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Security suggestions while touring (chains etc)?

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Freddyfruitba...
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PostPosted: 13:20 - 24 Apr 2017    Post subject: Security suggestions while touring (chains etc)? Reply with quote

I'm reasonably happy about my bike security arrangements while at home - it lives in a locked garage, never really left unattended elsewhere and on the fairly rare occasions when it is, I just use an alarmed disk lock (Xena XX15).

However, I do feel the need to up my game a bit while going away touring etc and potentially leaving the bike overnight in less than ideal places; notably attaching the bike to an immovable object. However, I'm obviously not going to want to lug a 3m length of 19mm chain around Europe, and wonder what compromise others go for?
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 13:29 - 24 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

The conclusion I have come to is that most of the time when I'm on tour, there isn't a particularly high risk of theft in the places I go. If I'm going to a place where I think there is a risk - large towns and cities for example - I try to check that any hotel I book has secure parking facilities, or at least somewhere I can leave it that is out of sight.

When I've used campsites in the UK, I've just used a disc lock, and accepted a small level of risk, but usually, it isn't left unattended for long.

I was a bit concerned at a campsite right in the city of Florence, when a friend and I left our bikes there unattended for a day while we explored the city. Again, I just put a disc lock on it, and decided not to worry.

I think there are some places where you just can't mitigate against theft risk entirely, and I'm damned if I'm going to take a heavy, bulky chain and lock with me.

What "less than ideal places" are you thinking of?
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B5234FT
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PostPosted: 13:29 - 24 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

The advantage you have when you're away is surprise, it's not in the same place long, so planned attacks are less likely.

IMHO the best security measure you can take is not parking it in daft places in the first place. Campsites next to your tent, or hotels with lit carparks with CCTV in nice areas.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 16:35 - 24 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always worked on the 'never leaving it too long' or 'in a hotel carpark' when I was touring abroard.

In maybe 20 years of touring I never had any issues, although nowadays I would certainly want a secure hotel carpark in a city.

Make sure your insurance is good for theft when abroad even if you have to add extra for the time and then just be sensible. Thumbs Up
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Freddyfruitba...
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PostPosted: 19:36 - 24 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, makes sense.
I'm probably overthinking it - I do quite a lot of that Shocked
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Dave V4
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PostPosted: 23:07 - 25 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I take an alarmed disc lock lock and chain, if there's not some thing solid to chain it to, we chain the bikes together. I'm not carrying a chain around with me , the bike is. So it's no hardship realy. Can't always get secure parking at last minute
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Matt B
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PostPosted: 09:47 - 26 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
The conclusion I have come to is that most of the time when I'm on tour, there isn't a particularly high risk of theft in the places I go.


Agree with this. The risk just does not seem to exist in Europe the way it does here.

As a group on Euro trips several times a year, or often on my own, we have parked bikes overnight in hotel car parks all over Europe. Not once have we had an issue, and that includes budget hotels in the dodgy semi industrial outskirts of some pretty seedy towns. All I ever take is a disc lock, more as a visual deterrent than anything else, and I only use that when the bike is left overnight.

When you look at bikes parked up in European towns and cities very few have the kind of security we obsess about here. The only place I really noticed it was Barcelona where a lot of the scoots use a cable lock that comes off the bar end to a bracket on the frame.
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Mawsley
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PostPosted: 23:55 - 26 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Matt B wrote:
The risk just does not seem to exist in Europe the way it does here.


I'd love to see those stats. If they actually exist, that is.

*They don't.
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Tracer1234
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PostPosted: 00:20 - 27 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without wanting to completely hijack the thread, I was just wondering what people would recommend as a good disk lock Smile Thumbs Up
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Matt B
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PostPosted: 09:15 - 27 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mawsley wrote:
Matt B wrote:
The risk just does not seem to exist in Europe the way it does here.


I'd love to see those stats. If they actually exist, that is.

*They don't.


Have you ridden much around Europe? You don't need stats to get a feeling for how safe your bike is, just take a look at the bikes parked around you and the lack of security on them.
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Mawsley
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PostPosted: 23:24 - 27 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Matt B wrote:
Have you ridden much around Europe? You don't need stats to get a feeling for how safe your bike is, just take a look at the bikes parked around you and the lack of security on them.


A lot. Extensively.

Just because people don't appear to take precautions doesn't mean things aren't getting stolen. The Dutch/German/Belgian/French border towns are notoriously dreadful for bike theft. Far worse than comparable British towns. I've no direct knowledge of it but I'd assume that Spain isn't exactly thief-free either. If you've got the language, speak to nationals over there and they'll tell you what they've told me. The motorbike-only camp sites in Holland will encourage you to use public transport rather than risk taking a bike into the big cities. Bike theft is far from a British-only phenomenon.

You feel your bike is safe? Awesome. Carry on and good luck to you. Wink
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Matt B
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PostPosted: 14:00 - 28 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mawsley wrote:
The Dutch/German/Belgian/French border towns are notoriously dreadful for bike theft. Far worse than comparable British towns. I've no direct knowledge of it but I'd assume that Spain isn't exactly thief-free either. If you've got the language, speak to nationals over there and they'll tell you what they've told me. The motorbike-only camp sites in Holland will encourage you to use public transport rather than risk taking a bike into the big cities. Bike theft is far from a British-only phenomenon.


Lots of solid facts about bike theft in Europe there. But...

Mawsley wrote:
I'd love to see those stats. If they actually exist, that is.

*They don't.


Thinking No sauce, so your observations are no more valid or correct than mine.

The Dutch camp sites encourage you to take public transport due to the level of bike theft in the cities? Nothing to do with nightmare parking, or the fact that the centre of places like Amsterdam and Utrecht are teeming with pedestrians and cycle lanes full of pushbikes and ped riders, plus the trams that make it downright hard to ride?
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 15:17 - 28 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd just choose hotels that have secure parking if I'm anywhere near a large town or city. Then, if I want to explore said town/city, I'd leave the bike at the hotel and go in by public transport or on foot if it's close enough. I don't go touring to get caught up in city traffic jams anyway, and I don't want to spend a day walking around in bike kit either, or having to find a safe solution for locking it up with the bike. If my tour is all about sight-seeing in cities, I probably wouldn't even go by bike in the first place.
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Mawsley
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PostPosted: 20:59 - 28 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Matt B wrote:

Thinking No sauce, so your observations are no more valid or correct than mine.


You made the declaration, the onus is on you to supply the proof. If you struggle with that simple aspect of debate then maybe you ought to consider doing something else other than engaging in it.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 14:45 - 29 Apr 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the 90s one of the bike mags (Can't remember which one) often did dvds as well. They took 4 bikes across Europe (including a track day).
I can't be sure what they were riding but I think it was a Kwaka 600, SRAD 750, Duc 916 and an R1.
I do remember that Spike Edwards was their 'professional Racer' for the vid.
Anyway, they ended up in the south of france (Nice I think) in a good hotel and noticed the next morning that all 4 bikes had been nicked.

Every large city and many large towns across Europe have bike theft.
Smaller towns and villages seem to be better but they have the odd surge of bike crime when a gang decides to tour the area.

If you know where you're going to end up each day then research hotels with secure parking (sometimes involves an extra cost, so check that before booking).
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Mawsley
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PostPosted: 22:47 - 03 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alpineandy wrote:

Every large city and many large towns across Europe have bike theft.


It's so obvious it makes me wonder why anybody has to state it.
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Matt B
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PostPosted: 07:45 - 13 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you still bleating about this? Sorry, I'd moved on with my life.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 12:27 - 13 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

It doesn't really help much. I have been thinking about carrying a chain and lock, but not sure how I'd conveniently do so with the luggage set-up I'm taking: Kriega US30, with a US20 mounted on top. I don't want to put a dirty, heavy chain in with my other stuff, and can see no way of securing one safely on top. I don't want to use my tank bag, as it then becomes too much to cart in and out of hotels, with all the faff of loading it all on the bike again at each move. With the Kriega stuff as noted, I can carry it all about in one lump on a shoulder strap. Still inclined to trust to hotel parking and a disc lock.
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Ali in Austria
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PostPosted: 07:44 - 14 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like the UK, it depends what area you are in. The risk is higher in big towns and cities.

Many hotels, B&Bs etc will provide secure parking, sometimes at an additional cost. Many of the smaller places will move their own vehicles out of their garage to accommodate your bike.

I toured for many years before moving out here, often leading big groups. We usually stayed at accommodation known to be popular with bikers so any potential thief would know there was a good chance of bikes being there overnight. Never experienced a problem or heard of a problem in any of the places we stayed at. Not saying it doesn't happen and I do see from time to time incidents of theft mentioned on Touring Forums.

I use a PacSafe for temporary safe storage of gear and equipment when I am sight seeing away from the bike. Used to carry a chain and padlock but never really used it and don't bother now.

Maybe if I was going in to a city I would take one but I tend to avoid them these days.

My previous occupation in the UK made me well aware of the risks and likelihood of theft of and from bikes. I just don't get that feeling out here. In our area deliberate vehicle crime is virtually non existent.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 11:55 - 14 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd be very surprised if there was much in the way of any kind of crime where you are, Ali. But on my planned upcoming tour, I will be staying in large towns on a couple of occasions. The hotels I have booked there have secure parking, so I'm not too concerned in those places, but it depends on where I go after the pre-booked part of my tour.

Having used the F1 chain in France, they're often in not such nice parts of towns and cities, although even those vary security-wise. In Charleville, it didn't feel too secure, but at least the bikes couldn't be seen from any road. In Lyon, they have a secure car park where you use your room number to access it via a coded entry box. The one in Villeneuve-Loubet (near Cannes) had that facility too.

But it's when you're booking on the fly that you wonder if it might be a good idea to take a chain and lock, especially for hotels that might be on a transit route between the places you want to explore. But I just don't have a convenient way to carry one securely on the bike.
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Alpineandy
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PostPosted: 17:15 - 14 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
It doesn't really help much. I have been thinking about carrying a chain and lock, but not sure how I'd conveniently do so

On the assumption that you'll probably mainly have secure parking and may only need it occasionally, could you use a polypropylene bag like you get to cover fold-up/camping chairs. Something that will act as a barrier between your gear and the chain in a top-box/pannier.
Alternatively get a chain in a cover and find a way to wrap it around the rear of the bike, although you may need to use some sticky neoprene and possibly a bit of duct-tape to stop it rattling around and scratching everything..
Or maybe they're crap ideas... Laughing
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 17:19 - 14 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

On my CBR I can fit a 0.8m chain under my seat.

On my other bikes that simply had no underseat storage (XT600, NTV, CB500) commuting I would simply wrap the chain around the rear grab rail and it would hold fine.

It's not pretty and there are many ways it can come off but it worked ok for me.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 17:34 - 14 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

No hard luggage, and definitely not enough room for under seat storage.

The luggage set-up I'll have is this:

https://i1291.photobucket.com/albums/b550/nicknicklxs/DSCN7368_zpsdwbb1pjw.jpg

plus a smaller Kriega on top of that one. There are grab rails on either side of the seat, but the bags will be between them, and anyway, I don't want a chain banging around on the tail piece.

It occurs to me I might be able to fasten it around the top bag however.
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