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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 02:06 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Polarbear wrote:
I'm quite sujrprised as to what you say about living costs. When I worked in Norfolk for Norshipco, food and drink was a lot cheaper than the UK. I don't know about the services as I lived in a company rented apartment but everything else seemed cheaper than the UK.

Obviously health and so on I have no idea about.


I also visited a dive bar last week and paid six bucks (+tip) for two Budweisers, no charge for passive smoking, we grocery shop at the local equivalent of Waitrose, so you do get what you pay for.

The missus pays about 80 bucks a week for her health insurance and mine comes in at more than 200, however it does not cover us if we leave the State of Florida (apparently quite a normal stipulation) and we pay 30 bucks for every GP visit - that's monthly for me with sky high stage 2 hypertension, that's stage 2 on Betablockers! - and 60 bucks for specialists/hospital visits, elective surgeries not covered so no titty reduction for me. Sad
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:40 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
You can't get cheap healthcare, but then you don't tend to get crappy healthcare either. How long's the wait for an appointment with the doctor? Do operations get cancelled due to A&E bed-blocking? Do you get flung onto a ward packed with jakeys and junkies and your care instructions not cared about?
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 12:44 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
With the shinannigans that go on with vehicle insurance providers would you actually want your life in their hands?

I suppose BUPA is a similar thing but when I had my company BUPA cover I don't remember there being a load of caveats or exclusions.

Obviously, the devil you know and all that but now, being old and with a heart problem, I'm pretty pleased to have the NHS, warts and all.

About time I was a kept man Cool
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 13:10 - 01 Feb 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:

The average with no state subsidy is around...

Quote:
Premiums for individual coverage averaged $321 per month


So, around 4% of a six figure joint salary, which is taxed a lot less than the UK.

Swings and roundabouts. We pay it via tax, you pay it via insurance.


Don't forget to factor in 10% tax deduction from wages for FICA and Medicare, which I am not eligible for until I have paid forty quarters of tax (ie ten years full employment) - cos immigrant innit. And having paid for some jabs at a Social health clinic ( at about 60 bucks a throw it's cheaper than my quack) I can tell you that I'd prefer a trip to Torquay hospital anytime, the place was fucking hanging and stacked.
Presumably you still only get walloped for 11% NI?

A living wage here is considered to be $15/HR or $31k a year, we'd be stuffed earning 62k here. Six figures sounds nice but I'd prefer to be earning it in Devon.
No obligatory holiday pay either, my boss pays me five days a year anything else is unpaid.

Our cheap four bed rental last year was $1600/month, in a rough town (top 3% in the US for violent crime), head a bit further South to Sarasota and rentals that size start at 2k a month.

Anyhow enough moaning, I'm off to work now. Sucks having to wear shorts for more than 300 days of the year. Mr. Green
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:06 - 01 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
The God Emperor is coming for your guns, to the rage of Senators McShooty, and the confusion and distress of the legacy media. Clapping

Like with a lot of President (still feels good) Trump's actual policies, if you strip the attribution, they sound a lot like common sense.

The one about thuh pohlees (which in Murca can mean a shitkicker with a badge) just flat out seizing shooters from folk without due process is guaranteed to get the gun nuts frothing at the ejection port. Should be a good period for gun sales.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 14:43 - 01 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
The God Emperor is coming for your guns, to the rage of Senators McShooty, and the confusion and distress of the legacy media. Clapping

Like with a lot of President (still feels good) Trump's actual policies, if you strip the attribution, they sound a lot like common sense.

The one about thuh pohlees (which in Murca can mean a shitkicker with a badge) just flat out seizing shooters from folk without due process is guaranteed to get the gun nuts frothing at the ejection port. Should be a good period for gun sales.

Did Obama get anywhere with gun reforms? I imagine that'll trigger a major conflict if shitlord Trump manages to:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/SpecificDopeyAcornwoodpecker-size_restricted.gif

I kid obviously it won't be good enough...
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 15:37 - 01 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Did Obama get anywhere with gun reforms?

In a way. He strengthened gun ownership rights.

They might conceivably ban "assault rifles", again, as a sop to the saps who are scared of black.

https://i.imgur.com/iAqjLOR.png

Same receiver (the parts that's legally the gun in the US), same cartridges (not particularly powerful), same RoF, same muzzle velocity, same murderkills.

Only one of them terrorscares Sally Schoolrun though.
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 23:29 - 01 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
M.C wrote:
Did Obama get anywhere with gun reforms?

In a way. He strengthened gun ownership rights.

They might conceivably ban "assault rifles", again, as a sop to the saps who are scared of black.

https://i.imgur.com/iAqjLOR.png

Same receiver (the parts that's legally the gun in the US), same cartridges (not particularly powerful), same RoF, same muzzle velocity, same murderkills.

Only one of them terrorscares Sally Schoolrun though.


Those aren't the problem, although on the few occasions one is used it tends to take more cleaning up afterwards.
Lack of oversight/ State regulation sees a child injured or deaded in the US every hour and a half. But you're right, if they thought those with an all year round tan were stocking up on weaponry a ban might follow sharpish.
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Suntan Sid
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PostPosted: 12:15 - 03 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Did Obama get anywhere with gun reforms? I imagine that'll trigger a major conflict if shitlord Trump manages to


The merest whiff of gun reform sees sales of guns go up, so whatever Obama said, did, wanted to do, merely increased the sale of guns!

The orange man child's gun reform ramblings are already forgotten as he's already bumbled his way into a trade/tariff war.
Coincidentally, trump special advisor, Carl Icahn, sold all $31M of his stock ,in a steel related company, the previous week!
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 12:53 - 03 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Suntan Sid wrote:
Coincidentally, trump special advisor, Carl Icahn, sold all $31M of his stock ,in a steel related company, the previous week!

Ex advisor. Should have kept him on board, he seems great at predicting the stock market. Whistle
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M.C
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PostPosted: 15:03 - 03 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Suntan Sid wrote:
The merest whiff of gun reform sees sales of guns go up, so whatever Obama said, did, wanted to do, merely increased the sale of guns!

I honestly have zero sympathy for yanks on the issue. We had mass shootings and changed gun laws accordingly. Nothing seems to get through to thick Americans (Sandy Hook, Vegas etc.).
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 16:34 - 03 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
How would you go about removing the 300,000,000 guns in the USA from its law abiding citizens and its criminals? Creative and concrete suggestions welcomed.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 16:49 - 03 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Drugs for guns?
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 17:21 - 03 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
How would you go about removing the 300,000,000 guns in the USA from its law abiding citizens and its criminals? Creative and concrete suggestions welcomed.


Hmm incoming wall of text.

By either removing the need to have them or by making them too much of a hassle to own. Sort of like what the DVLA are doing with vehicles Very Happy

The need to have them is done by smart urban planning... yes really smart urban planning.

The US has high crime rates and high depression rates because of poor urban planning. Something unique to the US is urban sprawl. As you've mentioned before this leads to long commutes. It also leads to isolation from society. You can look on google maps and look at huge US suburbs and there are few places to socialise with others less social regulation. Hell think about when you were a child do something bad you'd get the crap kicked out of you.

It can be seen in a microcosm in the UK where there are sink estates with nothing in them but houses. Violence is high.

This goes completely against normal human settlement. Human settlement has been a bunch of people living together with most of their needs within reasonably easy reach. The small human settlements model only ended 100 years ago. The small human settlement is self regulating too. Everybody knows everybody so the sociopath/psychopath gets tarred and feathered rather than the CEO of a big company.

In the US due to urban design and planning there is massive self segregation based on various lines of income, ethnicity etc. Suburbia and lack of social space means even amongst people of the same demographic in the same area they are suspicious of each other. This means they feel unsafe all the time and can't connect, or actually talk to others and thus don't self regulate.


Therefore there needs to be smart urban design to eliminate this isolation and inability to connect. Problem is though this is an even bigger problem than removing the guns.

Europe and the UK are older societies with less land. Britain has pubs where people can meet and socialise you can mostly walk/cycle places and commutes are fairly short. Therefore violence is less than in the US because of the socialisation effect. You might say but London. London is also self segregating in a manner by virtue of money and costs of living, but overall the crime is lower than the US.


In Asia with people packed in people live close together and social interaction is normal and frequent. People eat out and together with different families and clans. They have to travel in mass transit systems because they don't have any other choice. So the crime rate is extremely low.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 17:45 - 03 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Itchy wrote:
It can be seen in a microcosm in the UK where there are sink estates with nothing in them but houses. Violence is high.

There are also sink estates in areas with good transport links, amenities, and even with a nice(r) surrounding area.

Itchy wrote:
Suburbia

Does it have a high crime rate? Don't forget inner cities were traditionally the hubs for violence. Only the ones that are being gentrified (both here and in the states) are changing. The city model's all about placing peasants in a location where they can get to jobs etc.. Obviously in the US they have places where this model has gone drastically wrong (Detroit for example).

Itchy wrote:
You might say but London. London is also self segregating in a manner by virtue of money and costs of living, but overall the crime is lower than the US.

Give it time, it's where we're heading.

Itchy wrote:
In Asia with people packed in people live close together and social interaction is normal and frequent. People eat out and together with different families and clans. They have to travel in mass transit systems because they don't have any other choice. So the crime rate is extremely low.

I was actually thinking about this earlier today, and came to the opposite conclusion. Why does high density social housing create social problems? Why do most cities have a problem with crime? Because we aren't designed to live on top of each other.

The fact it works in places like Japan says more about the Japanese (as a people) than it does the urban model IMO.
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Suntan Sid
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PostPosted: 00:03 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
How would you go about removing the 300,000,000 guns in the USA from its law abiding citizens and its criminals? Creative and concrete suggestions welcomed.


Outlaw the sale of ammunition!
Should slow 'em down a bit!
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 00:20 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
How would you go about removing the 300,000,000 guns in the USA from its law abiding citizens and its criminals? Creative and concrete suggestions welcomed.


You could take a leaf out of the Aussies playbook and hit anyone found with a gun with an outrageously high fine, if you decided to remove all of them.
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asta1
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PostPosted: 01:52 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Suntan Sid wrote:

Outlaw the sale of ammunition!
Should slow 'em down a bit!


Would it though? No one knows how much ammo is in circulation in the US and that stuff doesn't go off. I for instance still shoot old mil-surp .303 through my No.4 which has 1950's headstamps. Goes bang fine and plenty accurate enough to give someone a bad day out to 300yds.

It's the same in the US. The place is swimming in ammo, 12 Ga, .22lr, .223, .30-06, .308, russian milsurp 7.62x39. Billions, maybe as many as 100s of billions of rounds. Even if you stopped all imports today and made it illegal to sell to joe public, it wouldn't run out for, I don't know, 50 years? Plus you only need to source 50 rounds to do a pretty good school shooting if the mood takes you.

Throw in the panic buying that would set in with crazy 'preppers' at the slighest hint of a ban, the lucrative import of the stuff that goes on illegally, and people with piles of components to reload ammo at home, and it won't solve the issue in our lifetimes, if at all.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 02:36 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
asta1 wrote:
Suntan Sid wrote:

Outlaw the sale of ammunition!
Should slow 'em down a bit!


Would it though? No one knows how much ammo is in circulation in the US and that stuff doesn't go off. I for instance still shoot old mil-surp .303 through my No.4 which has 1950's headstamps. Goes bang fine and plenty accurate enough to give someone a bad day out to 300yds.

It's the same in the US. The place is swimming in ammo, 12 Ga, .22lr, .223, .30-06, .308, russian milsurp 7.62x39. Billions, maybe as many as 100s of billions of rounds. Even if you stopped all imports today and made it illegal to sell to joe public, it wouldn't run out for, I don't know, 50 years?

Hence why they should have done it 20 or 30 years ago. But they won't, they'll continue to have mass shootings and wonder why it keeps happening Rolling Eyes
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Jmoan
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PostPosted: 16:28 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

I honestly have zero sympathy for yanks on the issue. We had mass shootings and changed gun laws accordingly. Nothing seems to get through to thick Americans (Sandy Hook, Vegas etc.).


Why would they be thick for refusing to give up their constitutional rights, they aren't british you know. It will take more than "think of the political teenagers children" to do that.

In comparison the state here doesn't need to wait for anything to push through laws.
The last few years we have had licensing for pellet guns in Scotland defacto banning and stealing from most people because they weren't informed they could sell them to England. There were also changes to firearm laws setting a stupidly low powered definition of a firearm.

Tear gas spray has been pushed into the same set of laws as chemical weapons,free to purchase in plenty of Europe, yet trying to melt someones face with acid hasn't attracted the same kind of judicial sentences.


After trying airgun licensing in Test Subject Scotland they're now sniffing the waters for England.

Quote:
Scotland has introduced licensing for ‘air weapons’ at the end of last year.

And a Home Office source yesterday refused to rule out a similar move south of the border.

In a statement, Police Minister Nick 'the turd' Hurd would only say the remit of the review would be set in the coming months.

He said: “This is an appropriate time to take stock of the regulatory position and assess whether the current controls, which are already strong, continue to be appropriate and effective.


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4657158/brits-new-law-licence-to-own-air-rifle/


Quote:
Figures earlier this year revealed 26 BB guns and air rifles were among more than 1,300 weapons seized from children as young as five in schools in 2016-2017.


Now I do wonder if bb guns means steel shot airguns or cheap spring airsoft guns like this.
https://www.kids-army.com/content/images/thumbs/0004606_pink-compact-spring-vest-pocket-airsoft-pistol_300.jpeg
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Jmoan
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PostPosted: 16:31 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
I should mention the hysterical reaction and opportunism from the armed police here, threatening kids with real guns because an informant reported them playing with something like the above.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 16:59 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
Jmoan wrote:
Why would they be thick for refusing to give up their constitutional rights, they aren't british you know. It will take more than "think of the political teenagers children" to do that.

Did they have AR15s 200 years ago?
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 18:09 - 04 Mar 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Jmoan wrote:
Why would they be thick for refusing to give up their constitutional rights, they aren't british you know. It will take more than "think of the political teenagers children" to do that.

Did they have AR15s 200 years ago?

Did King George III's imperialist boot-boys have them?


Jmoan wrote:
There were also changes to firearm laws setting a stupidly low powered definition of a firearm.

1J is lethal barreled, which is comically low, and on the face of it makes all airguns and indeed paintball markers firearms. Thanks to some effective lobbying, they excepted airsoft guns with surprisingly sensible energy limits.
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