|
|
| Author |
Message |
| Ste |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Ste
Not Work Safe
Joined: 01 Sep 2002
Karma :  
|
 Posted: 21:39 - 20 Sep 2017  Post subject: |
 |
|
Hard Brexit is the only Brexit.  |
|
| Back to top |
  |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
 |
| Falco |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Falco
Traffic Copper
Joined: 27 Nov 2015
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Kawasaki Jimbo |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Kawasaki Jimbo
World Chat Champion
Joined: 09 Oct 2015
Karma : 
|
|
| Back to top |
 |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Ste |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Ste
Not Work Safe
Joined: 01 Sep 2002
Karma :
|
| Posted: 23:15 - 20 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
"Sample Size: 1651 GB Adults"
 |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rogerborg |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rogerborg
nimbA
Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma : 
|
| Posted: 23:44 - 20 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
51.9% of the population favour a hard Brexit.
We know this because that's the proportion that actually voted for it.
Everything else is supposition, projection and propaganda.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Falco |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Falco
Traffic Copper
Joined: 27 Nov 2015
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Johnnythefox |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Johnnythefox
Traffic Copper
Joined: 01 Dec 2016
Karma : 
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rogerborg |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rogerborg
nimbA
Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma :
|
Posted: 08:04 - 21 Sep 2017  Post subject: |
|
|
| Falco wrote: | We know that 51.9% of the population voted for brexit. A brexit that was [supposition, projection and propaganda] |
The question was so simple that a child could understand it. Even an 80 IQ migrant child.
Some progressives might have had trouble with it, granted. So I'll type this very slowly for you. The question was:
"Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?"
51.9% said Leave.
48.1% said Remoan
Turnout was 72.2% so if you want to invent some imaginary default third option that all non-voters implicitly went for, the numbers break down as:
Leave: 17,410,742
Remoan: 16,141,241
Imaginary 3rd option: 12,973,377 (including spoiled)
Check my arithmetic: is 17,410,742 higher or lower than 1,651?
But, but, that was then, this is now. Well, it's not. That YouGov poll is itself 3 months out of date. With gov.eu throwing increasingly petulant, drunken tantrums, our options are narrowing.
Non (aka "soft") Brexit may not be offered to us even if Sharia May does sell us out and pay the tens-of-billions ransom demand. We don't get to pick the terms of the deal, if one is even possible with these ideological zealots.
Sadly, we seem to be making no real preparations for a no-deal (real) Brexit, and doesn't Brussels know it. We have a deeply stupid Remoaner running the show, and look to be heading for the worst of all possible outcomes.
Val will be happy with that, at least.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| - |
This post is not being displayed because the poster has bad karma. Unhide this post / all posts.
|
-
Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Karma : 
|
| Posted: 10:00 - 21 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
According to 1651 adults who were available to waste 15 minutes of their life on a Monday or Tuesday, when most people would have been at work.
____________________
TZR250 2MA road, TZR250 1KT road, TZR250 2MA race, TDR250, YZF-750R Boost colours.
Jaguar S Type 3.0 V6 Sport R, VW Transporter T5 GP LWB Shuttle 140ps DSG. |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rob Fzs |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rob Fzs
World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 Oct 2015
Karma : 
|
| Posted: 13:18 - 21 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
| Rogerborg wrote: | | Falco wrote: | We know that 51.9% of the population voted for brexit. A brexit that was [supposition, projection and propaganda] |
The question was so simple that a child could understand it. Even an 80 IQ migrant child.
Some progressives might have had trouble with it, granted. So I'll type this very slowly for you. The question was:
"Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?"
51.9% said Leave.
48.1% said Remoan
Turnout was 72.2% so if you want to invent some imaginary default third option that all non-voters implicitly went for, the numbers break down as:
Leave: 17,410,742
Remoan: 16,141,241
Imaginary 3rd option: 12,973,377 (including spoiled)
Check my arithmetic: is 17,410,742 higher or lower than 1,651?
But, but, that was then, this is now. Well, it's not. That YouGov poll is itself 3 months out of date. With gov.eu throwing increasingly petulant, drunken tantrums, our options are narrowing.
Non (aka "soft") Brexit may not be offered to us even if Sharia May does sell us out and pay the tens-of-billions ransom demand. We don't get to pick the terms of the deal, if one is even possible with these ideological zealots.
Sadly, we seem to be making no real preparations for a no-deal (real) Brexit, and doesn't Brussels know it. We have a deeply stupid Remoaner running the show, and look to be heading for the worst of all possible outcomes.
Val will be happy with that, at least. |
You answered your own question really, we got asked if we wanted to leave the EU, Not the EEA which Norway is part of which is outside of the EU
We will leave the customs union as that's the EU's property.
No deal wont happen unless May goes full on dictator and removes parliaments powers to vote it down
If Boris etc wanted to leave now, with a hard brexit, they should have made a fucking plan for the civil service to follow, rather than a load of ambitions and then telling them to get on with it, so now you;'re going to be stuck with parliament adding on every amendment possible because they have nothing to stick to.
____________________
'00 Aprilia RS50 > '92 Honda CG > '99 Yamaha Fazer > '91 Yamaha RXS > '79 Suzuki X5 > 01' Honda Cg > 07' Honda Cg > 82' Kawasaki Z200 > suzuki gsxr 400 gk73a > honda vfr 400 NC30> Yamaha RD350 YPVS F2 > Kawasaki ZZR 600 D1 > Yamaha TZR 250 2MA >Suzuki TL1000R > Yamaha TDR250 > Honda 929 blade > Suzuki SV1000 > Honda H100
Mod 2 Passed 09/06/2011 |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rogerborg |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rogerborg
nimbA
Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma :
|
| Posted: 16:00 - 21 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
| Rob Fzs wrote: | You answered your own question really, we got asked if we wanted to leave the EU, Not the EEA which Norway is part of which is outside of the EU |
Are we in the EEA?
I mean, as distinct from being in the EU.
If not, then why do you bring it up?
If so, no problem then. Triggering article 50 will have no effect on our membership of the EEA and we can continue as-is.
Is that how it works?
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Val |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Val
World Chat Champion
Joined: 03 Nov 2012
Karma : 
|
| Posted: 18:29 - 21 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
| Rogerborg wrote: | | Rob Fzs wrote: | You answered your own question really, we got asked if we wanted to leave the EU, Not the EEA which Norway is part of which is outside of the EU |
Are we in the EEA?
I mean, as distinct from being in the EU.
If not, then why do you bring it up?
If so, no problem then. Triggering article 50 will have no effect on our membership of the EEA and we can continue as-is.
Is that how it works? |
Yes EEA is distinct from EU. Norway is there and not in the EU.
Nobody knows how it works, before some court clarify the EEA contract and the law implementation because this is the first time such mess happens
BTW about Theresa May tomorrow proposal - it is completely irrelevant if her goal is as advertised to have a progress on Brexit negotiations
You don't make success from negotiations by throwing in the bin the agenda that has been approved by you 3 months ago.
https://i.imgur.com/Z6wvxYN.jpg
Here what is the response from EU on that utter BS:
Speech by Michel Barnier in front of the Committees of Foreign Affairs and the Committees of European Affairs of the Italian Parliament today in Rome, 21 September 2017 is very clear:
| Quote: | The sooner we make real "sufficient progress" on the conditions of the UK's withdrawal, the sooner we can begin discussing our future partnership.
This was the approach set out unanimously by the European Council on 29 April in its guidelines. Above all, this approach is an essential condition for the success of these negotiations...
Without a withdrawal agreement, there is no transition. This is a point of law. |
I mean UK is free to do anything it wants, but don't try to convince me that the total screw up of the negotiations from May so far is some kind of masterpiece
To be unable to follow simple agenda for say chosing your cloud hosting provider meeting is lame. What about serious negotiations. Lame is understatement here.
https://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_SPEECH-17-3404_en.htm
____________________
Adrian Monk: Unless I'm wrong, which, you know, I'm not...
Yamaha Fazer FZS 600, MT09, XSR 900 |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Kawasaki Jimbo |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Kawasaki Jimbo
World Chat Champion
Joined: 09 Oct 2015
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Ste |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Ste
Not Work Safe
Joined: 01 Sep 2002
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rogerborg |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rogerborg
nimbA
Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma :
|
Posted: 20:07 - 21 Sep 2017  Post subject: |
|
|
| Val wrote: | don't try to convince me that the total screw up of the negotiations from May so far is some kind of masterpiece |
At whom are you laughing?
Has anybody here said that? Who?
May is an utter disaster, always has been, always will be. Even if she were intending to deliver a real Brexit (and she's not given that she's made no provision for the no-deal scenario), I can think of few worse people to be running the show. Except possibly Amber Rudd, who is May 2.0.
You may be confusing us with the dozen other forums in which you copy-pasta the same screeds.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Falco |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Falco
Traffic Copper
Joined: 27 Nov 2015
Karma :
|
| Posted: 21:55 - 21 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
| Rogerborg wrote: | | Falco wrote: | We know that 51.9% of the population voted for brexit. A brexit that was [supposition, projection and propaganda] |
The question was so simple that a child could understand it. Even an 80 IQ migrant child.
Some progressives might have had trouble with it, granted. So I'll type this very slowly for you. The question was:
"Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?"
51.9% said Leave.
48.1% said Remoan
Turnout was 72.2% so if you want to invent some imaginary default third option that all non-voters implicitly went for, the numbers break down as:
Leave: 17,410,742
Remoan: 16,141,241
Imaginary 3rd option: 12,973,377 (including spoiled)
Check my arithmetic: is 17,410,742 higher or lower than 1,651? |
I'm not sure why you are directing at me a counter to an argument I never made. I have no issue with the numbers of people that voted to leave the EU nor the exclusion of non-participants. Perhaps you are thinking of Val?
What "leave the European Union" actually means in the real world had (and still has) no solid form, different politicians give different answers. Without any cohesive idea of what Brexit actually means (and with May at the helm I think all civilised people can agree that is not likely), either before or since the Referendum, a claim that then entirely of the population that voted to leave the EU wanted a hard brexit is entirely without any supporting evidence.
The breadth of what "brexit" can actually encompass and still be considered to have fulfilled the terms of the referendum is shown in the graph and it's a broad church indeed.
In fact, even with May's proposals (in Jan) "At least half of the public would be personally happy with them (50%), think they would be good for the country (52%), and believe they respect the result of the referendum (61%)." The majority support leave, but there is nothing that points to the entirety of the leavers being united behind hard brexit.
| Rogerborg wrote: | Non (aka "soft") Brexit may not be offered to us even if Sharia May does sell us out and pay the tens-of-billions ransom demand. We don't get to pick the terms of the deal, if one is even possible with these ideological zealots.
Sadly, we seem to be making no real preparations for a no-deal (real) Brexit, and doesn't Brussels know it. We have a deeply stupid Remoaner running the show, and look to be heading for the worst of all possible outcomes.
Val will be happy with that, at least. |
Yup, absolutely on point here. The non-existent preparations for brexit are deeply worrying. One way or another we are leaving when that 2 year timer runs out. Sometimes I wonder if its intentional, to make it as catastrophically bad as possible and then screech "I told you so" as it all crumbles?
| Rogerborg wrote: | Are we in the EEA?
I mean, as distinct from being in the EU.
If not, then why do you bring it up?
If so, no problem then. Triggering article 50 will have no effect on our membership of the EEA and we can continue as-is.
Is that how it works? |
We are a member of the EEA as a result of being a member of the EU. However, it seems there is some uncertainty as to whether withdrawing from the EU necessitates a withdrawal from the EEA. Staying within the EEA would almost certainly require some sort of Norway-style deal, which really would be the worst of all worlds.
____________________
I tell you what, mathematically, I'm having it
Last edited by Falco on 22:07 - 21 Sep 2017; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| - |
This post is not being displayed because the poster has bad karma. Unhide this post / all posts.
|
-
Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Falco |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Falco
Traffic Copper
Joined: 27 Nov 2015
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Johnnythefox |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Johnnythefox
Traffic Copper
Joined: 01 Dec 2016
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rob Fzs |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rob Fzs
World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 Oct 2015
Karma :
|
| Posted: 23:18 - 21 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
| Rogerborg wrote: | | Rob Fzs wrote: | You answered your own question really, we got asked if we wanted to leave the EU, Not the EEA which Norway is part of which is outside of the EU |
Are we in the EEA?
I mean, as distinct from being in the EU.
If not, then why do you bring it up?
If so, no problem then. Triggering article 50 will have no effect on our membership of the EEA and we can continue as-is.
Is that how it works? |
now you're getting technical, i like it,
when we joined the EU, we joined the EEA also, so one could say, when we triggered article 50 we leave everything we joined, but then there's the case that to leave the EEA, you have to trigger another one for that, but David Davies has said we needn't trigger anything to leave the EEA
But it's one for the lawyers to decide and i'm fairly sure they will
____________________
'00 Aprilia RS50 > '92 Honda CG > '99 Yamaha Fazer > '91 Yamaha RXS > '79 Suzuki X5 > 01' Honda Cg > 07' Honda Cg > 82' Kawasaki Z200 > suzuki gsxr 400 gk73a > honda vfr 400 NC30> Yamaha RD350 YPVS F2 > Kawasaki ZZR 600 D1 > Yamaha TZR 250 2MA >Suzuki TL1000R > Yamaha TDR250 > Honda 929 blade > Suzuki SV1000 > Honda H100
Mod 2 Passed 09/06/2011 |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rob Fzs |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rob Fzs
World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 Oct 2015
Karma :
|
| Posted: 23:20 - 21 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
| Falco wrote: |
I'm not sure why you are directing at me a counter to an argument I never made. I have no issue with the numbers of people that voted to leave the EU nor the exclusion of non-participants. Perhaps you are thinking of Val?
What "leave the European Union" actually means in the real world had (and still has) no solid form, different politicians give different answers. Without any cohesive idea of what Brexit actually means (and with May at the helm I think all civilised people can agree that is not likely), either before or since the Referendum, a claim that then entirely of the population that voted to leave the EU wanted a hard brexit is entirely without any supporting evidence.
The breadth of what "brexit" can actually encompass and still be considered to have fulfilled the terms of the referendum is shown in the graph and it's a broad church indeed.
In fact, even with May's proposals (in Jan) "At least half of the public would be personally happy with them (50%), think they would be good for the country (52%), and believe they respect the result of the referendum (61%)." The majority support leave, but there is nothing that points to the entirety of the leavers being united behind hard brexit.
| Rogerborg wrote: | Non (aka "soft") Brexit may not be offered to us even if Sharia May does sell us out and pay the tens-of-billions ransom demand. We don't get to pick the terms of the deal, if one is even possible with these ideological zealots.
Sadly, we seem to be making no real preparations for a no-deal (real) Brexit, and doesn't Brussels know it. We have a deeply stupid Remoaner running the show, and look to be heading for the worst of all possible outcomes.
Val will be happy with that, at least. |
Yup, absolutely on point here. The non-existent preparations for brexit are deeply worrying. One way or another we are leaving when that 2 year timer runs out. Sometimes I wonder if its intentional, to make it as catastrophically bad as possible and then screech "I told you so" as it all crumbles?
| Rogerborg wrote: | Are we in the EEA?
I mean, as distinct from being in the EU.
If not, then why do you bring it up?
If so, no problem then. Triggering article 50 will have no effect on our membership of the EEA and we can continue as-is.
Is that how it works? |
We are a member of the EEA as a result of being a member of the EU. However, it seems there is some uncertainty as to whether withdrawing from the EU necessitates a withdrawal from the EEA. Staying within the EEA would almost certainly require some sort of Norway-style deal, which really would be the worst of all worlds. |
You need to stop listening to debunked lies about the Norway option and get on board with it
____________________
'00 Aprilia RS50 > '92 Honda CG > '99 Yamaha Fazer > '91 Yamaha RXS > '79 Suzuki X5 > 01' Honda Cg > 07' Honda Cg > 82' Kawasaki Z200 > suzuki gsxr 400 gk73a > honda vfr 400 NC30> Yamaha RD350 YPVS F2 > Kawasaki ZZR 600 D1 > Yamaha TZR 250 2MA >Suzuki TL1000R > Yamaha TDR250 > Honda 929 blade > Suzuki SV1000 > Honda H100
Mod 2 Passed 09/06/2011 |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rob Fzs |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rob Fzs
World Chat Champion
Joined: 07 Oct 2015
Karma :
|
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| - |
This post is not being displayed because the poster has bad karma. Unhide this post / all posts.
|
-
Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Oct 2013
Karma :
|
| Posted: 11:28 - 22 Sep 2017 Post subject: |
|
|
| Falco wrote: | | Ste wrote: |
Do you really think that a sample size of 1,651 can give a fair representation of the 46,501,241 people on the electorate? |
Yes, more or less. It may surprise you that the people at YouGov are fairly adept at statistics and number management. The respondents are selected to attempt to give a decent cross section, the responses weighted and the sample size is sufficient to give an answer with ~2.5% margin of error.
There is more to a good/representative sample than just size. |
Wasn't Yougov formed as Blair's "think tank"? They always seem to be the one used by the left/remain camp to backup their agenda.
____________________
TZR250 2MA road, TZR250 1KT road, TZR250 2MA race, TDR250, YZF-750R Boost colours.
Jaguar S Type 3.0 V6 Sport R, VW Transporter T5 GP LWB Shuttle 140ps DSG. |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Rogerborg |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Rogerborg
nimbA
Joined: 26 Oct 2010
Karma :
|
Posted: 17:59 - 22 Sep 2017  Post subject: |
|
|
I managed very nearly 10 minutes of Sharia May's vague rambling today and got a profound sense of the profundity with which she profounds every profoundundation.
But I'm still none the wiser as to what, if anything, she actually intends to do. It was just more vague generalities and goodfeels that informs nobody and achieves nothing.
She is a weak, spineless, flip-flopping blancmange of a person without the faintest idea how to conduct a negotiation. The sooner they do her in and put Davis in charge so that we can actually get on with implementing No Deal, the better Real Deal we'll achieve.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
|
| Val |
This post is not being displayed .
|
Val
World Chat Champion
Joined: 03 Nov 2012
Karma :
|
Posted: 20:34 - 22 Sep 2017  Post subject: |
|
|
| Rogerborg wrote: | I managed very nearly 10 minutes of Sharia May's vague rambling today and got a profound sense of the profundity with which she profounds every profoundundation.
But I'm still none the wiser as to what, if anything, she actually intends to do. It was just more vague generalities and goodfeels that informs nobody and achieves nothing.
She is a weak, spineless, flip-flopping blancmange of a person without the faintest idea how to conduct a negotiation. The sooner they do her in and put Davis in charge so that we can actually get on with implementing No Deal, the better Real Deal we'll achieve. |
Theresa May in La La La La La La Land.
Dancing with imaginary transition deal...in Florence.
Afterwards declares unilaterally complete success of the Brexit negotiations so far.
With a speech that has "a very little substance at all" - Nigel Farage.
I give that to May she finally has managed to unite 100% of the nation all remainers and all leavers including Farage behind one logical conclusion: the UK has a complete and utter cockwomble as PM.
____________________
Adrian Monk: Unless I'm wrong, which, you know, I'm not...
Yamaha Fazer FZS 600, MT09, XSR 900 |
|
| Back to top |
| |
You must be logged in to rate posts |
|
 |
Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 6 years, 210 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
 |
|
|
Help & FAQs
Search BCF
Members
Groups
Events Calendar
Do you have an substantive problem with the poll? is the p-value not to your liking? Do you believe they have claimed a higher effect size than the power of the study can account for? Anything?
rating
rating