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krockroc
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Joined: 14 Oct 2014
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PostPosted: 19:58 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Really dissapointed with a training school and … Reply with quote

… I'm just wandering what to do?

I complained to one of the owners (of the company) but after a week there's been no reply. I've just sent a complaint to the DVSA. I won't go into any detail because I'm not sure if this is the correct place to do so but I really don't want other potential learners to suffer the same treatment as me (at this particular school).

Is this the correct section to voice this sort of opinion? I'm new to this forum so I'm not sure? I was in the process of doing lessons for the full license but the whole situation with this particular school has put me off. The general gist of my complaint is that they were milking me for my money.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 20:24 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without naming the company (yet) just go through what happened.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 20:32 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is the correct place to do so. (Well, maybe "New Bikers", but the forum Nazis can't strictly complain as "General Bike Chat" is for all things bike!)
You will likely even receive some genuinely helpful advice... in amongst the stupid bullshit (and often hilarious) replies.

Only release as much detail as you wish, but try not to make up shit (it happens more often than you think) Smile
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The above post is most likely nonsensical.

I ride a Bandit 600... badly.
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InquisitionCh...
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PostPosted: 20:42 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where abouts are you based?

Maybe we can narrow it down ourselves Wink
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 20:42 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's back.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 20:45 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Go for it, we love a good spat.

Be aware that the moment you let slip who it is, Ste CaNsA someone will bring their attention to this thread. Truth is a defence to libel though, so just keep it factual or expressed in terms of your feelings and opinions.

It sounds like you're going about it the right way, although if you've paid up front then good luck getting anything back from them.
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 21:38 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:
This is the correct place to do so. (Well, maybe "New Bikers", but the forum Nazis can't strictly complain as "General Bike Chat" is for all things bike!)
You will likely even receive some genuinely helpful advice... in amongst the stupid bullshit (and often hilarious) replies.

Only release as much detail as you wish, but try not to make up shit (it happens more often than you think) Smile


A few of the points:
Before the first lesson:
I was told over the phone that I'd be on the 125cc motorbike for approx. 30 minutes due to doing over 1000 miles on my own 125cc. I ended up spending the whole 3.5 hour on the 125cc.

First lesson:
I was paired with (IMO) a very inexperienced rider and to be honest I felt concerned throughout the whole session for his safety.

We did a lot of slow manoeuvre work. I didn’t put my foot down once. I performed about 20 consecutive u-turns on a very narrow road. The instructor seemed very happy with the way I performed the u-turns. I was told that I controlled the motorbike correctly. The other guy had a massive problem with u-turns.

At the end of the lesson we were de-briefed. The instructor told me I was now ready to move up onto a 600cc motorbike in my next lesson. The instructor told the other person that he needed to do a repeat lesson of what we had just done to gain more experience.

In general the whole lesson felt like my CBT course again (which I did at a another school). I moved house in the meantime and this school is closer to my new house.

Second lesson:
Again, I was paired with a much less experienced rider.

The guy that I was paired with told me (at the start of the lesson) that this was the second time he had been on a geared motorbike. The first time being his CBT (which he only took recently). He was upgraded to a 600cc bike after a couple of runs up and down the training centre. This contradicted my treatment in the first lesson.

We spent pretty much the whole lesson doing only u-turns and figure of eights.

Every 20-30 minutes we were told that we had to have a break to let the clutch on the motorbike cool down. This conveniently coincided with the instructor smoking a cigarette for about 10 minutes each time.

Although I could do the u-turns perfectly using the methods I was assessed using in the first lesson. I was told I needed to re-learn the way I drive and only use his technique which is using revs just under 4000. There was no mention of this in the first lesson.

Some of you may say that it's more difficult on the bigger bike but I found it a lot easier to ride than my own 125cc which I've become thoroughly accustomed to. I'm quite a heavy guy (105kg) because I do strength training so I found it a lot easier to balance on the heavier bike. It felt less top heavy due to my weight if that makes sense?

In general, the other person I was paired with was given a lot more time doing the manoeuvres because he seemed less experienced. A lot of time time I just sat there watching.

And to top it all of the instructor swore at us throughout the lesson.

After the second lesson:
I contacted one of the owners of the firm directly. I sent my complaint via email. He assured me that they take all complaints seriously. He copied me in on an email that he sent to the two instructors involved and asked them for a written statement. I can't believe he just forwarded my complaint letter (word for word) to them and copied me in?

Hopefully you get the gist of things? My next lesson was due to be a mock Mod 1 and they wanted me to book in another 3.5 hour lesson before this. I wasn't happy with what we covered in seven hours (£250).

It's been over a week and I've heard nothing. I don't mind if I get flamed here. I'm just a newbie rider trying to get my full license.

I'm interested in peoples opinion on the above?


Last edited by krockroc on 21:58 - 18 Nov 2014; edited 2 times in total
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 21:44 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ariel Badger wrote:
It's back.


I know the thread you're talking about. The above was my experience and in my opinion it wasn't a very good one.
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 21:46 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
Be aware that the moment you let slip who it is, Ste CaNsA someone will bring their attention to this thread. Truth is a defence to libel though, so just keep it factual or expressed in terms of your feelings and opinions.


I haven't got the time to sit and think about everything I write so hopefully what I've written is ok? The company are aware of me posting on this board. I don't mind though because everything I've said is the truth. There were also other problems but I've stuck to the ones that I feel comfortable mentioning.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 21:56 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

A sadly typical story. Far too many foul mouthed slackers out there masquerading as instructors. Sad

No need to put up with it though. Sack them off, find another school, an independent instructor (still a few around) or ultimately you can buy a bike and DIY it. Not easily, but it is an option.
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dydey90
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PostPosted: 21:58 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like you had some bad luck in the first lesson, they couldn't really stick one of you on a 600 while the other was struggling, so you were held back purely because of the other guy.

They will do as much manoeuvres as possible, as the U-turn is the most common cause for mod 1 failure and it's easy for the instructor, who just stands and watches.
I'm not sure why the instructor forced you to change your technique though. Either he's of the opinion that his way is the only way, or he thought you were a bit wobbly.

With the swearing thing, you'll find that most, if not all instructors are a rough-and-ready type. You wouldn't expect to see them in a jazz lounge. They're not doing it to offend, intimidate or insult you, it's just what they're used to.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 22:00 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you give us a general idea of your location, perhaps someone can recommend a good local school or instructor.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 22:05 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
A sadly typical story. Far too many foul mouthed slackers out there masquerading as instructors. Sad


As I've read in many threads on these forums about passing the mod 1 and 2 exams. In my opinion it's all about building up the riders confidence. And, correct me if I'm wrong, but the last thing you need is an instructor constantly swearing at you telling you how badly you're doing the whole lesson.


Last edited by krockroc on 22:18 - 18 Nov 2014; edited 1 time in total
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 22:08 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

krockroc wrote:
In general, the other person I was paired with was given a lot more time doing the manoeuvres because he seemed less experienced. A lot of time time I just sat there watching.


I don't understand why you were sat there doing nothing, are you saying you had to share the bike?
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 22:10 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

BodyGuard wrote:
I would have took my custom elsewhere the moment I was told I would be stuck on my own 125 for 30 minutes.


I had paid £250 by this point. They wanted the whole lot up front but after taking some advice on this forum I paid only half. I'm glad I've only lost that amount. The main thing is that I've got loads of friends who are in the same position as me who are looking for a good school to do their CBT, Mod 1&2, etc. Obviously they lose out in this way. Once I started riding my 125 all my mates suddenly decided to take up biking Smile

BodyGuard wrote:
If you give us a general idea of your location, perhaps someone can recommend a good local school or instructor.


I moved to North London.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 22:13 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

krockroc wrote:
Ariel Badger wrote:
It's back.


I know the thread you're talking about. The above was my experience and in my opinion it wasn't a very good one.

I was referring to a poster who had not used BCF for some time, SAS wannabe and the finest welder of engine sprockets this side of Grimsby.
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 22:15 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

ScaredyCat wrote:
I don't understand why you were sat there doing nothing, are you saying you had to share the bike?


I had to watch the other guy struggling. Even when I was, say, doing the figure of eight maneuver without putting my foot down he'd stop me because I wasn't looking in the right direction. Apparently I had looked down at the ground for a second. So, was told to stop and wait for the other guy to have his turn again. I was also stopped because my revving wasn't loud enough, again, I was doing the figure of eight, without putting my foot down but it wasn't the way he wanted me to do it. I could go on and on.
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 22:15 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you not get one to one on a DAS?
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 22:27 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ariel Badger wrote:
Do you not get one to one on a DAS?


It wasn't DAS. I passed my CBT and then wanted to ride a 125 for a few months to gain as much experience on the road (in real life situations) as possible to boost my confidence. I know it's not massive but I had done over 1k prior to my first lesson. The course I booked was supposed to be 4 x 3.5 hour lessons. The third lesson was supposed to be 3.5 hour lesson doing a mock Mod 1 exam.
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Barnoe
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PostPosted: 22:28 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sad to hear your story.
Learning to ride should be exciting and a pleasure.

As others have said, try another bike school.
If you can, ask around and get someone to recommend someone.

good luck, let us know how you get on Smile
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krockroc
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PostPosted: 22:32 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

dydey90 wrote:
With the swearing thing, you'll find that most, if not all instructors are a rough-and-ready type. You wouldn't expect to see them in a jazz lounge. They're not doing it to offend, intimidate or insult you, it's just what they're used to.


I'm old (and hopefully wise) enough to know the difference between banter and using it to knock someone's confidence levels. The sort of stuff he was going on about made me feel uncomfortable.
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 22:37 - 18 Nov 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just as a side note, I recently passed my Direct Access with Newcastle Rider Training, good fellas, teach in a relaxed piss takey jokey way, good for the terminally stubborn such as myself.
However my first hour was an assessment ride on my 125, I didn't complain, should I have?... maybe.
In all fairness to them though, I preferred it that way, they picked up on a fair few problems I have developed over 4 years riding a tiddler, and helped me to correct them before the test.

I would also add that whilst certainly commonplace, the whole 2 learner pairing experience sucks, the Instructor invariably has more 'work' to do on the noob, so the more experienced learners don't get as fair a share IMO.

Regardless, sounds like you dealt with some dicks, stopping for a drink of water, or even a piss is one thing, but paying for him to smoke a tab? not cool. Sad
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The above post is most likely nonsensical.

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Last edited by Commuter_Tim on 23:25 - 18 Nov 2014; edited 5 times in total
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