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Bridgestone MKII RS200

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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 17:49 - 26 Jul 2015    Post subject: Bridgestone MKII RS200 Reply with quote

7 years ago i bought and rebuilt a mini buffalo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qKgW1xoYxw
which turned out to have a bridgestone 60cc engine fitted (rotary valve 2 stroke single)

wtf bridgestone as in the tyres guys??? yep. duning the 60's and 70's they made and competed very sucessfully with motorbikes

read the history and demise of the bike division here
http://www.bridgestonemotorcycle.com/index2.html


anyway its taken me 8 years to find another bridgestone.

ive now moved to scotland and managed to find a mkII rs that had been imported from the states along with a bunch of rd350's the guy who bought it over had no interest in it so sold it to me,


pics
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0004%20Large_zpsw1v94xv8.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0003%20Large_zpsxvbok71p.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0001%20Large_zpsdsnprfia.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0010%20Large_zpsd22de0n5.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0009%20Large_zpskld4xwsk.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0007%20Large_zpscbthhvjp.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0005%20Large_zpsomoyqcrn.jpg


so the good bits are its pretty much complete,
its only done 2900 miles.
paint is ok and has a cool patina
frame is in excellent condition

bad bits are, its been sitting for 40 odd years
its seized solid,
all the rubber bits are perished or missing front brake lever is busted,


my plan is to get it running, by doing as much of a rebuild that is necessary,
i wont be touching the paint, as i dont want a show bike,
replace any missing bits, get it registered over here in scotland and ride it.


im guessing im going to need:
rings for both cylinders
top and bottom bearings,
new conrods, and new crank pins,
piston pins,
all new internal bearings
new chain and sprockets,
rubber carb boots (carb to airbox)
tanks rubber knee pads,
new tyres,
and probably a rebore/re-chome depending on barrel type


i'll post photos as things happen (which may be a while, in the midst of moving house at the moment)
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Last edited by hmmmnz on 09:51 - 31 Aug 2015; edited 1 time in total
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Just_James
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PostPosted: 18:21 - 26 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd never even heard of any Bridgestone bike before! Was expecting to see an RS200 rally car with some fancy tyres on it Laughing

How easily will you get parts for it?

Good luck with it and will be watching with interest Thumbs Up
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bypass2
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PostPosted: 20:05 - 26 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I Like it and the mini bike. I can remember Brigdestone motor bikes. think they built bikes early to mid sixties till about 74. they made a good selection of bikes ranging from 50cc to 350cc all two strokes. nice bikes. good luck with the rebiuld
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 20:26 - 26 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

parts arn't too bad, but will all have to be ordered out of the states,
1 guy pretty much bought up all the spares from all the dealerships from around the states, then over seas, then bridgestone themselves sent him everything they had still sitting in a warehouse.

but parts are going to be expensive.
ill use bridgestone parts where i have to, but try to find alternative parts
where i can.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 20:50 - 26 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool project!

Will watch with interest to see how you get on with this. I've seen a couple of Bridgestone bikes at classic shows and in magazines, and they had a great reputation for very high build quality compared to the rival Japanese bikes.

They remind me of the early 250-350 Avenger/Samurai Kawasaki's with their disc valve induction, and they were noted for having potent engines and unmatched performance for the time.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 22:40 - 26 Jul 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
50 SPORT

ENGINE: Rotary valve, 2 stroke. Bore and stroke—39 x 42 mm. Transmission—4 speed, constant mesh, rotary. Compression ratio— 6.6:1. HP—4.9 @ 8500 rpm. Maximum torque— 0.45 KG-M @ 7500 rpm.

PERFORMANCE: Maximum speed—50 mph. Climbing ability—1:3.5. Minimum turn radius—5.9'. Fuel capacity—1.72 gal.
BRIDGESTONE 50

ENGINE: 2 stroke, forced air cooled. Bore and stroke—40 x 39 mm. Compression ratio— 6.5:1. HP— 4.2 @ 7200 rpm. PERFORMANCE: Maximum speed—45 mph. Optimum fuel consumption—over 200 mpg. Maximum turn radius—5.8'.


45mph and 200mpg from a 50cc stroker **Impressed**
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 19:59 - 02 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

right, update time.
basically moved house so now have a garage and a place to work on the bike, Very Happy
has been a bit of a mission getting settled in, but been worth it,

the garage
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0020%20Large_zpsunq7eiv0.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0021%20Large_zpsp3zlaqr6.jpg


first off had to remove the carbs etc from the side of the engine,
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0353%20Large_zpsk4btppgh.jpg

all the wiring, hoses, foot rests seat tank etc, so i could unbolt the engine and pull it from the frame,

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0354%20Large_zpsphage0az.jpg
not a too hard of a job,

the chain was stuck pretty solid to the front sprocket
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0355%20Large_zpsqnecbtxw.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0356%20Large_zpsbfw0zxyk.jpg

next up was to pull the heads which was super easy,
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0358%20Large_zpswkkw6dh7.jpg

next was barrels.
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0359%20Large_zps3axewlxy.jpg

not so easy. managed to pull the right hand one no bother, the rings and piston were in pretty good nick, and if it was cast iron bores i'd have been happy with the barrel as well,
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0360%20Large_zpsryoksybi.jpg

the left hand cylinder wasn't going anywhere, so left it for a time until i could get to the nut on the crankshaft and try and brute force it out.

pull the clutch side case, a combo of black sludge and water came out to reval the mess that is the clutch,
all new friction and steel plates are going to be needed
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0361%20Large_zps5qxpt2m8.jpg

pulled the basket and all the associated cogs etc, a bit of rust on some, but easily save-able. then into the rotary valve,

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0362%20Large_zpsdji0x9yf.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0364%20Large_zps86l5o4p7.jpg
everything is nicely marked so you can't really cock up the timing if you pay a wee bit of attention

rinse and repeat on the oil pump side.
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0365%20Large_zpsuzpseejb.jpg
you probably noticed the alternator is out, that fucker is also seized solid and will also need new bearings.

yep much the same
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/bridgestone%20200/IMAG0366%20Large_zps2fi8k45p.jpg


so that pretty much it. i did get the other piston out. piston is pretty much done for, and rings are poked, but i sort of thought it was always going to be the case.

crank is feeling really good, so hopefully i dont have to spend $800 usd on a new crankshaft, its probably going to cost me around that for all the bearings, pistons, rings, seals, gaskets, etc etc

tomorrow night hopefully split the cases....
may be
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 23:16 - 05 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

well all tell and no show for this post.
pics in the next post.....

anyway, split the crank cases, and the news is pretty damn good.
all 3 crank bearings are in good nick with no play, the conrods and bottom end bearings are good, all the gearbox and bearings are good.
only the selector forks and the selector barrel are stuck at the moment.

even the center seal is good, (was my secret dread, all good bearings but fucked seal, which would have meant spliting the crank.)

so thankfully that'll all save me around £500-600
ill still have to spend around 250quid a side on barrel re-plating, pistons, rings and top end bearings, plus another 100 on intake rubbers
plus another 100 on clutch parts. and atleast another 100 on gaskets seals and other random bits,


get a vintage 2 stroke they said, cheap fun ... aha Very Happy
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 23:02 - 08 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

right where was i.
so cases got split,

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0370%20Large_zpswydf9ib2.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0371%20Large_zpsv6yjwxiy.jpg
crank got pulled,

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0373%20Large_zpsoowftpiy.jpg
and onto the gearbox,
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0374%20Large_zpsrur4u6nb.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0375%20Large_zpsi1akughh.jpg

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0376%20Large_zps0hwjmrwy.jpg


the selector dogs had partially welded themselves to the selector shaft and i couldn't free it to pull the shaft free,
but with a combo of blow torch and almost a can of penetrating spray and a few dozen taps from a hammer i managed to get all the dogs moving.
so the shaft came out,
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0372%20Large_zpsbvitdje6.jpg
and with a bit of wet and dry and oil i cleaned up the shaft to a nice smoothish and more importantly re-useable condition.

i found this bit of metal in the bottom of the gearbox...
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0377%20Large_zpsic3srxd9.jpg
hmmm,
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0378%20Large_zps2d51gwp5.jpg

oh so it looks like i have to buy a dog, not to worry, first broken thing ive found,

gearbox bearing are a bit notchy so i'll replace them, and have decide to replace to 2 outer crank bearings as well, just because.


cases are off to a mate to get sonic cleaned, and get rid of the 40 year old shite on them.

next up, carbs and alternator, then to spend a stupid amount of money on almost impossible to find parts
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 18:22 - 09 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you sure on changing crank-outers?
Worth a thunk; what you got now is a matched set, evenly worn.
Was always taught ALWAYS swap bearings on a shaft, especially a crank-shaft, as a 'set'; reason given being; Swap the outers, for new, they are less worn, so the center bearing wont be pulling its weight, and crank can 'flex' in the play between them. Maybe negligible, but, offers opportunity for flexure you wouldn't otherwise get, that could make things worse than leaving them alone.

Add on Ed:- Was old-boy, who was most critical of the practice; used to do his own cranks.. amazing to watch him; setting one up in a pair of V-blocks on the bench, spinning it, and smacking the shit out of it with a copper hammer till it was true by eye, then putting a dti on it! A fan of AJS/Matchless singles, he hated 'twins' with a passion; he bashed a couple of two-stroke cranks for me, that he loathed almost as much! When he caught me wheeling my RD250, out the shed opposite his, evil on both counts, a twin AND a two-stroke, I got a tirade of abuse of how he NEVER wanted to see a part of that bike in his workshop, least of all the crank! I think he had got fed up with local 'lads' hoping for miricles... (Though I also later learned my bike had been a repeat visitor, and spend much time there with variouse components spread about the benches!) but, same 'lore' was repeated later, among the 'Clubbies' running RD's & TZ's and the ilk, all concerned over crank-life when tuned.
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Last edited by Teflon-Mike on 04:20 - 10 Aug 2015; edited 1 time in total
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 22:13 - 09 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok then sold,
not changing perfectly good crank bearings Very Happy


pulled the gummy carbs apart today, 40 years of vanish, pretty interesting stuff, pics later on that

also need a new alternator its rusted to buggery, and the lobe that opens the points is shagged, pretty cheap in the grand scheme of things.

pics on that later too :d
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 23:07 - 10 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

gummy carbs ftw... may be not
this is what 40 year old petrol turns into

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0379%20Medium_zpsi7t0ojbv.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0380%20Medium_zps46ywemxq.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0381%20Medium_zpsfzrkqjtr.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0382%20Medium_zpsma9pbole.jpg
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Last edited by hmmmnz on 05:55 - 20 Aug 2015; edited 1 time in total
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 18:08 - 11 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is an excellent thread, and I'm really liking the big sturdy looking bottom end construction of the Bridgestone twin, with nice generous sized ball bearings on all the shafts, and big crank webs etc. I can understand from the pics why Bridgestone always seemed to have a reputation for making tough motors with better than normal Jap build quality and detail.

One thing I'm very surprised about however is when you said all the crank seals are still ok after all that time standing?

I know it's a more recently thought of discussion point, but there are many out there that say 2stroke crank seals are nearly always fucked after a few years of standing still unused?

How did you check them, just out of interest? I suppose there is no way of standing the crank up with a plastic cone full of oil taped around the crank seals to check for leakage past the seals?
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 19:14 - 11 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
How did you check them, just out of interest? I suppose there is no way of standing the crank up with a plastic cone full of oil taped around the crank seals to check for leakage past the seals?


You could build up the bottom end then fill one side with light oil/paraffin. Watch for the level dropping.

hmmmz - what are you going to use on the carbs? Neat Toluene?
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 22:47 - 11 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

carbs : ultra sonic cleaner, and then go from there.

im super surprised about the seals as well. ill change out the outside seals, but leave the inner at this stage, if i have to change it at a later date, then i will,
now i have internet again (living in a mobile dead zone and new house means i only just got internet again today)
ill upload more pics and show the seals.
saying that the little kh125 i rebuild a couple of years ago had been sitting for 30 years, i didnt touch the bottom end on that, just new barrel, piston rings and top end bearing, and it fired up second kick,
and is still being used daily by a mate with no issues
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 05:52 - 17 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

most of the stuff is done being unltra sonicly cleaned,
i think im going to have to buy one, bloody awesome.

crank cases.
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0402%20Large_zps0vznuxpy.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0403%20Large_zpsdf3lbe58.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0404%20Large_zps3ovbicps.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0405%20Large_zpsrrdaqjmy.jpg

and carbs.
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0406%20Large_zpscbeij3g9.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g257/hmmmnz/IMAG0407%20Large_zpshsx2kln5.jpg

the floats need a bit of work, as they were floating Laughing and couldnt be done properly.
not sure why my mate dint just weigh them down, but im not going to look a gift horse in the mouth.

now its really time for the moths to hop out of my wallet, and start ordering shit Very Happy Crying or Very sad
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 19:03 - 17 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's lots of transfer port collector area too in those cases. That should be a right bloody flyer for a 200cc when it's back together that's for sure! Thumbs Up

Dammit, I bloody want a Bridgestone twin now too! Laughing
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 22:56 - 17 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy
pretty hard to find over here.
the 350 would be the one to have, but the 175 is the one which had the biggest production run, so spares are more easily available.
the 200 is almost identical barring the top end

ordered all the seals and bearings tonight.
im having trouble finding a shifter fork to replace the broken one,
i was hoping for a second hand part, but looks like im going to have to "fork" out for n.o.s. .... bugger,


so my list of bits to get are

* clutch basket / steels and fibre plates (£60-100)
* pistons, rings, pins and clips, (2 sets) (£200)
* barrels, replated or replaced (£130 per barrel to replate) (£160 for new barrel)
* tank rubber knee pads (£75)
* intake rubbers (£110)
* gasket set (£90)
* brake lever (£15)
* brake shoes (£ unobtainable!! )
* gear change dog (£unknown )
* carb rebuild kit (£ unknown)
* alternator (£100)

so atleast £1k to spend Sad

first up will be to get the engine internals. as they will hold up any sort of progress, and i'd like to get the bottom end back together, whilst i still remember where shit goes
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Moxey
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PostPosted: 11:37 - 28 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very nice Shocked wasn't even aware of such a brand! By the way the link to the history no longer works, would love to have had a read.

I'm desperate for a 2 stroke twin at some point shame about the prices Sad.
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hmmmnz
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PostPosted: 10:08 - 31 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vincent wrote:

I'm not sure if this is a good or bad thing. There's a guy that's done it with MR2 Mk1s - he buys anything that comes up for sale, stashes them in a field and then strips and sells the parts. It's good in that he's stopping a lot of cars getting crushed but it means it's hard to find anything yourself without handing money over to him and I suspect it costs more too. It's a basic monoploy I guess.


its both good and bad, great all the bits in one place,
shit because he doesnt do an online store so you dont know what he has exactly, and he isnt quick to reply.
he also got a bit antsy on the bridgestone forum when i mentioned this, having a wee rant about being able to run his business how he likes., Rolling Eyes
prices are expensive, but so are any 45 year old jap bike parts

Moxey wrote:
Very nice Shocked wasn't even aware of such a brand! By the way the link to the history no longer works, would love to have had a read.

I'm desperate for a 2 stroke twin at some point shame about the prices


link changed.
2 strokes are only getting more expensive, so now is the time to hoard one away,
a cheap one if you dont mind agricultural 2 strokes are the jawa 350's
or the yamaha x5 200 are still reasonably priced.

the single cylinder kawasaki kh kc ke 100 and 125's are good value, and are more than fast enough,
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pepperami
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PostPosted: 11:17 - 31 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmmmnz wrote:
Very Happy

* brake shoes (£ unobtainable!! )

* carb rebuild kit (£ unknown)


I`ve read your post in the past and I`m sure you are more than capable of sorting this one out Thumbs Up
Have you considered going on a Karting website or even the VJMCC website to try and source these parts?

Just an idea?
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 11:20 - 31 Aug 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've rescued a carb bank that was so seized the floats were solid on the pivots and the sprung-loaded pins in the top of the needles were stuck down. You'll be surprised what can be brought back if it's not actually corroded inside.
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The last post was made 2 years, 109 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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