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Hell of a drop from the battery voltage!

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RickTaff
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PostPosted: 14:48 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

Battery on my bike died about 2 weeks ago, was reading 10.5V. It died suddenly after being parked outside a mates house for an hour or so in the rain. Got it home and managed to bump it in 2nd gear, rode it round but it still cut out various points although bumped again first attempt. [24 hrs later, it wouldnt even bump]

Have kept it indoors since as i had no access to a charger. I now have a trickle charger, 12V 1.5amp - which has put some charge back into my battery and it now reads 12.4V when tested with a voltage tester.

Have had it on charge for about 30hrs(!!) and I thought I would put it onto the bike just to see if there was any life.... there wasnt. It still reads 12.4V but the minute I turn ignition on, it plummets to something outrageous like 0.83V.

Have been given 3 causes.

1. Battery is shorting out
2. Battery is scrap and is now worthy of the rubbish tip
3. Battery has been discharged for 2 weeks, and due to it being charged on trickle charger, it will need a few days constant charge to get back to life, so to speak


I think 2 is most likely.

Cheers
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 14:57 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

RickTaff wrote:
Battery on my bike died about 2 weeks ago, was reading 10.5V. It died suddenly after being parked outside a mates house for an hour or so in the rain. Got it home and managed to bump it in 2nd gear, rode it round but it still cut out various points although bumped again first attempt. [24 hrs later, it wouldnt even bump]

Have kept it indoors since as i had no access to a charger. I now have a trickle charger, 12V 1.5amp - which has put some charge back into my battery and it now reads 12.4V when tested with a voltage tester.

Have had it on charge for about 30hrs(!!) and I thought I would put it onto the bike just to see if there was any life.... there wasnt. It still reads 12.4V but the minute I turn ignition on, it plummets to something outrageous like 0.83V.

Have been given 3 causes.

1. Battery is shorting out
2. Battery is scrap and is now worthy of the rubbish tip
3. Battery has been discharged for 2 weeks, and due to it being charged on trickle charger, it will need a few days constant charge to get back to life, so to speak


I think 2 is most likely.

Cheers


Have you checked the level of the fluid in it or is it a sealed one?
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RickTaff
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PostPosted: 15:08 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
RickTaff wrote:
Battery on my bike died about 2 weeks ago, was reading 10.5V. It died suddenly after being parked outside a mates house for an hour or so in the rain. Got it home and managed to bump it in 2nd gear, rode it round but it still cut out various points although bumped again first attempt. [24 hrs later, it wouldnt even bump]

Have kept it indoors since as i had no access to a charger. I now have a trickle charger, 12V 1.5amp - which has put some charge back into my battery and it now reads 12.4V when tested with a voltage tester.

Have had it on charge for about 30hrs(!!) and I thought I would put it onto the bike just to see if there was any life.... there wasnt. It still reads 12.4V but the minute I turn ignition on, it plummets to something outrageous like 0.83V.

Have been given 3 causes.

1. Battery is shorting out
2. Battery is scrap and is now worthy of the rubbish tip
3. Battery has been discharged for 2 weeks, and due to it being charged on trickle charger, it will need a few days constant charge to get back to life, so to speak


I think 2 is most likely.

Cheers


Have you checked the level of the fluid in it or is it a sealed one?


On a flat surface the acid level is halfway between lower and upper level line. When put into the battery holder on the bike... the battery sits at a slight angle so acid level reads more along the lower line then, or just below.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 15:20 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

What happens when you turn the lights on?
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RickTaff
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PostPosted: 15:28 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
What happens when you turn the lights on?


When i turn the ignition on, I dont even get a neutral light come on anymore. It is literally as if I havent even turned it on.

the needle to indicate my remaining fuel does not even move.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 15:45 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you have a spare battery, jump leads etc to start the bike so you can check the charging system?
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Fizzer Thou
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PostPosted: 16:02 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

The battery is Fubar.

Halfords sell them if you need one urgently Thumbs Up
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jaffa90
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PostPosted: 18:20 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

10.5v sounds like a cell down probably shorted out.
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andy_uk
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PostPosted: 18:25 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Faulty reg/rec ?
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 19:09 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fizzer Thou wrote:
The battery is Fubar.

Halfords sell them if you need one urgently Thumbs Up


This. The recent cold weather has killed your waning battery. It happened to me last week.

New battery time.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 19:15 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
Fizzer Thou wrote:
The battery is Fubar.

Halfords sell them if you need one urgently Thumbs Up


This. The recent cold weather has killed your waning battery. It happened to me last week.

New battery time.


+1 to the lads above. The battery is dead. it can happen and they can sometimes just fail that way with no prior warning. Fit a new one.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 19:41 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

RickTaff wrote:
Battery on my bike died about 2 weeks ago, was reading 10.5V......

Have kept it indoors since as i had no access to a charger.


Keeping a lead-acid battery in a discharged state for 2 weeks will easily kill it due to sulphation of the plates. If it wasn't scrap before it will be now.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 21:59 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off, it's not been that cold.

Following on from that, your battery is probably fucked, but I'd want to know why.
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arry
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PostPosted: 22:09 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

andy_uk wrote:
Faulty reg/rec ?


Potentially, but more likely battery just went dead in cold weather and dropped off a cliff thereafter.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 22:16 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

arry wrote:
andy_uk wrote:
Faulty reg/rec ?


Potentially, but more likely battery just went dead in cold weather and dropped off a cliff thereafter.


Its not been that cold. you need proper minus temperatures to get that and they can generally recover from that.
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arry
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PostPosted: 22:19 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:

Its not been that cold. you need proper minus temperatures to get that and they can generally recover from that.


It has been a mild winter, granted. But if it's an old battery that wasn't up to much in itself before winter, then a few cold snaps and a couple of gone dead moments without a proper recovery capable charger, then I'd not be surprised if it's nothing more sinister than just the battery

That said, you're still quite right - to err on side of caution and just check voltage at posts when running on the new battery wouldn't be a bad idea in the slightest.
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Mawsley
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PostPosted: 22:24 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

RickTaff wrote:

2. Battery is scrap and is now worthy of the rubbish tip


Old, cheap or charged on a car battery charger?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 22:30 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

Mawsley wrote:
RickTaff wrote:

2. Battery is scrap and is now worthy of the rubbish tip


Old, cheap or charged on a car battery charger?


Next you'll be saying that modern cars have 'special' 12v DC that will break your battery/electrical system....
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Mawsley
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PostPosted: 22:40 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:

Next you'll be saying that modern cars have 'special' 12v DC that will break your battery/electrical system....


Current.
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ThatDippyTwat
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PostPosted: 22:59 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Next you'll be saying that modern cars have 'special' 12v DC that will break your battery/electrical system....


No, most car chargers force far too much current into the cells of the battery.

Car chargers tend to be 4-5A on the lowest setting. Bike batteries (generally) want 0.5A low, 1A MAx.

That is why you don't use a car charger, or at least one of the "old" ones where you can't set the current to a suitable level. Irrespective of the chemistry of the cell, over-current charging is the quickest way to fuck a cell.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 23:40 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's been quite mild but plenty cold enough to see off a weak battery, Mine died on the 21st - a very mild day but the week before had a couple of bitter days.
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arry
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PostPosted: 23:56 - 27 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
It's been quite mild but plenty cold enough to see off a weak battery, Mine died on the 21st - a very mild day but the week before had a couple of bitter days.


Exactly that. Similar conditions last year saw off last car battery. Since lost another to a faulty voltage regulator which is a bit...of a kick....in teh nads.
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RickTaff
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PostPosted: 15:55 - 28 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

smegballs wrote:
RickTaff wrote:
Battery on my bike died about 2 weeks ago, was reading 10.5V......

Have kept it indoors since as i had no access to a charger.


Keeping a lead-acid battery in a discharged state for 2 weeks will easily kill it due to sulphation of the plates. If it wasn't scrap before it will be now.


This more or less what a dealer told me this morning. He said when it died on December 10th, I should really have stuck it on charge soon as the recovery truck dropped me off. But because I didnt have access to a charger until xmas... it sulphated during that 2 week period. 'Crystals on the plates' i think were his words.

Also said that between the cold-ish weather, and the fact I didnt use the bike every single day, they also play a part in draining it because the bike was stored outdoors with just a cover over it. And from now on just whack it on a trickle charger overnight as often as possible. Even every single night if i want.
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RickTaff
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PostPosted: 15:56 - 28 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

ThatDippyTwat wrote:
Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Next you'll be saying that modern cars have 'special' 12v DC that will break your battery/electrical system....


No, most car chargers force far too much current into the cells of the battery.

Car chargers tend to be 4-5A on the lowest setting. Bike batteries (generally) want 0.5A low, 1A MAx.

That is why you don't use a car charger, or at least one of the "old" ones where you can't set the current to a suitable level. Irrespective of the chemistry of the cell, over-current charging is the quickest way to fuck a cell.


My trickle charger is 12volt 1.5amp, says for use with cars and motorcycles on the charger itself... I was told that it's fine and no issue with the amp current
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ThatDippyTwat
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PostPosted: 16:21 - 28 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Hell of a drop from the battery voltage! Reply with quote

RickTaff wrote:
My trickle charger is 12volt 1.5amp, says for use with cars and motorcycles on the charger itself... I was told that it's fine and no issue with the amp current


Have a closer look. It may be 1.5A max. Can you adjust it?. Your battery will tell you what it wants, it will be printed on the side of it. As long as the 2 can be made to match, then it's fine, there is no "magic" bike charger, just lower current chargers.

If your cell wants 0.5A trickle (low) and your charger is set at 1.5A then you will noticeably shorten it's life. Feel free to google around to see what over-current charging does to a lead (or any other kind for that matter) cell.
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