I think they should change the learner driver laws...

[sv_cath]

I was chatting with the other half this morning and he was saying he'd seen someone being taught to drive by a friend/relative and the driver was doing 20mph, all over the road, not indicating, etc.
We thought the laws should be changed so that you HAVE to have lessons with an approved instructor until they consider you to have enough skills to be supervised by someone else.
Your thoughts on this?

[John]

I think it would be horrible!

I'm (slowly) learning to drive a car, had two lessons with a BSM instructor and he told me to drive with someone at home to learn about how to use the car without paying money.

I've driven about 300 miles (after two official lessons). Can't imagine how much that would cost with an official instructor. It's given me loads more confidence and I don't think I put anyone too much in danger (though I did cut up a car .)

In some cases it'd surely be a good idea, but I think it would make things more difficult for people without loads of money.


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[Rory]

I think there's quite a bit of disparity between bike tests and car tests. How about a CBT for drivers before someone else can take them out in their car with L plates on, and then a 1000cc / 1200cc limit for the first year / couple of years? Might cut down on the new drivers endangering their friends in mummy and daddy's 2+ litre beast.
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[Bendy]

Hmmm.

Maybe more a case of you should have to be proven not to be a useless teacher before you're allowed to co-drive someone?

I've always been an advocate of going and bashing round an empty carpark before booking any proper lessons - learning clutch control and steering, getting a taste of the spacial awareness thing and so on in a basically safe environment, and for free. Once the basics of car control are out the way, it's time to go to an instructor (with dual controls and insurance) for your first few times on the road, until you have reached a level where you're safe-ish to be there.

So that's an 'ish' really. Some form of car CBT being required before you're allowed to drive on Ls would be a good start.

(And before anyone whinges, I'm talking about people who are learning to drive as their first vehicle and first time on the road).

[sv_cath]

Maybe there should be areas where people can be taught by friends, etc. which aren't public roads?
I know most of us have our first 'lesson' in industrial estates / car parks but how about official places which have mockups of real life road layouts so learners don't panic the first time they see a roundabout?
I still reckon that instructors should supervise someone's first lesson(s) on the road though.

I definitely agree that there should be more uniformity between car and bike learner laws.

[mazza]

Totally agree Cath.

Knowing how to drive is one thing, knowing how to teach is another thing altogether.

Add to that the fact that a proper qualified driving instructor is equipped with dual control in his car, has been taken through his paces as an instructor etc. It makes sense that a teacher should be qualified as such. Especially when involved with something like this.
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[Rory]

I've heard a few folk say that they reckon everyone should do a bike CBT when they start off, regardless of what license they're trying to get. I see pros and cons both ways, but it'd certainly be interesting
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[synaptyx]

Just my personal opinion having observed other drivers for the 13 years I've had my car license.

Car drivers should have to take a CBT and should not be taught by friends or family (of course they'd still be allowed to accompany them in the car without an instructor). They should only be taught by a qualified instructor. Bike awareness should be a big part of their tutoring. Standard licence for 17 year olds should be restricted to 1.2L Rising to 1.8L at 19 then any size engine at 21. At 19 you could do a 1.8L direct access. As with bikes, a 21yo could do a full direct access kind of thing.

[dainesefreak]

I agree with the CBT idea for cars. I think you should have to demonstrate the ability to control the vehicle before being allowed on public roads.

I also agree with some sort or restricted license for new drivers too, as long as there is a better way to enforce it.

I don't actually drive and with the birth of my son it looks like I'm going to learn (sometime). So anything that I have agreed with would directly affect me. I admit that as my bike is my primary transport I'm not overly bothered about cars, so a car for me could be 700cc and I wouldn't care. Whereas someone else would see any restriction as the end of the world.

[Jaz]

[Fallen Angel]

Cath - not meaning to cause an argument here, but how did you know it was a relative. Could it not have been an instructor in the person's own car? Just a thought!

The law with regards to learners for both cars and bikes should be reviewed and overhauled completely!!!

I think the idea of a CBT test for cars is a good idea!!

I don't agree with people being able to sit a CBT one day course and then they're free to roam the roads. Many of these people have never driven before, therefore, don't understand the highway code 100%. I think that has to be reviewed! It's obviously easier for people who have driven a car to sit their CBT and then go out and gain the experience they require on the road, but do you really think it's a good idea for someone who has never driven or ridden on the road before to do a one day course and then be free to drive on the roads, personally I don't!
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[sv_cath]

[Rory]

They're not entirely free though. They can't go on the motorways, they can't take passengers, they must display L-plates, and they're limited to a 125. That's pretty restrictive, and the idea is that you're then able to get a bit more experience, before you take a test (possibley after further training) to get an actual license.
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[Craggles]

[atom]

[Grubby]

Better still let's go back to the old days when we were allowed to ride 250's on L plates & you only had to have a full license to be on the pillion of someone with L plates.
Also bring back the old test of nipping around the block twice too

[T.C]

[izzi81]

[synaptyx]

[Kickstart]

Hi

Although I do think that people should be free to drive while accompanied by a qualified drivers, I also tend to agree that they should have reached a minimun standard first. You would hope that the qualified driver would be sensible enough to refuse to accompany someone who is still totally incompetant, but maybe something from a qualified instructor would formalise this.

All the best

Keith
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[Razzy]

Car driving licence sucks compared to bikes......Learners can learn in a 2.5ltr turbo diesel ((thats what I learned in) from a proper driving school) with anyone as an instructor who has been driving for 3yrs this could be someone who has been driving since there 17 and now 20 or if you were in the army and learned at 16 or if you drove on private roads you can learn when you are 16 so it pretty much sucks, where as at 16 you get a ped then 17 you learn proper but still have to pass 2 tests plus a theory then wait 2 yrs befor you can go on to something bigger!

I passed just over a year ago on my car licence and had a 1ltr fiesta then a 1.4 corsa SRi and then got anouther corsa and now have a 2.1ltr engine in it that can now outperform an evo or scooby and has a top end of 165mph with just under 215bhp!

So if this little rant doesn't prove that there needs to be a change then bah humbug!

[Ste]

Some form of CBT would be good for cars but doubt it would ever happen.

But if they're going 20mph and swerving all over the road the person accompining them should stop them doing that, as just bcause you're a learner doesn't mean you're allowed to drive dangerously like that.

Would be better if people wanting to be allowed to teach others to drive had to do some form of basic test to show they're safe enough and able enough to do so.

[Razzy]

[Robby]

I do like the idea of a car style CBT, and having the first couple of lessons (or until the learner is ready) on private land.

I don't like the power restriction idea though, for the simple reason that cars have shit power/weight ratios. The bike restriction was brought in because of kiddies doing their test and getting things like gsxr1100s and gpz900s. Thats the car equivalent of a supercar.

But to have off the line and out of a corner performance similar to a 33bhp bike you'd need about a 180-200bhp car. Thats impreza territory.

The other little problem is because small cars are so dull to drive, you tend to drive worse in them to have fun. In my old 1.3 golf I was a liability, my foot wouldn't come off the throttle if I could possibly avoid it because it took so long to build the speed up again. In my bigger cars since then I've calmed down because I know that if I want to go fast the power is just under my foot and fairly instant.

[izzi81]