accident

[steve alker]

Hi everyone, im just looking for a bit of information on the possible outcome of my sons crash last week. He is 22 and had a ybr125 for 4 years, last month he bought a new yzfr 125 for himself. last tuesday the bike was written off in an accident. He was on his way to work and approaching a roundabout, which was approx 100 yards away, he was in a 40mph zone and filtering past the cars at 25mph. on the left there is a junction leading to a housing estate. A car he was about to pass apparently flashed the car coming out of the jcn from the left, who was turning right onto the main road. The driver of the car, according to a witness, did not look and drove straight out and accross my sons path. My son was lucky in that he faceplanted the bonnet of the car, ragdolled and managed to land on his feet. He now has whiplash and a sore back, otherwise he is ok. The insurance has said its 50/50 at fault. We are waiting for the police report on the accident before we decide what to do.

In my opinion the car driver is at fault because

1. He didnt look before pulling out and as he was coming out of a side road onto a main road, the onus is on him to make sure the road is clear before pulling out.
2. The proper meaning of flashing of lights, acccording to the highway code, is to let the other driver know you are there, so he theoretically should not have pulled out and therefore in the wrong.
3. Had the car driver been on his driving test and pulled out into the main road because the oncoming car flashed him he would have failed his test, so he is in the wrong there too.

Has anyone had any experience of this type of accident and if so what was the outcome.

Thanks for any replies
Steve

[Andy_Pagin]

Insurance companies almost always try to put at least some of the blame on the other party in the hope that they will cave in. Refute the 50/50, state the facts and refuse to accept anything less that 100% liability on their behalf. It will take months to settle but you will succeed. This is a straightforward 'right of way' violation, if you're lucky the police may prosecute the driver for 'due care and attention'.

Also I would re-post this under General Bike Chat or Dear Auntie Bcf, But not both.
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They're coming to take me away, ho-ho, hee-hee, ha-haaa, hey-hey,
the men in white coats are coming to take me away.
Yamaha Vity -> YBR125 -> FZS600 Fazer -> FZ1-S Fazer

[andyscooter]

exactly the same as my accident I had the other year except I broke my leg


it went 50 50 as I should of known better filtering when there was a junction(it was a car park)
car pulled out from behind a van so didn't see me and van had flashed it
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gilera runner vxr200 (chavped)
if its spelt wrong its my fat fingers and daft auto correct on my tablet

[Andy_Pagin]

^^ Not quite the same really. I wouldn't have gone 50/50.
____________________
They're coming to take me away, ho-ho, hee-hee, ha-haaa, hey-hey,
the men in white coats are coming to take me away.
Yamaha Vity -> YBR125 -> FZS600 Fazer -> FZ1-S Fazer

[Pete.]

It'll go each way I think. 25mph past standing traffic is faster than what is considered 'reasonable'. 15mph or less would have been reasonable.

Point 1 I think is valid, the driver should check both ways, but consider that even if he did check to his right at 25mph it's quite possible that his view of your son approaching could have been occluded by the queueing motors. This is why it's always advisable to take extra caution when filtering past junctions and especially when a vehicle has left a gap in the queue.

Point 2 - not in the real world. Why would an emerging car assume that a stopped vehicle in his direct view be flashing to warn of it's presence? Going nowhere with that. Might be technically 'correct' but it isn't going to help your son. He didn't crash because someone flashed their lights for the wrong reason.

Point 3 is irrelevant, waste of time mentioning it. Or are you suggesting that every car that pulls out of a junction should ignore it and stay put? Do you?

Unfortunately your son has learned a hard lesson. I think he'll get a partial-blame but there have been several varied results. Search back over some of the reports TC has posted of similar circumstances - some go in favour others do not.
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a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good

[TbirdX]

What insurance does your son have?

If he's TP and his insurance co go 50/50 it doesn't cost them anything. If he is FC, does it really matter as long as he gets his bike fixed?

[steve alker]

[steve alker]

[Pete.]

[steve alker]

[Rogerborg]

It's a complete lottery. Have a look here:

https://www.motorcyclecompensation.co.uk/Motorcycle-Accident-Case-Law.aspx

Everything from 100% rider fault to 100% car fault under similar circumstances.

You could hold out for better than 50/50 but it may not go in your favour. Witnesses, witnesses, witnesses.

Your son's initial error was buying a new YZF R125 on finance when he couldn't afford to insure it fully comp (wasn't that a condition of the finance?) and he's old enough to get an A2 license. But that's a rant for another thread.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[steve alker]

[arry]

[steve alker]

[Chuffin Nora]

And so . . .

Biking News & Rumours suffers -- rather inevitably -- its first accident-waiting-to-happen.


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There's a fine line between integrity

[i1301243]

Overtaking by a junction is an accident not-so waiting to happen.

You're lucky he isn't dead. I don't think being able to write "At least I was right" on his gravestone if he had died would console him or yourself.

[bladeblaster]

when filtering, always, always, always expect someone to pull out of a side turning and not see you. The driver of the car pulling out could very easily argue that he couldn't see your son as he was behind other cars. He wouldn't reasonably expect anyone to be overtaking a line of stationary cars at a roundabout.

If its his work commute he would know the junction is there and should have either A) not filtered past it B) slowed down to a walking pace past the point he knew the junction to be.

Its a lesson, one that he luckily wasn't badly injured learning.

I am not sure you will get better than 50/50 in this instance.

[bladeblaster]

[lihp]

[ScaredyCat]

[arry]

It was for dramatic effect - because you can bet all the cars that he 'blasted past at 1000mph whilst killing kittens' will say exactly that

Cars don't see filtering bikes until they're level and gone in a heartbeat, even at 15 mph because the viewing time is so short car drivers will over estimate the speeds.

[Pete.]

True dat. I lost the front on a GSXR once when a van switch lanes into my path in the wet. I grabbed a fistful of brake, the front locked, tucked and down I went. A couple of guys pulled up in a van and helped me up - actually gave me a lift in the van with the bike. The passenger said "Yeah I saw it all mate, the back wheel spun up and came right round, you was unlucky coz you nearly held it".
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a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good

[suburban myth]

Why would you overtake (filter) when there is a possibility of coming into conflict with another road user? The junction was a source of conflict, and you so eloquently described what happened next....

50/50 seems a little steep, but he should be prepared to take some of it.

[davebike]

I expect 50/50

Max recommended filtering speed in 20 mph he says 25 I bet 30+

Gap in building = side road = slow down from 20 !!

gap in traffic = something coming out
slow down expect Traffic turning

I say too fast too happy go lucky

The luck bit is he not in hospital or worse
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Dave
NC750Xdct + others at work !
davebike1@gmail.com