Resend my activation email : Register : Log in 
BCF: Bike Chat Forums


Question about iOS/Android/windows software

Reply to topic
Bike Chat Forums Index -> The Geek Zone
View previous topic : View next topic  
Author Message

Polarbear
Super Spammer



Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Karma :

PostPosted: 01:56 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Question about iOS/Android/windows software Reply with quote

This is probably an amazingly stupid question so bear with me Laughing

Are operating systems on phones purely software, as in if my phone has enough memory, processing power etc. can I download any OS on a phone.

I'm presuming there is some hardware you need built in so you couldn't wipe an android phone and install a windows OS?

The other question is what does jailbreaking allow you to do? is it only applicable to iOS and is there any truth in the stories that a jail broken phone/tablet will brick if you try to update from it.

I have an i pad from my past job and wondered if I could install android on it as well a a bunch of crappy old phone of different vintages that are doing nothing that I wouldn't mind abusing. Laughing
____________________
Triumph Trophy Launch Edition
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Robby
Dirty Old Man



Joined: 16 May 2002
Karma :

PostPosted: 08:43 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

This answer may be technically wrong (for the pedants) but right enough for your purposes.

The operating system is software, but may be partly held on read-only chips. The problem is compatibility. Different operating systems have different hardware requirements (mostly down to processor type), so you can't install Android or Windows on an iPad.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

UnknownStuntm...
World Chat Champion



Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Karma :

PostPosted: 10:38 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robby wrote:
you can't install Android or Windows on an iPad.

InB4spergs that prove you wrong...
Yes, this answer is good. Hardware vendors tailor their devices to a given platform (or OS, or firmware, or whatever) and pick components that are compatible.

Some geeks (and I mean GEEKS, not people who wear glasses and copy and paste from Sourceforge) might be able to get a version of an OS running on something totally inappropriate, though. I think I remember seeing a version of Windows running on an Iphone a while back. But it's not simple, and it's not usable, and it won't actually 'work' enough for you to do anything other than outwank your geeky 'mates'.

The closest thing you might actually be able to achieve would be rooting a device (jailbreak in iOS speak) and perhaps putting a third party version of the original software on it, with some added features. So for example, Cyanogenmod goes on Android devices.

But there's not much point if it's old, it's old.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Rogerborg
nimbA



Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma :

PostPosted: 10:53 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a perfectly reasonable question. The previous answers are correct.

Technically, you could run just about anything on just about anything.

In much the same way as you could lift a bowling ball with a rope around your scrotum.

Cyanogenmod is pretty decent though. If you want to fiddle, I'd start there.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

MarJay
But it's British!



Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Karma :

PostPosted: 11:02 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you're suggesting would only be true if all phones and devices were universal machines. They aren't. If they were, they would be a lot cheaper to produce and would probably be a Raspberry Pi with a screen.

Each phone is custom and geared towards the OS it runs. Similarly, each OS is custom and geared towards a specific platform. They have to be developed in parallel.

Think back to the days before the PC and compatible dominance in computers, and imagine trying to run a Spectrum game on a C64, or an Amiga game on an Acorn Archimedes. It won't work.

Phones are probably more similar in the sense that globalisation has meant more standard components are available, and as mentioned before it may be possible to hack an OS to run on an opposing platform, but it depends on a lot of things being in place, and quite a lot of technical skill. The iPhone in particular is probably crammed with custom chips to do various things which won't be supported on other operating systems.

I'm fairly sure lots of phones use the ARM chip, which is based on something designed by Acorn, and comes from the development of the RISC chip which appeared in the Acorn Archimedes. See what I did there?
____________________
British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F; Cheap project: CBR900RR FireBlade
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

J.M.
World Chat Champion



Joined: 27 Mar 2011
Karma :

PostPosted: 14:41 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not knowledgable about Windows and iOS, but I've a fair amount of experience with Android.

Android is nice to talk about with your question, because Android is designed in such a way that it can run on a wide array of devices.

Take a look at this image:

https://image.slidesharecdn.com/android-os-driver-hal-r2-091009031110-phpapp01/95/android-hal-introduction-libhardware-and-its-legacy-5-728.jpg?cb=1255057901[/img]

Android provides a "Hardware Abstraction Layer" (HAL). This is basically a really simple messaging format. Everything that sits on top of HAL is completely agnostic to the device that it is running on. It could be a super computer. It could be a car. It could be a phone. It could be a tablet.

HAL basically defines a whole bunch of interfaces, telling the Linux Kernel what operations must be available. For example HAL could specify that the WiFi driver must be able to respond to a request for "find WiFi networks". This is great because the Android system can then just talk to HAL and say "find me the WiFi networks".

And this is where the difficulty for installing an OS on to different hardware comes in. In order to operate, the person who built your phone needed to create drivers for the Linux Kernel and add them to their version of the Android build. The drivers are specific to the device.

If you wanted to install Android on an iPhone for example, the software would work all as expected, but the drivers would simply not exist. You would have to make them from scratch, which is very challenging and time consuming. However perhaps some of the hardware components in the iPhone are used on a HTC (calm down, just a fictitious example), so you can steal the driver from the HTC for that component, lessening your work load.

I don't know for certain, but I would imagine that Windows and iOS do the same process. So the easy answer to your question is;
It's technically possible, but good luck finding the drivers that you'll need.
____________________
2004 R1 & 2018 XSR900
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

MarJay
But it's British!



Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Karma :

PostPosted: 14:57 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

J.M. wrote:
I don't know for certain, but I would imagine that Windows and iOS do the same process. So the easy answer to your question is;
It's technically possible, but good luck finding the drivers that you'll need.


Windows probably is... iOS I'm not so certain. The hardware abstraction layer seems like a waste of time on devices which essentially have the same hardware, or at least hardware that is controlled by the software house.

Thanks for that explanation though, that's pretty much how I imagined it to be, but to have it laid out in that way makes it all much clearer.
____________________
British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F; Cheap project: CBR900RR FireBlade
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

J.M.
World Chat Champion



Joined: 27 Mar 2011
Karma :

PostPosted: 15:22 - 08 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
Windows probably is... iOS I'm not so certain. The hardware abstraction layer seems like a waste of time on devices which essentially have the same hardware, or at least hardware that is controlled by the software house.


I can see both being plausible for iOS. On the one hand, I highly doubt they wrote the entire OS from scratch (just like OS X was originally based upon BSD), so some form of Hardware Abstraction Layer would likely be present on whatever minimal system they have built upon. It would certainly make it easier for them in terms of making iOS work for new versions of the iPhone with different hardware.

But then being completely in-house, there is no need to expose this in the same way that Android definitely does, so maybe it's much harder for a hacker to hack new drivers in to it. From a software engineering perspective though, I think they need something to abstract the hardware from iOS.

MarJay wrote:
Thanks for that explanation though, that's pretty much how I imagined it to be, but to have it laid out in that way makes it all much clearer.


You're welcome! The Google I/O slides are very good for understanding in depth certain parts of the Android system. My main focus thus far has been on the Application Framework and Android Runtime stacks, but having built AOSP in order to tinker with these things for a Nexus 5, it became clear how the drivers tie into the build process.
____________________
2004 R1 & 2018 XSR900
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts
Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 10 years, 183 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
  Display posts from previous:   
This page may contain affiliate links, which means we may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. By clicking on an affiliate link, you accept that third-party cookies will be set.

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bike Chat Forums Index -> The Geek Zone All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Page 1 of 1

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

Read the Terms of Use! - Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
 

Debug Mode: ON - Server: birks (www) - Page Generation Time: 0.07 Sec - Server Load: 0.45 - MySQL Queries: 14 - Page Size: 63.37 Kb