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Jawa 350 OHC & 660 Vintage, official launch, UPDATE

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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 21:47 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Jawa 350 OHC & 660 Vintage, official launch, UPDATE Reply with quote

UPDATE to the 350 OHC thread ( https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=317998 )

Both to be launched the next week, during the Motorcycle 2017 expo in Prague.

350 OHC
Manufacturer (ENG): http://jawa.eu/jawa-350-style--2

The Shineray 400 once again = 5 speed gear box, 397.2 ccm, 20.4 kW, 30.6 Nm, Euro IV.
The seat height 760 mm, dry weight 160 kg, top speed of 130 km/h and 0-100 km/h: YES.

Base model: 99,930 CZK = £3138.50 GBP
* the kick starter and luggage rack are both optional (extra charge)

Now for the interesting bit, all the 350 OHC motorcycles are equipped with ABS as standard. How will all this work with the rear drum brake is beyond my imagination. Maybe they just take the speed from the rear wheel and the only ABS controled brake is the front one.


http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/350_5.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/350_ohc_10.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/350_ohc_12.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/350_ohc_09.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/350_ohc_05.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/350_ohc_08.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/350_ohc_07.jpg

---------------
660 Vintage
Manufacturer (ENG): http://jawa.eu/jawa-660-sportard--2

A variant of the quite known 660 enduro = liquid cooled single cylinder engine from Minarelli with EFI, 5 speed gear box, 660 ccm, 57.5 Nm, 36 kW?! Shocked
The seat height 825 mm, dry weight 198 kg, top speed of 160 km/h

Why on earth did they make a 36 kW motorcycle?! Confused

Base model: 179,830 CZK = £5647.93 GBP


http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/660_vintage10.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/660_vintage13.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/660_vintage07.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/660_vintage08.jpg
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-02/36057/660_vintage12.jpg

* Source (info & pictures, NOT in English): http://www.motorkari.cz/clanky/moto-novinky/jawa/oficialne-jawa-predstavuje-nove-modely-350-ohc-a-660-vintage-36057.html?kid=39586
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Last edited by RhynoCZ on 12:59 - 11 Apr 2017; edited 1 time in total
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 22:06 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Re: Jawa 350 OHC & 660 Vintage, official launch Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:


Now for the interesting bit, all the 350 OHC motorcycles are equipped with ABS as standard. How will all this work with the rear drum brake is beyond my imagination. Maybe they just take the speed from the rear wheel and the only ABS controled brake is the front one.


I suppose the other option is that it's a straight out lie and they're hoping noone will notice. A bit like late Enfields getting through the emissions regulations by re-routing the crankcase breather into a sufficiently large catch-can that wouldn't start overflowing before the end of the tests.

As I recall, the only time I ever locked a wheel on a normal, non-ABS Jawa was when the engine seized..
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Robby
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PostPosted: 22:33 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the look of that 350.

As for why make a 36kw motorcycle, that's a shade under 50hp, which is good going (or just an ambitious number) on a single.

Or does it fall foul of some licencing law that affects children?
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 22:37 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the look of the 350, but why do chinky clocks have to look like they were knocked up in MS Paint? Much better job on the 660.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 22:41 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robby wrote:
I like the look of that 350.

As for why make a 36kw motorcycle, that's a shade under 50hp, which is good going (or just an ambitious number) on a single.

Or does it fall foul of some licencing law that affects children?


Their previous 660 was also 36kW and people, incl. me, were also scratching their heads. At £5647.93 GBP, this would make an interesting alternative for the A2 riders. Iirc, you could buy a A2 friendly Jawa 660, they didn't touch a thing, just gave you the paperwork that said 35kW, but still. Thinking
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 23:02 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
equipped with ABS as standard. How will all this work with the rear drum brake is beyond my imagination. Maybe they just take the speed from the rear wheel and the only ABS controled brake is the front one.

Honda UK's spec for the Eurobollocks MSX125 currently only claim ABS for the front brake. Perhaps they're all taking aim at the same loophole.


Robby wrote:
Or does [the 660] fall foul of some licencing law that affects children?

Yes the A2 license limit is 35kW. Mind you, I can't see many 19 year olds queueing up for that bike anyway.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 23:09 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
RhynoCZ wrote:
equipped with ABS as standard. How will all this work with the rear drum brake is beyond my imagination. Maybe they just take the speed from the rear wheel and the only ABS controled brake is the front one.

Honda UK's spec for the Eurobollocks MSX125 currently only claim ABS for the front brake. Perhaps they're all taking aim at the same loophole.


After all, the regulation did say ''equipped with ABS'', not ''equipped with ABS on both wheels''. Quite a clever way of showing the officials the middle finger. Thinking
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Paddy Blake
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PostPosted: 23:22 - 21 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would much like a Honda XBR 500 over both those.
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linuxyeti
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PostPosted: 06:53 - 22 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not 100% sure on the 660, although it does have a certain agricultural charm Smile As you already know, I like the 350, as I have my Mash Smile
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 08:16 - 22 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

The vintage is a horrible mess and silly money.

The 350 at least looks retro Java.

Dealerships? or it's just another waste of space Chinese parts lash up.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 09:23 - 22 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm looking really closely at the front end of that 500 and see nothing that looks like a wire or sensor such as one would use on an ABS system. Just two hydraulic hoses.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:00 - 22 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I doubt that a ghetto stylee pressure-relief valve would qualify, but really, who's checking?

On the issue of one wheel or both (or all three):

Eurobollocks = http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:32013R0168&from=EN

(24) ‘anti-lock brake system’ means a system that senses wheel slip and automatically modulates the pressure producing the braking forces at the wheel(s) to limit the degree of wheel slip;


So, wheel, singular, counts. I very much doubt that what they meant, but it's what they wrote.

There's no emoticon for the contempt that I have for these incompetent Eurocrats.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 14:01 - 22 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see alot of Chinese and European major components in the above bikes. My questions are:

1, Are they as good as a typical Chinese built bike of comparible size?

2, How relevant in todays world of cheap far eastern imports are an old eastern block firm like Jawa? I mean they and CZ's MZ's etc used to sell to poor ride to work and back folks without the funds or justification for a decent Japanese bike. If we're being cruely honest no one in the UK ever aspired to own an Eastern European basic bike, but they used them as a simple cheap tool for a job.

3, Assuming these bikes are still being made in the home country, what is keeping the factories going and funding it all?do Jawa have a massive market in the third world etc to support them? Or is it like in France where a firm like Renault will never be allowed to fail and fold up, due to endless state funding and national pride?
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 20:11 - 22 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
I see alot of Chinese and European major components in the above bikes. My questions are:

1, Are they as good as a typical Chinese built bike of comparible size?

2, How relevant in todays world of cheap far eastern imports are an old eastern block firm like Jawa? I mean they and CZ's MZ's etc used to sell to poor ride to work and back folks without the funds or justification for a decent Japanese bike. If we're being cruely honest no one in the UK ever aspired to own an Eastern European basic bike, but they used them as a simple cheap tool for a job.

3, Assuming these bikes are still being made in the home country, what is keeping the factories going and funding it all?do Jawa have a massive market in the third world etc to support them? Or is it like in France where a firm like Renault will never be allowed to fail and fold up, due to endless state funding and national pride?


1) Jawa was never a benchmark of reliability. We used to say Jawa motorcycles were ''FIAH'' = Finish it at home (not easy to translate the czech abbreviation ''dodo''). Which meant, you bought a brand new Jawa and then it was completely normall for you to redo wiring, adjust everything adjustable, doing the brakes even before you started riding it, tighting screws, fixing stripped threads, etc.
A friend of mine (55 y.o. now) told me about his very first brand new Jawa 350, he bought in 1984 or so. He went to the local Jawa warehouse, they gave him the bike, he did 3km on it, said the front brake was draging. The Jawa mechanics tried to adjust it, but failed. They just took the front wheel, the brake included, from the next motorcycle they had there for sale, put it on my mate's motorcycle and off he went.
--
Even after the 1989, with the born again Jawa, you still had to finish a lot of the work on your brand new Jawa by yourself at home.
--
Side thought, cars from Skoda were the same. If you check the youbook, you're gonna find a 80's, maybe 70's, video of how they imported Skoda cars to the UK back then. How the UK dealer did complete checks and overhauls, changing quite a lot of parts, even doing the respray, fitted cool wheels and so on, to make the cars sellable.
--
Motorcycles from Jawa were the same, the export models were very high build quality, having parts that you wouldn't even dream of having in the pre '89 Czechoslovakia and the USSR. If you think the Jawa/CZ you bought in the UK brand new was crap, then multiply that 10 times to get an idea of what was here for sale.

2) Heritage, successful racing pedigree, the golden 50's and early 60's, etc. etc. Pretty much what every other manufacturer, that went bankrupt before, does today. Some manufacturers decide to build very limited edition, expensive motorcycles with the top notch of the shelf parts, no one can actually afford (Norton?). Other's just re-brand, or use, Chinese motorcycles and parts to keep the company going.

3) Jawa does have a massive (considerable) market share outside the EU. Still selling their 350/640, exporting them all over the world. Even started a new factory/assembly line in India. Jawa Yezdi was in production in India till late 90's. If you google around, you can read more about it.
Gov. support, Czech gov. did give them money, but not as much as you'd thought. The FGR got way more money, to build their unsellable FGR V6 2.5L.

----
CZ = dead, killed by Cagiva. I like CZ, I always kind of hoped, some rich fan of the company would buy it form Italians and start making motorcycles again, well not gonna happen. Jawa was never the same thing as CZ, even though the communist party forced them to cooperate.
MZ/MuZ = dead, resurrection endeavours failed,
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 20:21 - 22 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:

There's no emoticon for the contempt that I have for these incompetent Eurocrats.


There's an opening in the market right there.

You posess a teenage girl child don't you?

Simply attempt to engage her in conversation about her favourite beat combo and digitise the resulting phizog.
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pepperami
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PostPosted: 22:26 - 23 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the look of both of them Thumbs Up
Styling wise, they catch my attention more than some of more modern mainstream plastic rockets.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 19:38 - 25 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

350 OHC first look and sound: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmUMzX83ca0

*The very first sold 350 OHC in Czech rep.
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Oldie
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PostPosted: 23:15 - 25 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I want one.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 08:43 - 26 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could have had one in 2014, branded as a Mash.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 12:59 - 11 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some features of the 660 that we couldn't see in the promo materials...

That is a disappointing under seat display for such adventurous motorcycle:
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-04/36325/MI4A1679.jpg

USB 2.0 for charging your electronic devices
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-04/36325/MI4A1684.jpg

The motorcycle in this test had 3D printed side panels, which wouldn't be that bad, if only they figured out how to mount them properly (both panels are cracked)
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-04/36325/MI4A1675.jpg

Questionable cable management...
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-04/36325/MI4A1843.jpg

As I understand, this is still not the production version, so will see about the build quality later.

It does look good thought:
http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-04/36325/petr_05.jpg

http://www.motorkari.cz/upload/images/clanky/2017-04/36325/honza_08.jpg
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TheSmiler
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PostPosted: 21:24 - 11 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

There aren't many bikes that I would buy brand new right now, however that 350 looks pretty tasty apart from the clock faces.
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linuxyeti
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PostPosted: 07:20 - 12 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do like the look of the 660 Vintage, and, well, obviously like the look of the 350 (400cc) as it's a Shineray XY400 (I have one branded as a Mash 400)
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Bonnie Lad
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PostPosted: 09:23 - 12 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

linuxyeti wrote:
I do like the look of the 660 Vintage, and, well, obviously like the look of the 350 (400cc) as it's a Shineray XY400 (I have one branded as a Mash 400)


Really? You haven't mentioned that before.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:49 - 12 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bonnie Lad wrote:
linuxyeti wrote:
I do like the look of the 660 Vintage, and, well, obviously like the look of the 350 (400cc) as it's a Shineray XY400 (I have one branded as a Mash 400)

Really? You haven't mentioned that before.

An acerbic, pedantic, note keeping Scotch? Just what BCF was lacking.
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linuxyeti
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PostPosted: 10:04 - 12 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bonnie Lad wrote:


Really? You haven't mentioned that before.


I'm flattered you pay so much attention .. Laughing
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