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Suntan Sid |
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Suntan Sid World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 May 2009 Karma :
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Posted: 20:54 - 06 Oct 2016 Post subject: Long awaited new, 2017, Fireblade |
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Well, if you ain't seen it yet here it is!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CUKgyqwKbk&app=desktop
Lighter, stronger, faster or was that the bionic man.
Looks alright, and Mr Hayden gives it a good spanking.
Who's 'avin one?
Might be a pea roast but "search" revealed nowt! ____________________ "Everybody needs money, that's why they call it money!" |
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Pigeon |
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Pigeon World Chat Champion
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M.C |
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M.C Super Spammer
Joined: 29 Sep 2015 Karma :
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Posted: 21:22 - 06 Oct 2016 Post subject: |
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Awful lot of control going on |
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Alex A |
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Alex A World Chat Champion
Joined: 05 Mar 2007 Karma :
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Posted: 23:12 - 06 Oct 2016 Post subject: |
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I'm in this market and I'm not interested.
I do like the bold graphics, and I do like that it has a full length lower fairing/belly pan. I also like that it's significantly lighter than the old ABS model (14kg?). I don't like the angular shape and narrow top fairing, particularly from the top, and from the front:
https://images.mcn.bauercdn.com/PageFiles/590894/1000x750/CBR1000RR_SP1_05.jpg
https://images.mcn.bauercdn.com/PageFiles/590894/1000x750/CBR1000RR_SP1_09.jpg
And it looks a bit fat in the middle.
But that's not particularly why I'm not interested. I'm not interested because it's still essentially a derivative of the 2008 bike. Same frame but tweaked. Same swingarm. Same engine tuned for 5% more top end power. Same top yoke. Same wheels. It'll almost certainly ride and feel pretty much the same as the last one, which IME wasn't particularly inspiring (compared with its peers). The most noticeable difference will probably be that it has less low/mid range power, thanks to Euro4.
Yes, it's certainly the most significant overhaul of the 2008- model, and it's been equipped with all the latest electronic kit (not that it really needed it IMO). But the Fireblade is well overdue a ground-up re-design (a la R1) and this isn't it.
I suspect they've done enough to persuade plenty of late model Fireblade owners to upgrade come PCP 'renewal'. But I don't really see that it offers anything to tempt owners away from Yamaha / BMW / Ducati / Aprilia. |
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stevo as b4 |
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stevo as b4 World Chat Champion
Joined: 17 Jul 2003 Karma :
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Posted: 18:14 - 07 Oct 2016 Post subject: |
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I'm not being critical here, but one thing I'd like to know is why bike buyers especially at this end of the market are uber critical and demanding of specs, design, last few tenths of performance and electronics etc?
People such as Alex above, who are very clued up buyers and keeping very up to date with manufacturers future and current models, and also have alot of experience of these kinds of machines and know exactly what they want and feel is required to make a bike better or faster, or more characterful and involving.
I mean someone that might consider a new GSXR 1000 for example might not have any interest in say a Fireblade or BMW S1000RR. Are they all that different and not more or less exactly the same thing, as things like similar power to weight ratios, brakes, and suspension components and wheels etc, should make them all about the same to ride?
I get that nearly all these bikes are toys and that the buyers can and will be very picky with spending say 15k on a non essential purchase or something that isn't relied on as daily transport. Also I understand there are bragging rights and the need to have the best, latest or most tech laden machine compared to mates bikes etc. And there is the desire to have a stand out bike above its peers or one that has a more notorious reputation or capability.
Im only asking all this as im well out of the loop, and havnt kept up with new litre bike developments since 2005, as they just bored me by then. I've only ridden two litre bikes, the most recent was a 2003 machine, so again I have no recent or relevant experience.
Its just I find it slightly odd or just don't grasp how new litre bike buyers are so ultra demanding and critical, especially when the ability of these bikes cannot be fully utilised on the road, and not on the track unless the rider is good and pretty skilled.
And lastly why is it so different to car buyers? I mean if you wanted to scrutinise 30k hot hatch buyers, sure they would have some interest in performance and abilities, but all the cars in that class are good enough and broadly perform much the same too. In fact price and brand image, along with dealer incentives and finance are going to be the biggest deciders in this market, with running costs, and residual values just behind them. But in the superbike market many of these factors are not even considerations, or would sway a decision over more technical reasons.
I know people buy cars for daily transport and use them much more, but it's still a universe apart in the way people decide on what to buy and how much little details matter overall. |
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Derivative |
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Derivative World Chat Champion
Joined: 03 Aug 2010 Karma :
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G |
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G The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002 Karma :
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Derivative |
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Derivative World Chat Champion
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nitrosurf |
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nitrosurf Trackday Trickster
Joined: 18 Jun 2010 Karma :
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Alex A |
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Alex A World Chat Champion
Joined: 05 Mar 2007 Karma :
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Posted: 19:41 - 07 Oct 2016 Post subject: |
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stevo as b4 wrote: | I mean someone that might consider a new GSXR 1000 for example might not have any interest in say a Fireblade or BMW S1000RR. Are they all that different and not more or less exactly the same thing, as things like similar power to weight ratios, brakes, and suspension components and wheels etc, should make them all about the same to ride? |
Yes, the latest superbikes will lap most tracks within a few seconds of one another. But no, that doesn't make them to same to ride, at all. The factor that makes the greatest difference is engine configuration, but the chassis also contributes to a very different experience (e.g. Ducati monococque). A 1299 is very different in most engineering respects to any of four cylinder competition, but the outright performance is similar. But even with the IL4s, an R1 offers a very different feel/experience to a Fireblade. And a Fireblade feels much smoother and softer than a ZX-10R, despite similar performance. Ride some and see!
Quote: | Also I understand there are bragging rights and the need to have the best, latest or most tech laden machine compared to mates bikes etc. And there is the desire to have a stand out bike above its peers or one that has a more notorious reputation or capability. |
People buy bikes for different reasons. As with anything, it's not especially helpful to generalise. Many probably do, but I don't choose bikes for bragging rights. I don't go to bike 'meets', and very rarely ride with others. It's mainly about the experience for me. The looks are also important, as is the quality of build and engineering. In fact, superbikes are unusual in that they are focused and (relatively) uncompromised when it comes to engineering, component quailty and build/finish. That appeals to the geek in me. Probably others.
There are other reasons. Some prople want a fast bike but also want practicality, so they'll buy the BMW (bit roomier, heated grips etc.).
Quote: | And lastly why is it so different to car buyers? I mean if you wanted to scrutinise 30k hot hatch buyers, sure they would have some interest in performance and abilities, but all the cars in that class are good enough and broadly perform much the same too. |
It's not the same thing is it? Hot hatches aren't (by definition) purely recreational vehicles. Superbikes (usually) are. A better equivalent would be track cars (Ariel Atom / Radicals etc.) or supercars. You would expect that buyers of those would usually be quite discerning and particular. |
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SuperMike |
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SuperMike Nitrous Nuisance
Joined: 30 Sep 2015 Karma :
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G |
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G The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002 Karma :
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Wafer_Thin_Ham |
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Wafer_Thin_Ham Super Spammer
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Wafer_Thin_Ham |
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Wafer_Thin_Ham Super Spammer
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Suntan Sid |
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Suntan Sid World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 May 2009 Karma :
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Posted: 11:24 - 08 Oct 2016 Post subject: |
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Details!
The bike being discussed, according to this article, is not neccesarily the 2017 base model, it is the either the SP1 road going special or the SP2 homologation race special:-
https://www.bikesportnews.com/news/news-detail/honda-unveils-2017-fireblade-sp1-and-sp2-models
From the article:-
Quote: | But, also like buses, one seems to have been massively delayed. Obviously, if you bring out two fancy versions of a bike, there has to be a base version too. But Honda’s being all coy about this, despite us seeing it in spy pics just a few weeks ago…
Anyway. Ignoring the presence or otherwise of a base 2017 Fireblade, we’ll have a bit of a look at the fancy SP version. |
The racing pundits have been banging on, for a while now, about how long in the tooth the, racing, Fireblade was getting, in the SBK class.
So, presumably, the specs being discussed are for race bikes, not base model road bikes!
Mr Honda needs to win more races, than he has been doing in the last couple of seasons.
Having said that the "old" blade seems to have found some form, on track in the last 2 or three months! ____________________ "Everybody needs money, that's why they call it money!" |
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Wafer_Thin_Ham |
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Wafer_Thin_Ham Super Spammer
Joined: 18 Nov 2005 Karma :
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Posted: 13:14 - 08 Oct 2016 Post subject: |
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Suntan Sid wrote: | Details!
The bike being discussed, according to this article, is not neccesarily the 2017 base model, it is the either the SP1 road going special or the SP2 homologation race special:-
https://www.bikesportnews.com/news/news-detail/honda-unveils-2017-fireblade-sp1-and-sp2-models
From the article:-
Quote: | But, also like buses, one seems to have been massively delayed. Obviously, if you bring out two fancy versions of a bike, there has to be a base version too. But Honda’s being all coy about this, despite us seeing it in spy pics just a few weeks ago…
Anyway. Ignoring the presence or otherwise of a base 2017 Fireblade, we’ll have a bit of a look at the fancy SP version. |
The racing pundits have been banging on, for a while now, about how long in the tooth the, racing, Fireblade was getting, in the SBK class.
So, presumably, the specs being discussed are for race bikes, not base model road bikes!
Mr Honda needs to win more races, than he has been doing in the last couple of seasons.
Having said that the "old" blade seems to have found some form, on track in the last 2 or three months! |
Quite right, only the SP and SP2 have been launched. I would expect the base model to have showa rather than Ohlins. Tokico or Nissins rather than brembos and a steel fuel tank. ____________________ My Flickr |
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talkToTheHat |
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talkToTheHat World Chat Champion
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Golfingbiker |
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Golfingbiker L Plate Warrior
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SuperMike |
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SuperMike Nitrous Nuisance
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Rogerborg nimbA
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stevo as b4 |
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stevo as b4 World Chat Champion
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Matt B |
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Matt B World Chat Champion
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skatefreak |
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skatefreak World Chat Champion
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Wafer_Thin_Ham |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 7 years, 100 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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