selling the property and there are bigger issues to worry about first.

"If work has been done on the property but the building regulations paperwork is missing or incomplete, this policy covers the cost of any works that may be required to alter, correct or remove the unregulated work."

Nobody will give you a policy to cover something that's already a known problem. It's not work that may be required, it's work that will be required and that you could get plumbers to come out tomorrow and give quotes for.

Selling a policy for a few hundred that will pay out on something that is going to cost a few grand to put right would be crazy!! Laughing

"All indemnity policies contain a clause that the insurance will be invalidated if the existence of the problem is revealed to third parties."

You can't buy TPFT insurance for a bike that's already been stolen and you can't buy an indemnity policy for something that's already a known problem.
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A100man
World Chat Champion



Joined: 19 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 11:51 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
When I sold my house 18 months ago. The agents and i think the buyers solicitor tried to insist i had gas and electric inspections at my cost. Since I hadn't moved in nigh on 20 years I wasn't used to this kind of approach so naturally I said 'bugger off. If you want it doing pay yourself' (fortunately my last property was in quite high demand so I felt I could a call the shots to some extent). They sent an electrician to check that but I'm never sure what they did with the gas. I never had any certs form the boiler install in 1999.
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A100man
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Joined: 19 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 11:55 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
King29 wrote:
A100man wrote:
Basic safety checks pending your decision.

1) Turn off all appliances and watch your gas meter. Does it turn? Yes = bad

2) Check for leaks on Mr Singh's gas joints with soapy water or some forming kitcjhen spray - any bubbles? Yes= bad.

3) Get a CO meter with a numeric display showing accurarte ppm (or whatever appropriate units are) and check boiler area against normal background readings

4) Make your decision.


.. when Singh fitted the boiler he went to the gas meter with a device and unscrewed something, the meter was fitted to the gas meter and he was happy with the results, what he was checking for I don't know how good the readings were, he seemed happy though.


I'll check the online sites for registration. All appears good so far.


Gas flow on full chat is my guess. Singhy is untidy but has some knowledge I would suggest.

Digital CO meter here..
https://www.amazon.co.uk/SCONDA-Monoxide-Certified-Powered，10-years-operation/dp/B07JHWKPZP
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Then: Fizz, RS200, KL250, XJ550, Laverda Alpina, XJ600, FZS600
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bhinso
World Chat Champion



Joined: 21 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: 13:29 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sounds like a lot of work to me.
Did Mr Singh tell you he was gas safe but had 'forgotten his details'. If so you should get them as soon as possible, but do you have evidence of this conversation?
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 13:32 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
bhinso wrote:
Did Mr Singh tell you he was gas safe but had 'forgotten his details'. If so you should get them as soon as possible, but do you have evidence of this conversation?

King29 wrote:
Mr Singh has come back tonight and dropped these off, along with a long cardboard tube. I asked him if he was Corgi registered, he said "Mate don't worry, it is no problem for me".

King29 wrote:
Finished. Mr Singh did a cracking job. I asked him about being on the Gas register. "Yes mate" he said, "check under Singh".
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bhinso
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Joined: 21 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: 13:33 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mr Singh is laughing it up all the way to the Kermit.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 13:35 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Or to prison, possibly sharing a cell with Yaxley Lenon. Mr. Green
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duhawkz
World Chat Champion



Joined: 03 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: 13:43 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:

"If work has been done on the property but the building regulations paperwork is missing or incomplete, this policy covers the cost of any works that may be required to alter, correct or remove the unregulated work."

Nobody will give you a policy to cover something that's already a known problem. It's not work that may be required, it's work that will be required and that you could get plumbers to come out tomorrow and give quotes for.

Selling a policy for a few hundred that will pay out on something that is going to cost a few grand to put right would be crazy!! Laughing

"All indemnity policies contain a clause that the insurance will be invalidated if the existence of the problem is revealed to third parties."

You can't buy TPFT insurance for a bike that's already been stolen and you can't buy an indemnity policy for something that's already a known problem.


The issue is that the paper work is missing, there nothing to say singhpal has done an unsafe installation.

The remediation for the missing paperwork is to have building control inspect the work and sign or get a gas safe engineer to register the installation.

If building control condem it then the indemnity kicks in and tjat would cover the remedial work.
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"The guy is a worthless cunt and I honestly believe I would be a slightly happier person if he died." - Chris-Red
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 13:50 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Gas Safe plumbers cannot sign off someone else's work unless they want to go to prison.

Building control will not sign off a boiler that's been fitted by someone who isn't Gas Safe registered.

The only solution is for a Gas Safe plumber to remove it all and install one themselves.
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bhinso
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Joined: 21 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: 13:56 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Is Mr Singh aware of the huge amount of internet controversy he has caused?
Maybe he is on this forum and rides a motorbike (with no helmet of course).
Don't see why he shouldn't, £300 for a day's work sounds good going to me.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 14:07 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mr Singh isn't really called Mr Singh.
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Riejufixing
World Chat Champion



Joined: 24 Jun 2018
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PostPosted: 14:34 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
bhinso wrote:
Is Mr Singh aware of the huge amount of internet controversy he has caused?

There's an easy way to stop the controversy dead in its tracks; post his name and GS registration number.

Pfffffffffffffft! Shrug.
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duhawkz
World Chat Champion



Joined: 03 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: 14:50 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
Gas Safe plumbers cannot sign off someone else's work unless they want to go to prison.

Building control will not sign off a boiler that's been fitted by someone who isn't Gas Safe registered.

The only solution is for a Gas Safe plumber to remove it all and install one themselves.


https://www.samconveyancing.co.uk/news/conveyancing/gas-boiler-installation-do-you-need-a-building-control-certificate-5524


Quote:
What if the seller doesn't have a boiler certificate?
Although it is illegal to get a boiler installed by an engineer who is not Gas Safe registered and able to self certify, some sellers choose this route to save on cost or because they don't know it is illegal.

If the seller doesn't have a boiler certificate they have two options:

Retrospective Building Regulation Compliance Certificate - the seller can pay for a Gas Safe registered engineer to inspect the installation of the boiler and either; sign off the installation of the boiler, or make good the installation of the boiler and then sign off the installation. If there is an issue with the installation and the seller won't pay for the works to be addressed, the Gas Safe engineer will be forced to turn off the gas supply to the property/boiler, until the works are completed. The cost ranges from £200 to a complete reinstall.

Take out boiler indemnity insurance - the buyer can take out an indemnity policy that protects them against losses for the local authority enforcing the removal of the boiler. The indemnity policy doesn't cover for costs to install a new boiler. The cost for this indemnity insuranc e ranges from £180 to £500.

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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 15:11 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
The only way a safe gas person can sign it off is if they know that everything has been done correctly. As an example, they'll have no idea of the quality of the welds done by SinghPal so it is completely impossible for them to sign off someone else's work.

The Health Safety Executive says "It is not acceptable for a Gas Safe registered engineer to knowingly ‘sign-off’ gas work that has been carried out by a person who is not registered."

Stuff from conveyancing paralegal monkeys...

"If there is an issue with the installation"

There is an issue with the installation.

"The indemnity policy doesn't cover for costs to install a new boiler."

Seems a bit pointless then, the cost of removing the SinghPal boiler is fuck all compared to the cost of getting a new one installed. Laughing
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bhinso
World Chat Champion



Joined: 21 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: 15:47 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Riejufixing wrote:
There's an easy way to stop the controversy dead in its tracks; post his name and GS registration number.

Pfffffffffffffft! Shrug.


Is "check under Singh" not good enough for you?
Surely there's only one in there, easily identifiable.
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King29
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Oct 2017
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PostPosted: 16:27 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
I went out and bought a digital display CO2 meter today. I've filmed the results.

I bought this.

https://i.imgur.com/1jkIb84.jpg

Results.

Turn sound on.

https://imgur.com/a/FqBhBA1
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A100man
World Chat Champion



Joined: 19 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 17:07 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Leave it near appliance and check periodically.. for peace of mind if nothing else.

For fun you can park it next to the exahaust of your car/bike and check it's working!
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Now: A100, GT250A, XJ598, FZ750

Then: Fizz, RS200, KL250, XJ550, Laverda Alpina, XJ600, FZS600
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King29
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Oct 2017
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PostPosted: 17:18 - 20 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
A100man wrote:
Leave it near appliance and check periodically.. for peace of mind if nothing else.

For fun you can park it next to the exahaust of your car/bike and check it's working!



Yes in the video I put up it shows it working. The other 2 CO2 alarms I bought from the market 50p each, upon closer inspection had passed their expiry date.

Money wasted and they are going in the bin.


https://i.imgur.com/FU2XPs3.jpg[img]
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