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| NJD |
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NJD
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| Pete. |
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Pete.
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 Posted: 00:20 - 25 Mar 2017  Post subject: |
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You don't need the marks, you can usually move the marks anyway by turning the plate.
Use a steel rule or tape measure and check the distance from the end of the swingarm box section to the edge of the plate, measuring level with the centre line of the spindle. Adjust until it's the same both sides. You could even use some thin card and pencil marks.
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'
132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good  |
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| NJD |
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NJD
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| Posted: 00:59 - 25 Mar 2017 Post subject: |
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| Pete. wrote: | Use a steel rule or tape measure and check the distance from the end of the swingarm box section to the edge of the plate, measuring level with the centre line of the spindle. Adjust until it's the same both sides. You could even use some thin card and pencil marks. |
Cheers, I'll keep all that noted.
| chris-red wrote: | It's fine to leave IMO. I wouldn't visit the garage again, while it's not remotely dangerous is displays a lack or interest/professional pride I wouldn't trust them to do a decent job. |
Slow reply but; get the spanners out anyway because something to do. Realise thread was different direction when posted.
They've saved me more times than they've failed me. But importantly they have received a "you've done it wrong, guv" phone-call from me on one previous occasion after a visit, I fail to recall what for.
Can't say a total loss of business is in my interest but nor is having to correct small faults I've paid a decent whack of money to get done.
Next time I'll need a shop is the valve inspection and, hopefully, beyond that I can tackle all the jobs that arise.
I learned after the Arrow that paying to keep a business running really doesn't earn you anything in return when you can crack on with the tools for a lot less and be non the worse of for it. Plus shops are a sod for stealing things if you don't ask for them back.
Turns out both tyres where on 29psi or thereabouts when they should be 36psi. If there was any reason to "take it easy" on new rubber it's because they'd under inflated them. Thankfully I check my pressures every day and wasn't running with a heavy load on return from the shop so didn't cause any trouble. I'll check again in the morning but both being under inflated at the same level leaves me to believe under inflated rather than an air leak, I'll monitor it. Should I expect a shop to know what PSI the manual recommends for that bike? Asking me wouldn't have gone a miss since I was waiting and looking at bikes all the while.
Boogers. Only confirms that cracking on with doing it all myself is the way forward.
____________________
The do it all, T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶r̶o̶k̶e̶n̶ ̶o̶n̶e̶,̶ ̶T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶i̶g̶ ̶l̶u̶m̶p̶,̶ ̶C̶h̶o̶n̶g̶ ̶N̶o̶o̶d̶l̶e̶ |
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| talkToTheHat |
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talkToTheHat
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| Baggyman |
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Baggyman
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| Pete. |
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Pete.
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| Posted: 11:43 - 25 Mar 2017 Post subject: |
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String off the front wheel is very susceptible to error either by having the bars turned or the forks bent or slightly twisted in the yokes. Also some bikes have the front and rear wheel off-set from each other as standard, seems odd but it's true.
A ruler off the swingarm end is foolproof.
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'
132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good |
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| Baggyman |
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Baggyman
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| Pete. |
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Pete.
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| Baggyman |
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Baggyman
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| Pete. |
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Pete.
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| Posted: 13:42 - 25 Mar 2017 Post subject: |
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Well you can't be that accurate with a piece of string either and I'd like to challenge your maths too.
If you take a typical swingarm outside to outside edge as 300mm, and a typical motorcycle wheelbase as 1500mm, that's a ratio of 1:5. If you're out 0.1mm on the axle that's only 0.5mm out at the front, not 20mm as you say.
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'
132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good |
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| NJD |
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NJD
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| Posted: 14:24 - 25 Mar 2017 Post subject: |
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Oh, what's this?
https://s12.postimg.org/5ajhdz3i5/image.jpg
That, my dear friend, is a man who at quarter past eleven this morning laid his tools out nice and neat thinking he'd get through this in no time.
Oh, what's this?
https://s3.postimg.org/bq19jx0yr/image.jpg
An hour latter was a deflated man who had every tool sprawn out across every imaginable spare space to put your a foot you could imagine.
Two hours after starting and I'm done, I think.
Most of the time was spent half asleep giving my bike the thumbs up while passers by walked past and wondered why I was point my thumb at the bike. I was trying to use (Pete's?) tip of what way a bolt tightens and loosens. Any other time I'd now but the thing was so tight and I was half asleep, and without my cheerios, I'd wondered into a state of "oh where's the bloody end to all this?"
I think the point your standing on a spanner, full weight elevated of the floor, and the nut isn't moving is the point you need to start hitting the gym.
The tool was up to job, I wasn't. 
Anyway I'm done and the nail varnish that I "haven't used" to mark the nuts is back in its place.
The R clip looks safe to take for a ride?
https://s22.postimg.org/hg8b9i3tt/IMG_4583.jpg
I just went with the ring spanner end to tighten the axle and used the manuals tip of turning it one last 30 degree angle so the hole is upright and left it there.
Had to loosen the chain adjuster locknuts, or did anyway, and thought I'd rounded them of when tightening but turns out I was using a spanner size to big hence the slip. Never felt a heart drop so much in all me time. Chain measurements from axle block to end of swingarm is equal and my super legit method of eyeballing with the front tyre point forward looks sound.
I'll kill me self on a test ride in a bit once I've sat down and rested.
____________________
The do it all, T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶r̶o̶k̶e̶n̶ ̶o̶n̶e̶,̶ ̶T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶i̶g̶ ̶l̶u̶m̶p̶,̶ ̶C̶h̶o̶n̶g̶ ̶N̶o̶o̶d̶l̶e̶ |
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| Baggyman |
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Baggyman
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| Pete. |
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Pete.
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iansoady
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| Pete. |
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Pete.
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| Posted: 17:35 - 25 Mar 2017 Post subject: |
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Here you go, I've drawn it in CAD, though you can't actually distinguish each element because of the scale you can read the numbers. 300mm spindle, 1500mm wheelbase. If you move the spindle 0.1mm you move the rear wheel centreline 0.5mm at the front spindle, not 20mm.
Baggyman your figgerin' is out by a factor of 40. Doesn't matter if you use 0.1mm, 1mm 2mm or 5mm the ratio is the same (X5) until you surpass the 6 degree small angle rule and you ain't getting the spindle 6 degrees out of line so that's completely academic.
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'
132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good |
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| Baggyman |
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Baggyman
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| Posted: 19:24 - 25 Mar 2017 Post subject: |
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| Pete. wrote: |
You can't measure 0.1mm with a ruler. |
| Pete. wrote: |
Heh, actually I CAN measure to a tenth of that or better. |
OK.
You have to measure both sides - possibility of two errors. You can consider the pivot point (the centre of an imaginary circle) as either being in the middle of the back axle or at the far end. If you use the far end, you have to double the error to take account of the two measurements (one on each side). The principle obviously being to measure the rotation of the wheel off centre to extrapolate the deviation at the front wheel.
The maths depends on the measurements of the specific bike. The wider the swinging arm, the less the deviation at the front wheel for the same error...so all fag packet maths based on some assumptions about geometry.
Using swinging arm measurements assumes someone made the swinging arm with absolute precision - definitely not the case with any of the old British bikes I have owned. With a box section modern one, things may be more accurate. don't know, never jigged one up. But nothing is dead accurate so there will be some error, particularly on a measurement that the factory would may not see as critical
Anyway, string works for me. If I was doing it everyday, I would get a laser set up. This may well be because I tend to mess about with stuff that has seem a fair bit of abuse and/or made in an old non-CNC environment (Triumph could not even machine the cylinders in parallel back in the 70s!) . For those reasons, I do not trust anything between the wheels to be perfectly square so cut out all of that and do it direct between the wheels. A pair of strait edges would do the job in the same way (and probably easier) but I have never found the need to go that far.
So, if doing it as you suggest works on the bikes you have, measuring with a ruler or the tail on a vernier or whatever other tool then I have no issue with that. I know it would be a long way out on mine.
Btw - those hand tool skills are impressive. You rarely see that nowadays.
____________________
Old fart
Baghira, modded GS1000 and the T150 I bought in 1978 when I was 21 |
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Pete.
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Baggyman
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 7 years, 28 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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. Those are the sort of skills you have to use a lot to keep up. It was a pleasure to watch some of the old boys when I worked for Rolls-Royce back in the day.
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