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staffo
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PostPosted: 14:38 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
TBH I would be utterly amazed if all this isn't going on already.

If newspapers can hack phones and the internet you can bet the authorities are doing it as well.


Intelligence agencies maybe, not police.
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 14:48 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

staffy50 wrote:
Polarbear wrote:
TBH I would be utterly amazed if all this isn't going on already.

If newspapers can hack phones and the internet you can bet the authorities are doing it as well.


Intelligence agencies maybe, not police.


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11173555/Police-use-loophole-to-access-phone-and-email-records.html
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/phone-hacking-legal-loophole-allows-4472109
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 16:06 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

staffy50 wrote:
Polarbear wrote:
TBH I would be utterly amazed if all this isn't going on already.

If newspapers can hack phones and the internet you can bet the authorities are doing it as well.


Intelligence agencies maybe, not police.


Newspapers didn't hack phones, they used default passwords. The police ARE getting hacking powers!

27. Equipment interference allows the security and intelligence agencies, law
enforcement and the armed forces to interfere with electronic equipment such as computers
and smartphones in order to obtain data, such as communications from a device.
Equipment interference encompasses a wide range of activity from remote access to
computers to downloading covertly the contents of a mobile phone during a search.


28. ... Equipment interference plays an important role in mitigating the loss of intelligence that may
no longer be obtained through other techniques, such as interception, as a result of
sophisticated encryption. It can sometimes be the only method by which to acquire the
data.

32. ... The IPC will oversee the use of equipment interference powers by law enforcement,
the security and intelligence agencies, and the armed forces.

36.
c. Bulk Equipment Interference – currently provided for under the Intelligence
Services Act 1994, equipment interference is used increasingly to mitigate the
inability to acquire intelligence through conventional bulk interception and to
access data from computers which may never otherwise have been
obtainable.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 17:58 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

CaNsA wrote:
https://i.imgur.com/qpXkS9h.png


You're a strong cipher
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 19:32 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please, someone shoot her.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/04/theresa-may-surveillance-measures-edward-snowden
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 19:45 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://i.imgur.com/f3CRyUw.png
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oldpink
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PostPosted: 20:30 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
MI5 and GCHQ have been secretly scooping up the telephone and email records of the British public for almost 15 years, the Home Secretary has revealed for the first time.

The revelation came as Theresa May unveiled a raft of new snooping measures in the Investigatory Power Bill, which includes forcing communication companies in law to help spy agencies snoop on suspects.

Other proposals will see the collection of the public’s web browsing history for up to a year and judges signing off warrants for intrusive surveillance.


big sister is watching you Thumbs Up
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 20:52 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

mpd72 wrote:
It's the Mohamed's with a liking for buying weed killer in bulk, that sort of thing. It's the people who give the authorities something worth looking into.


Okay so Mohammed has just bought 10 tons of Ammonium Nitrate but doesn't seem to own a farm.... I'd say that's probably reasonable grounds for a warrant to authorize further investigation methods.... Further investigation is done, and the decision is made whether to arrest/charge.

Is there anything wrong with the above system? Why do you need blanket access to data?

If anything the warrant system makes it easier as it reduces the false-positives and narrows down a massive set of data, the majority of which is innocent.

Of course a halfway competent terrorist will play the long game and do it properly. Mr Breivik in Norway set-up and ran a legitimate business for years to establish a justifiable reason to be able to purchase his bomb-making materials without raising suspicion. Up to the day before the bombing/shooting there would be no reason to investigate because it all was legit.

The analog would be that Muhammed buys a farm (pork farm would give the game away tho Laughing ) and successfully runs it for several years. In that event Muhammed has every reason to buy 10 tons of AN, and up until the day he puts it in the feeder wagon and takes out the town center, you'd never see it coming.

Funnily enough actual proper terrorism, with a smart dedicated opponent is almost impossible to stop. It just so happens that the current round of islamic terrorists seem to be functionally retarded.
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GhostRider
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PostPosted: 21:27 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of course, once they start selling your data, then you'll have something to hide.

Life insurance premium? Well Mr Jones, we can see that you boasted about pissing it up and smoking some fine cuban cigars last weekend on a forum called "BCF" so that'll add on 10%.

Car insurance? With the way you talk about driving.....£2000 TPFT mate.

Ahh yes, we've read your CV, you've interviewed wonderfully....we're just concerned about a picture you posted, titled "nobcat 4 lyfe!".... it's a picture of a cat and....well.....I;m sorry the position has been filled.

Most people having nothing to hide. Until they do.

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oldpink
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PostPosted: 22:05 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^^

this Thumbs Up or even worse spoof your IP to a dodgy site of their choice
easier than planting a fingerprint
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nowhere.elysium
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PostPosted: 22:09 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

It has to be said, this is precisely the kind of thing that the Stasi would've wanked themselves bloody over.
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drbaig
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PostPosted: 22:43 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

So some of you would perfectly be fine with them accessing your personal data regardless of any suspicious activity. Not that they already do not collect all this meta data.

Has nobody seen citizen four ?
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 22:47 - 04 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used to watch Citizen Smith when I was little. Not sure if that counts.
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Vracktal
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PostPosted: 00:22 - 05 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

So Teresa May suggests ISPs should retain and srote a years worth of browsing data, and 'internet companies' should be decrypting and storing all users communications. (never mind the obvious flaws in this such as how they'll be planning to force multinationals like Apple, Microsoft, Telegram et. al to comply...)

Meanwhile, Talktalk customers banking details are being flogged online by hackers for less than £1 a pop following their latest security breach.

Riiiiiiiight.
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Suntan Sid
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PostPosted: 01:24 - 05 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colours to the mast, I think this is a seriously bad thing and, more than likely, yet another step on a slippery slope!

I assume, given the publicity surrounding these issues, over the last couple of years, any "terroist" worth his salt will be exchanging post-it notes in the local place of worship and won't be using the information super highway!

However, I find it hilarious that the, overwhelming, majority of people, posting in this thread are quite happily giving away personal data, via social meeja, the ultimate irony being that the very same people are, no doubt, carrying smartphones around, giving away all their movements and call logs!

If your really worried about privacy issues, why the fcuk have you got a smartphone in your pocket or, in fact, any other device with a sim card in it?
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 04:31 - 05 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suntan Sid wrote:
If your really worried about privacy issues, why the fcuk have you got a smartphone in your pocket or, in fact, any other device with a sim card in it?


Because most of the people in this thread have not watched Citizen Four.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 06:30 - 05 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel kinda bad for ol' Snowy.

The people that cared about such things already knew it was happening, and everyone else just didn't give a fuck and carried on as normal.

Ever since I was a kid* I just assumed that emails were read and phones could be tapped, maybe not matter of course but certainly "they" could do it if "they" wanted to.

What did he actually accomplish? It certainly wasn't news to me....




*I don't think I was a normal child. Aged 11-12 I'd rattle on about how the Anarchists Cookbook was more dangerous to the user than anyone else and spent my time reading survivalist sites on the internet as well as printing off "chemistry" guides. Laughing
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FlightRisk
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PostPosted: 07:12 - 05 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

smegballs wrote:
I feel kinda bad for ol' Snowy.


I think he was a Russkie propaganda plot.

Suntan Sid wrote:
I assume, given the publicity surrounding these issues, over the last couple of years, any "terroist" worth his salt will be exchanging post-it notes in the local place of worship and won't be using the information super highway!


True, I remember it being mentioned in the news about the French cartoonist murderers that none of them carried smartphones.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:17 - 05 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vracktal wrote:
and 'internet companies' should be decrypting and storing all users communications. (

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zscaler#SSL_traffic_considerations

Man-in-the-middle hijacking your encrypted communication and sending it to a Septic data centre with no protections from NSA harvesting... for your safety and convenience.
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 10:08 - 05 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suntan Sid wrote:
However, I find it hilarious that the, overwhelming, majority of people, posting in this thread are quite happily giving away personal data, via social meeja, the ultimate irony being that the very same people are, no doubt, carrying smartphones around, giving away all their movements and call logs!

If your really worried about privacy issues, why the fcuk have you got a smartphone in your pocket or, in fact, any other device with a sim card in it?


Privacy is not an on / off switch - Privacy is about having the choice about what, how much and when you make data available.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 05:30 - 06 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qk1lQQl78pk

This one's for you Snowy
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Robby
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PostPosted: 09:44 - 10 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm in two minds about this.

On the one hand, if there are credible terrorist plots that could be foiled using these powers, then the powers should be put in place and used for that reason.

On the other hand, if this creates a data warehouse which is worth attacking by organised crime, that will happen and they will be successful. Likewise if the data is used by police forces against low level every day crime like drug dealing, that is a problem.

Of course, if there a terrorist plot foiled we'll never know about it, but if Geoff in Basingstoke sold some of his ADHD meds to a mate and got arrested, it'll be all over the papers.

The whole thing just reminds me of the big NHS database idea which had everyone going mental over privacy, big data, hacking and "the man". As a result, if I have a car crash in Leeds the hospital doesn't have easy access to medical records, because they're in London.

I think in this case I would rather the intelligence agencies just did it, but did so under the table. The capability would then only be used by intelligence agencies, because its a secret. Using the capability risks making it public that the capability exists, so it is only used when necessary, not when a copper is bored and wants to read his ex-wifes email.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 18:58 - 10 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robby wrote:
I think in this case I would rather the intelligence agencies just did it, but did so under the table. The capability would then only be used by intelligence agencies, because its a secret. Using the capability risks making it public that the capability exists, so it is only used when necessary, not when a copper is bored and wants to read his ex-wifes email.


It's kind of like the fabled "can the feds break AES256 encryption?" question.

If they can break it, they can only use it a handful of times before people realise and stop using it. So they can only act on cracked intel on the most severe of cases, to the point of letting more minor things occur (assuming no other way to subvert) simply to avoid letting it become known that they can break it.
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RedPanda
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PostPosted: 19:10 - 11 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

The government's budget won't cover costs either so broadband bills go up and we get to pay for the privilege of being snooped on Thumbs Up
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Nexus Icon
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PostPosted: 10:26 - 14 Nov 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

The happenings in Paris should ensure a sway in public opinion on this matter.

Snoopers Charter in 10... 9... 8...
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