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Ceramic Coating my exhaust

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Northern Monkey
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PostPosted: 15:51 - 15 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
https://www.hormelfoods.com/~/media/HormelFoods/Images/Brands/Product%20Shots/High%20Res%20Product%20Shots/spam-family-of-products.ashx
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 15:59 - 15 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alans Snackbar wrote:
https://www.hormelfoods.com/~/media/HormelFoods/Images/Brands/Product%20Shots/High%20Res%20Product%20Shots/spam-family-of-products.ashx


I'm looking at that serving suggestion and really thinking I'd rather, if I had to eat spam, have it cold in a sandwich not heated, and not with cheese.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 16:52 - 15 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
www.performance1coatings.com strangled my kitten and then raped its still warm body.

Truth.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 17:12 - 15 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
I've friends that have used zircotec on car exhaust manifolds and are very happy with their stuff. Expensive but they have the best reputation. I'm not sure they'd be much benefit on a bike exhaust though....
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 18:29 - 15 May 2015    Post subject: Re: Ceramic Coating my exhaust Reply with quote
motormad1 wrote:
I have had lots of conversations with people recently about the benefits of ceramic coating my exhaust,...


What did your mom and dad say? Razz
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motormad1
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PostPosted: 07:40 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:
I've friends that have used zircotec on car exhaust manifolds and are very happy with their stuff. Expensive but they have the best reputation. I'm not sure they'd be much benefit on a bike exhaust though....


Thank you.

I have spoken with them, and they are expensive in comparison, but maybe it is better to pay the extra and get something that will last. They offer a 3 year warranty where as Performance 1 only offer a 1 year warranty.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 11:41 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Why would you want a bike exhaust ceramic coated?
Cars do it on the exhaust manifold to reduce the engine bay temp/inlet charge temp (especially on turbo motors), but I just cannot see any benefit on a bike.
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gbrand42
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PostPosted: 18:46 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Cover up badly discoloured stainless down pipes maybe?
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 19:05 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:
Why would you want a bike exhaust ceramic coated?
Cars do it on the exhaust manifold to reduce the engine bay temp/inlet charge temp (especially on turbo motors), but I just cannot see any benefit on a bike.


Some very high performance bike engines have it. Somewhat popular in the US drag racing/landspeed community.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 20:21 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pete. wrote:
Some very high performance bike engines have it. Somewhat popular in the US drag racing/landspeed community.


If you're running a race bike then the cost to benefit (part of a BHP?)may be worthwhile but not on a road bike. As for high performance bikes using it, it's bling thing.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 20:28 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
How durable is it? I mean, can gravel damage it as easily as I think it could? Thinking
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 20:51 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:
Pete. wrote:
Some very high performance bike engines have it. Somewhat popular in the US drag racing/landspeed community.


If you're running a race bike then the cost to benefit (part of a BHP?)may be worthwhile but not on a road bike. As for high performance bikes using it, it's bling thing.


You don't coat internal engine parts in the name of bling.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 22:26 - 18 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pete. wrote:
You don't coat internal engine parts in the name of bling.


The thread was about coating the exhaust.
You do coat the exhaust on a road bike in the name of bling.

Ceramic topped pistons are a very expensive benefit in any engine but not exhausts.
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Last edited by Alpineandy on 08:56 - 20 May 2015; edited 1 time in total
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 05:01 - 19 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:
Pete. wrote:
You don't coat internal engine parts in the name of bling.


The thread was about coating the exhaust.
You do coat the exhaust on a bike in the name of bling.

Ceramic topped pistons are a very expensive benefit in any engine but not exhausts.


Landspeed and drag bikes have the exhaust headers coated to increase exhaust gas energy, all in the name of performance. These guys don't care about bling so much as efficiency.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 09:11 - 19 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pete. wrote:
Landspeed and drag bikes have the exhaust headers coated to increase exhaust gas energy, all in the name of performance. These guys don't care about bling so much as efficiency.


I repeat:
If you're running a race bike then the cost to benefit (part of a BHP?) may be worthwhile but not on a road bike.

It makes such a small difference that no one in their right mind would think it's a cost effective benefit for the ROAD!
The difference in Exhaust exit speed is tiny but on a race bike all the 'Tiny' benefits add up.
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Northern Monkey
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PostPosted: 15:49 - 19 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pete. wrote:


Landspeed and drag bikes have the exhaust headers coated to increase exhaust gas energy, all in the name of performance. These guys don't care about bling so much as efficiency.


They will also be turbocharged. You need to maintain the gas energy prior to the turbine stage. Once the gas has passed the turbo, there is no need to maintain the pressure energy.

Post turbo stage, holding the heat in the gas will increase the back pressure.

There is no benefit in an NA engine. (Other than it looks pretty)
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 00:00 - 23 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Northern Monkey wrote:
There is no benefit in an NA engine. (Other than it looks pretty)


There is a tiny 'scavenge' benefit, but it is tiny. Certainly not enough for an engineer to worry about unless it was a real race engine.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 06:11 - 23 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:
t I just cannot see any benefit on a bike.


Alpineandy wrote:
There is a tiny 'scavenge' benefit


Thinking Thinking Thinking
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Northern Monkey
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PostPosted: 08:12 - 23 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:
Northern Monkey wrote:
There is no benefit in an NA engine. (Other than it looks pretty)


There is a tiny 'scavenge' benefit, but it is tiny. Certainly not enough for an engineer to worry about unless it was a real race engine.


Can you define a 'scavenge' benefit?
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 17:57 - 24 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pete. wrote:
Thinking Thinking Thinking


If the theory is correct, the tiny benefit isn't worth it on a NA engine unless you're a racer (not even certain it's worthwhile then) and you can 'Thinking' about it as much as you want to but if you did decide to do it then you'd only prove you have more money than sense.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 18:00 - 24 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Northern Monkey wrote:
Can you define a 'scavenge' benefit?


The theory is that the hot gas moves out of the cylinder quicker and drags more through/out. IMO I doubt it would have any measurable effect on anything other than an out and out race engine.
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Northern Monkey
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PostPosted: 21:59 - 24 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:
Northern Monkey wrote:
Can you define a 'scavenge' benefit?


The theory is that the hot gas moves out of the cylinder quicker and drags more through/out. IMO I doubt it would have any measurable effect on anything other than an out and out race engine.


It's not a theory I've come across before, but then it's over 15 years since I've had to do any calculations related to compressible fluid flow.

Coating the inside of a pipe would decrease the roughness ratio, and affect the Reynolds number which described a flow, but reducing the temperature of the gas would cause a reduction in flow velocity for a give mass flow rate, reducing the pressure drop over a given distance.

I still can't see how coating the outside of the pipe would make any positive difference on a non turbocharged system other than making it look pretty.

I'd be interested to be proved wrong though
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 23:25 - 24 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alpineandy wrote:

The theory is that the hot gas moves out of the cylinder quicker and drags more through/out. IMO I doubt it would have any measurable effect on anything other than an out and out race engine.


What did you think I meant by 'very high performance' - an R1 with a pipe and powercommander? People who want 2000hp/tonne from their bikes at 5000ft elevation don't use ceramic coatings for bling points.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 23:37 - 24 May 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Northern Monkey wrote:
It's not a theory I've come across before, but then it's over 15 years since I've had to do any calculations related to compressible fluid flow.


The guy that explained it to me in simple terms referred to it as something like the 'bernelli effect'. The idea being that keeping the gas hot for a calculated distance (and is then cooled in an enlarged pipe) allows the pressure wave speed and length to be tuned. If it's done correctly then it supposedly pulls out all the expired charge and a calculated amount of inlet charge. However he also said that everything had to be perfect for the numbers to work at all, so a full race engine BUT running at a constant revs or else the calcs don't really work. So in his opinion (which becomes mine by lack of knowledge otherwise!) it wasn't worth wasting the ink used to calculate the numbers. Confused
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