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panrider_uk
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PostPosted: 10:57 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Cruise control Reply with quote
59 cruise missiles fired against a Syrian airfield!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39523654

No half hearted measures there.
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Sload
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PostPosted: 10:59 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yep, watching the fallout

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owl
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PostPosted: 11:03 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
Fifty-nine Tomahawk cruise missiles were fired from two US Navy ships in the Mediterranean. Six people were killed, the Syrian army said.


I'm no economist, but that doesn't seem like good value for money Thumbs Down
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panrider_uk
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PostPosted: 11:11 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
vice wrote:
Quote:
Fifty-nine Tomahawk cruise missiles were fired from two US Navy ships in the Mediterranean. Six people were killed, the Syrian army said.


I'm no economist, but that doesn't seem like good value for money Thumbs Down


Apparently $250,000 each so $14,750,000

No idea what the cost is to replace an airfield, its planes, ammo, fuel, control systems etc. but I imagine a lot more than that.
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Sload
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PostPosted: 11:12 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thus far from what I can gather from the media this is Trump lashing out against Assad and the Russians for chemically attacking his citizens.

What I'm actually interpreting thus far is chemical weapons were used or inadvertently released, no proof as to whodunnit and the US of terristan launched against a military asset after warning the Russians to not be there.

Peak conspiratory mode, the US agencies created the reason to cause an intervention.

Peak fuck yeh USA, the Evil Assad killed kids we must dominate fuck yeh!

I trust none of them.
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 11:25 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
panrider_uk wrote:
vice wrote:
Fifty-nine Tomahawk cruise missiles were fired from two US Navy ships in the Mediterranean. Six people were killed, the Syrian army said.
I'm no economist, but that doesn't seem like good value for money Thumbs Down


Apparently $250,000 each so $14,750,000


US NAVY fact sheet

Quote:
Unit Cost: Approximately $569,000


Which makes $33,571,000, or £27,025,438.

Article in the Sun...
Quote:
Each Tomahawk missile cost about $832,000 (£667,000).

US officials say 59 missiles were fired from the USS Porter and USS Ross warships which were positioned in the Mediterranean Sea.

This would have cost the American taxpayer at least $49,088,000 (£39,353,000).


Squander.com -

Quote:
The cost of each Tomahawk missile varies, depending on the type of missile. More simple versions of the Tomahawk missiles cost $500,000. According to preliminary reports by Brian Williams of NBC News, it appears that the missiles used in the Syria attack cost around that much.

However, the Block IV versions of the Tomahawk missile, which are more complex and can hit moving targets, cost up to $1.5 million each.

The total cost of President Trump’s attack on Syria, then, is between $30 million and $100 million.


CNN...

Quote:
Each unit cost about $569,000 in 1999 dollars, according to the US Navy, -- equivalent to about $832,000 today.

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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 11:32 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
NASA hammer pricing, but this lot reckons $1.59 million each = $94 million for a piece of propaganda.

It's an interestingly Trumpian response. One humungous KABLOOEY on an unambiguously military target, throwing a bone to the "Think of the children!" hand-wringers while demonstrating that he's not a Russki puppet, and hacking off both the alt-right and the peacenik left.

I think that deserves a Clapping.
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panrider_uk
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PostPosted: 11:34 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
I thought that seemed cheap (Yahoo finance costing).

Maybe a Black Friday deal.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 11:40 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
All seems a bit fishy to me.

Did anyone watch that recent Adam Curtis film, Hypernormalisation? It pretty much spelled out the recipe for toppling leaders in the entire Arab region. Dress them up as friends and/or get them into power then crush them. Happened with Saddam, Gaddafi and now Assad.

The recent sarin gas attack was a blatant method for building outrage in the west. Only a few slight hints at how it was 'probably Assad', and 'maybe backed by the Russians'.

Obvious proxy war.

Saw a video yesterday about the rise in political bets after some people made big wins on Trump and Brexit. Right now I'd bet a fair whack on Assad having his life cut short due to western actions in less than 5 years.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 11:49 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
Did anyone watch that recent Adam Curtis film, Hypernormalisation?

Unfortunately yes Smile The guy didn't even have good conspiracy theories, they were based on whatever royalty free material he could get his hands on. Putin/Assad must be loving this age of misinformation, they can shoot down a passenger plane/gas a a load of civilians, deny it like a 4 year old and get away with it.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 12:13 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Al Beeb's are going with the line that even though most rational people agree with Trump's action, that Trump changing his mind is a sign of irrationality.

Doublethinkz, we haz them. Thumbs Up
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 12:14 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:
Did anyone watch that recent Adam Curtis film, Hypernormalisation?

Unfortunately yes Smile The guy didn't even have good conspiracy theories, they were based on whatever royalty free material he could get his hands on. Putin/Assad must be loving this age of misinformation, they can shoot down a passenger plane/gas a a load of civilians, deny it like a 4 year old and get away with it.


So what makes you so utterly sure of what's going on over there?

All sounds like fairly standard PR tactics for war to me. Do, deny, confuse, repeat.

Also I wouldn't call Curtis' work conspiracy material either. There's nothing far-out about what he said, it doesn't involve taking skyscrapers down or getting people onto the moon. It's a plausible theory relating to social manipulation for war and profit - if a random documentary maker can come up with the idea, you can bet the best of state tacticians are at the very least considering similar.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 12:34 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
So what makes you so utterly sure of what's going on over there?

All sounds like fairly standard PR tactics for war to me. Do, deny, confuse, repeat.

Also I wouldn't call Curtis' work conspiracy material either. There's nothing far-out about what he said, it doesn't involve taking skyscrapers down or getting people onto the moon. It's a plausible theory relating to social manipulation for war and profit - if a random documentary maker can come up with the idea, you can bet the best of state tacticians are at the very least considering similar.

You obviously didn't watch the program very closely then, there was a massive hint 9/11 was an inside job without saying it outright. As I said before he joined random unrelated events, turned minor historical footnotes into big game changers because he happened to have a free cheap bit of footage.

Anyway tell me how the west would initiate a chemical attack in a foreign country without any realising? They're not that competent. These are the same people who prosecute their own soldiers for shooting a wounded enemy.
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Sload
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PostPosted: 12:45 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Anyway tell me how the west would initiate a chemical attack in a foreign country without any realising? They're not that competent. These are the same people who prosecute their own soldiers for shooting a wounded enemy.


Smoke and mirrors, feed a few wolves to the masses of sheep to quell the outrage now and again when your mask slips.

Digging a bit again from the older instance and as with everything, take it with a pinch of salt.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/6/syrian-rebels-used-sarin-nerve-gas-not-assads-regi/

https://web.archive.org/web/20130129213824/https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2270219/U-S-planned-launch-chemical-weapon-attack-Syria-blame-Assad.html

https://www.globalresearch.ca/syria-un-mission-report-confirms-that-opposition-rebels-used-chemical-weapons-against-civilians-and-government-forces/5363139

https://www.mercurynews.com/2013/08/29/syrias-blame-for-gas-attack-not-a-slam-dunk-u-s-officials-admit/

You have to try to chase shit like that back to the sources, not always easy.

Recent incident https://twitter.com/CzechPremysl/status/849281917124005889

I love a bit of weaponised autism, deff chugg your salt https://imgur.com/f9aZ2O7

Ron Paul on it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LULzvg1gA5U

The kekistanis are NOT happy.

Bit of history from wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

Did anyone find a reason why yet? Assad was winning, the US states they are not getting involved blah blah, so he has a lightbulb moment. "I know, i'll drop CWs and get everyone who is scrutinising my every move into a frothing frenzy herp derp". That is to say he could have done it.

Still not trusting any of them.
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Last edited by Sload on 13:24 - 07 Apr 2017; edited 4 times in total
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 12:58 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

Anyway tell me how the west would initiate a chemical attack in a foreign country without any realising? They're not that competent. These are the same people who prosecute their own soldiers for shooting a wounded enemy.


Well I wasn't necessarily going down that road but for the joy of debate I'll at least remind you that most advanced nations have special forces, attack groups etc, all of whom sign an official secrets act, and many of whom would love to be involved in all kinds super-secret covert operations. "Like the movies innit."

My point about the blame being on Assad and/or Russia wasn't necessarily supposed to swing that way though. As Mr Sload alluded to, it could just as easily have been a rebel gas attack for all we know. But let's all instantaneously blame Assad, not that it's fantastically convenient in any way whatsoever Whistle
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Ste
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PostPosted: 13:01 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Trump saying that Assad has crossed a line obviously meant that he'd be taking action.

He'd previously criticised Obama not taking action after saying that using chemical or biological weapons would be crossing a red line.

Making idle threats makes a country look weak and whilst Obama was weak, Trump is not.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 13:03 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

You obviously didn't watch the program very closely then, there was a massive hint 9/11 was an inside job without saying it outright.


You obviously didn't get his message then Wink

It wasn't suggesting 9/11 was an inside job. It was suggesting that 9/11 was very conveniently placed for the timeline of events that followed.

I didn't see it as a conspiracy documentary at all. By the end of it I didn't leave feeling morally outrage at 'the west'. All I took from it was an illuminating breakdown of the way things have ticked along since the 60s, with all sides inputting in their own way, as everyday prole society carries along regardless.
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Sload
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PostPosted: 13:12 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
Trump saying that Assad has crossed a line obviously meant that he'd be taking action.

He'd previously criticised Obama not taking action after saying that using chemical or biological weapons would be crossing a red line.

Making idle threats makes a country look weak and whilst Obama was weak, Trump is not.


You are right in some ways, he does tend to lead with his cock and balls.

I heard or read that Obama during his red line incident backed down after conducting polling to determine the will for it etc. Can't see Trump being that tactile.
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skatefreak
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PostPosted: 13:21 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
vice wrote:
Quote:
Fifty-nine Tomahawk cruise missiles were fired from two US Navy ships in the Mediterranean. Six people were killed, the Syrian army said.


I'm no economist, but that doesn't seem like good value for money Thumbs Down



Just a note that the strike was specifically designed to result in minimal loss of life, if you look at some of the pictures it seems a number of the impacts were directly to concrete 'bunkers' holding aircraft etc.

It seems to be a very well played card saying we (the US) are willing to put our fire power where our mouth is (aka with regard to the use of chemical) and where other's are not willing to (because everyone else is siting back whilst barrel bombs decimate civilians etc) and by minimising loss of life any retaliation would seem unreasonable.

Thinking I'm actually quiet impressed by the old Trumpet! Strong hand, loud diplomacy and has kind of left the rest of the west looking a pretty weak when it comes to standing up against war crimes...

I've no doubt he's got a plan to profit out of this some how though? Trump Tower II in Damascus?
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Baggyman
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PostPosted: 13:26 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
[quote="Lord Percy"]
M.C wrote:

It was suggesting that 9/11 was very conveniently placed for the timeline of events that followed.


I don't trust that sort of logic.

You post is very conveniently placed in the timeline of events that include this reply but I did not plan for you to do it just so I could reply to you......

...or did I?
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M.C
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PostPosted: 13:32 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sload wrote:

https://web.archive.org/web/20130129213824/https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2270219/U-S-planned-launch-chemical-weapon-attack-Syria-blame-Assad.html

I'm guessing that Dailymail article was pulled due to conspiracy accuracy?

Lord Percy wrote:

Well I wasn't necessarily going down that road but for the joy of debate I'll at least remind you that most advanced nations have special forces, attack groups etc, all of whom sign an official secrets act, and many of whom would love to be involved in all kinds super-secret covert operations. "Like the movies innit."

And yet completely fail to knock off individuals without leaving a trail, so I ask again how would the west gas a load of civilians. Is this the work of a clandestine organisation independent of Trump? Or is he risking his new presidency just 'because'?

Lord Percy wrote:
You obviously didn't get his message then Wink

It wasn't suggesting 9/11 was an inside job. It was suggesting that 9/11 was very conveniently placed for the timeline of events that followed.

I didn't see it as a conspiracy documentary at all. By the end of it I didn't leave feeling morally outrage at 'the west'. All I took from it was an illuminating breakdown of the way things have ticked along since the 60s, with all sides inputting in their own way, as everyday prole society carries along regardless.

Conveniently placed by coincidence? The whole bit was BS as he was using clips from after 9/11 to show how we were being conditioned for the attack, and then the same film to show the 'barrage ' we were under.
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Sload
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PostPosted: 13:34 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Sload wrote:

https://web.archive.org/web/20130129213824/https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2270219/U-S-planned-launch-chemical-weapon-attack-Syria-blame-Assad.html

I'm guessing that Dailymail article was pulled due to conspiracy accuracy?


It's the DM, they cited infowars still funny Laughing
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Fizzoid
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PostPosted: 13:48 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
vice wrote:
Quote:
Fifty-nine Tomahawk cruise missiles were fired from two US Navy ships in the Mediterranean. Six people were killed, the Syrian army said.


I'm no economist, but that doesn't seem like good value for money Thumbs Down


Trump did say he'd increase defence spending...
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M.C
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PostPosted: 13:49 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ah yes, Alex Jones and his Simpsons > Kabbalah > 9/11 theory Very Happy
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jjdugen
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PostPosted: 14:00 - 07 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sorry, can't talk now, I'm too busy digging a bunker in the garden.
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