Am I insane? (Car thread)

[c_dug]

In about a months time I'll be looking at buying my first car. Being a first car insurance is killer, but I've had some strange results which have got me looking far outside what would be considered a typical first car. I've been playing this game for a few months now, so I've got everything as low as I possibly can with named drivers, funny excess anomalies, expected mileage etc.

I'll be doing quite low mileage (4-6,000 a year) so I'm not fussed about MPGs or tyre costs, but I do want a nice place to sit when I have to use it. My budget is below £6k, but realistically speaking I'd rather be around the £4k ballpark.

To give some comparison, insurance for a typical large hatchback (think Golf of Focus) is in the same ball park at the sort of cars I'll go into below - I've no interest in small (fiesta/corsa) cars, but insurance for these seems to be higher anyway!

So, the strange results seem to be for large engines luxury saloons, for instance, the insurance on a Jaguar S type R (i.e. a 4.2l Supercharged V8 making 400bhp) is cheaper than a 2 litre diesel ford focus - confusingly the lower powered S types are more expensive by a couple of hundred quid.
https://www.lawrencecoxhead.com/images/my_car/jag-002.gif

Insurance is also cheaper than the focus on a Jaguar XK8 which to me is pretty much a bloody super car (or getting on for one anyway).
https://images.honestjohn.co.uk/imagecache/file/fit/730x700/media/6944346/Jaguar~XK~(2).jpg

It's cheaper on a BMW 645:
https://www.standoutcars.com/uploads/2/0/4/4/2044500/9136817_orig.jpg

It's cheaper on a Jaguar XF:
https://www.topgear.com/sites/default/files/styles/16x9_640w/public/cars-road-test/image/2015/02/Large%20Image%20(optional)_279.jpg?itok=zPgZuUxb

The list goes on.

So MPG aside I suppose I have three questions/concerns which I don't have enough car experience to know for myself:

1: Am I likely to go backwards into a tree and die in a ball of fire? First car maybe, but I've been on the road for 10 years on bikes, does that count for much? I presume it's a bit like jumping on a superbike as a first bike, treat it with respect and I should be ok?

2: Particularly in the BMW and XF I'd be looking at cars at around 140,000 miles plus - are these sorts of cars likely to be reliable enough still? - Given their ages you have to assume they've pretty much done solely motorway miles to hit those figures, right?. I've seen models for sale at over 200,000 miles which is a bit reassuring.

2a: The older Jags are, well, older! How about age related reliability? I could get an XK8 on low 100,000s within budget, and S types from 60,000 plus miles.

3: What is the likelihood of being stung with a very high repair bill (£800+), more so than on an equivalent(ish) ford say?

I have to say I am very tempted by the S type R, so any particular advice on that model I'd be grateful for.

Thanks muchly.

Edit: I suppose question 4 would be: Other than fuel and tyres I presume with the mileage I'm likely to be doing other running costs should be reasonably low?

Edit 2: added example cars links
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[Shaft]

[angryjonny]

A friend had a not too old X Type and, lovely as it was to sit in, it rotted away to nothing at a startlingly young age. I'm of the opinion that people who own Jags >3 years old should pay into a fund to compensate drivers who get caught in the mess when they inevitably lose a gearbox on the M3/M25 junction. (The same goes for people who own any Citroen, if you replace "a gearbox" with "all electrics")

My experience:

German cars seem to handle the weather better but over 100k you're going to start seeing early problems. That seems to be the point at which they start loosening up underneath so expect track rod ends, bushes etc to need changing. Battery at 7ish years (it will just surprise you, one winter morning); if the car has stop-start batteries are expensive and awkward to change. Consumables like brake pads and disks etc are generally pricier than more modest cars. If it's an auto it'll eat brakes as the engine and brakes are fighting each other. I had a 100k 525i that drank a litre of oil every 1-2000 miles. Don't believe any fuel consumption figures you see.

[B5234FT]

[stinkwheel]

Have you checked out the insurance on Toyota Supras?
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[c_dug]

[dodsi]

Saving a couple of hundred quid on those sorts of cars insurance can potentially cost you a lot more just in servicing items. However slightly more modest v6 mercs and straight 6 bimmers may be a better option.

My first car (owned) was a 323 coupe after 10 years on bikes, might be considered quickish by car standards... to be honest I found it fairly slow.

Other cars my wife (g/f or fiancée at the time) had a Citroen C1 then we got a 2.2 turbo diesel civic together. Obviously neither of these were particularly quick.

Even the 432hp Camero SS we hired in the states didn't feel scary or 'bike' quick.

[angryjonny]

The only thing I've driven which felt as fast as my bike was a Ferrari 360.

That said, in my pre-bike days, after several years in a 1L Micra, my 2nd car (an E34 525i) felt like a fighter jet.

[Howling TerrorOutOfOffice]

You burned my baccy, therefore you are a bastard therefore you need a Jag.
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[c_dug]

Smaller BMWs and Mercs for the most part seem to be a good £500 a year more expensive to insure compared to most of the cars in my first post. Compared to the supra it's closer to £1000!

That's one hell of a lot of servicing!
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I am a bellend, I am a man of constant sorrow, I am a gummy bear, I am a rock.

[Kickstart]

Hi

A lot will come down to what work you can do and how good you are at sourcing parts.

Cam belt change can be a lot of money, or can be quite cheap depending on the design.

But the main thing I would say would be would you actually like driving it? Put it this way a Goldwing might be as quick as a 250 2 stroke sports bike, but I would prefer the 2 stroke; the large cars are more like the Goldwing.

[c_dug]

I'm not too fussed about the driving experience so much (although I wouldn't turn down a fun car obviously), but it's definitely more of a convenience and "nice place to be" thing than a driving for fun.

I suppose I also could do with being able to stick a child seat in the back for my young siblings very very occasionally, so that rules out the likes of the xk8 (though I could probably still make a supra work in that respect).
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I am a bellend, I am a man of constant sorrow, I am a gummy bear, I am a rock.

[Kickstart]

Hi

XK8 has a rear seat. OK, not massive but should be fine for one small enough to need a child seat.

All the best

Katy
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[dydey90]

My brother got a 1.6 Astra at 17, because it was half the insurance cost of a 1.2 corsa despite being bigger, heavier and more powerful.
Would recommend, I have a 1.8 SRi Astra with 105k on the clock and the only surprise it's thrown up was a dead battery which is expected due to the age. Parts are cheap and plentiful and most importantly, there's an aux input for the stereo.
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Past: CBR125,ER6f NINJA 650, ZZR600 Current: VFR750

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

Buying an old Jag because it's cheaper on insurance seems a bit like turning off your central heating to save money then keeping warm by burning Picassos......
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[P.addy]

[bamt]

I have a 2002 XJ8, and had it since it was a couple of years old. It's been the most reliable car I've had - maybe spent £1000 on repairs (other than wear and tear) over the last 100,000 miles. I've not replaced it because I honestly can't think of a car I'd rather be driving.

My son drove it (off road) when he was 14, then it was the first car he drove on road at 17 - before he got proper lessons. Since passing his test a couple of years ago he has done lots of miles in it, including using it to drive to and from college.

So no, you won't necessarily die in a ball of fire driving a powerful car as your first one. He likes the fact that it is big and powerful, so he doesn't have to drive it fast, and he takes pride in being able to park a big car in one go in places where his friends struggled with their typical small cars.

His girlfriend's next door neighbours did ask her parents if her boyfriend was a drug dealer...

[c_dug]

The supra is tempting but for an old car they're bloody pricey and compared to a similarly priced exec saloon they're poverty spec. Still, I'm only young(ish) once, right?! Regardless, at £6k I'm scraping the bottom of the barrel, they seem to really start at £7K.

Same logic with the xk8 only I can get way more for my money. Repairs are a slight worry simply because I don't have a garage or ramps. I have the tools mind so could do a fair amount. Child seats are a real squeeze though (I looked into it).

Actually the main thing for me is that whatever car I go for its relatively reliable. If I can't afford the general running costs I can sell whatever I buy for minimal loss as I'll be doing next to no miles.

On the other hand if it shits it's gearbox I'm left with a pile of spares or an expensive repair bill.
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I am a bellend, I am a man of constant sorrow, I am a gummy bear, I am a rock.

[UncleFester]

I drive what is considered to be a snappy RWD sports car - Honda S2000. I've had it almost 8 years now and done just over 70k miles in it, in all weathers for most of that mileage. Not crashed / not had an off / not spun it.

If you treat it like a bike you'll be right. Braking done before the bends, do NOT stamp on the throttle mid bend OR lift off. Be smooth and you'll be just fine.

A car with plenty of power is more relaxing to drive anyway.
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2017 Z1000SX

[Shaft]

Try your luck with a Lexus IS300.

Look for a UK car (not a Toyota Altezza) to keep your insurance down and you get the same 2JZ NA engine as the Supra, four doors and they're as reliable as night following day.

Quite a nice place to sit, if a little bland, but a pretty good sleeper, as everyone assumes is just a shitbox 200.
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[Rogerborg]

Check VED rates as well. A BMW 645, for example, is band M, £515 a year. Even if you're OK paying that, you may find it increasingly hard to find anyone who'll buy it off you.
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[owl]

surprised no mention of the skoda octavia, decent set of wheels
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[c_dug]

[owl]

Strange, didn't think it would be that much more.
Guess it's the new driver/first car thing.
____________________
Observation is the greatest source of wisdom.

[c_dug]

It isn't massively more but a couple of hundred compared to say the S type R (and about £500 compared to the Supra).
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I am a bellend, I am a man of constant sorrow, I am a gummy bear, I am a rock.