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Why do people vote Tory?

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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 18:25 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

I don't expect an uprising (although that would be awesome Wink), but I don't see people continuing to play along either. They have to believe they can have their slice of the pie, for a lot of people it's becoming abundantly clear that will never happen.


Viva la revolution Dance!

M.C wrote:
Still not gonna vote for Corbyn though Wink


Ah ok, no revolution today then.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 18:59 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thought I'd check who's actually standing in my constituency: Conservative, Labour, Lib Dem, Green and UKIP. No monster raving loony types to vote for Crying or Very sad
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Jewlio Rides Again LLB
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PostPosted: 19:12 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:
Jewlio Rides Again wrote:

Except I'm not in Rotherham. Didn't even realise they did mining there, I thought it was mills.


South Yorkshire coal seams made it one of the largest areas for mining. The steel industry needed lots of coal.


Don't think there was a much as there was in my hometown to be honest, from a quick research jaunt.

Quote:

Jewlio Rides Again wrote:
So, where's the money to stop people losing their homes where I live?


Losing homes how? Putting them down and forgetting where you put them? Or are you pretending there's growing poverty in the UK again?


You really are a moron. Subsidence affects many more houses than just one which happens to fall into a wealthy Tory family. Those people affected get no bailouts. They end up with worthless assets, they get no help from the taxpayer to sort it out. Perhaps little Lady Fauntleroy should have checked how much it would cost to have it fixed before they bought a big house beyond realised they couldn't afford to maintain it?
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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 20:07 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Only the rich and retards vote tory.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 21:17 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
So you'd rather your taxes were used to buy and maintain nuclear tipped intercontinental ballistic missiles, and the submarines that fire them, instead of funding services like education and health which have extreme long term importance to any nation?

How about diverting the money towards building an army of invincible strawmen?

1) I am against Trident. I've never said or even intimated that I'm in favour of it. It's not a deterrent since we'd never use it, even in retaliation.

2) No major party is promising to scrap Trident, so for whom do you imagine I'd vote?
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Jewlio Rides Again LLB
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PostPosted: 21:19 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:
Hetzer wrote:
Only the rich and retards vote tory.


Only workshy leeching scumbags vote Labour.

What is it you contribute to society again?


I didn't realise paying my taxes meant I'm a leech?

I realise you're aiming your vitriol at Hetzer now, but I would still vote Labour if they'd get rid of the careerists standing in my area.
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Jewlio Rides Again LLB
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PostPosted: 21:38 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:


House insurance doesn't cover it then?

Care to show these houses which people have lost, with no compo, to subsidence for being over a mine?


Not generally, they either specifically exclude it, or may make it exhorbitantly expensive. Not to mention they don't cover rectification of the problem; only repairing the damage already caused. Bit like replacing a paving stone that cracks because it's on an uneven base, rather than flattening it first. Not to mention holding to you ransom once you've had to claim, like so -> https://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/feb/20/homeowners-subsidence-claim-switch-insurer

If you want examples, there were a number of houses on Primrose Lane in Standish that were flattened due to subsidence. As well as the 'rods' that helped prevent it destroying the value of the homes. Just because a house is still standing, doesn't mean it's not basically worthless.

Quote:
You seem to be confusing a national treasure owned by a trust as the house of a Tory MP's wife.

I won't hold my breath, what with your sense of reality.


My father in law holds his house in trust. Doesn't mean he doesn't get the benefit of it, does it? National treasure? Yeah, because someone wrote a story based on it? I can think of examples which are now long gone, no money to preserve or maintain.

It's not what you know, it's who you are.
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arry
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PostPosted: 22:11 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:

House insurance doesn't cover it then?

Care to show these houses which people have lost, with no compo, to subsidence for being over a mine?


No, not when the insurer's peril data says it's a no-go area - and most of the old mining areas are well known / throw up the uninsurable flag. Exclude peril is likely outcome - accept with £5000+ excess and / or a 10% coinsurance clause at best; and that's assuming you're not in an area that's 'known' for subsidence issues as if it is to the best of your knowledge and you must declare it, then good luck.

There's been plenty in the past TBH. Some wordings used to carry an exclusion for starters - not so much any more.

Outside of the mining issue there's also the coastal erosion issue which affected the east coast a few years back (well, is ongoing, but it was dramatic a few years back). They're not insured either, and it's a direct result of governmental coastal management that their properties are affected.

Jewlio is correct, TBH.
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Jewlio Rides Again LLB
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PostPosted: 22:17 - 15 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
arry wrote:
mpd72 wrote:

House insurance doesn't cover it then?

Care to show these houses which people have lost, with no compo, to subsidence for being over a mine?


No, not when the insurer's peril data says it's a no-go area - and most of the old mining areas are well known / throw up the uninsurable flag. Exclude peril is likely outcome - accept with £5000+ excess and / or a 10% coinsurance clause at best; and that's assuming you're not in an area that's 'known' for subsidence issues as if it is to the best of your knowledge and you must declare it, then good luck.

There's been plenty in the past TBH. Some wordings used to carry an exclusion for starters - not so much any more.

Outside of the mining issue there's also the coastal erosion issue which affected the east coast a few years back (well, is ongoing, but it was dramatic a few years back). They're not insured either, and it's a direct result of governmental coastal management that their properties are affected.

Jewlio is correct, TBH.


arry wrote:
Jewlio is correct, TBH.


arry wrote:
Jewlio is correct, TBH.


Mr. Green
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:01 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
https://www.gov.uk/claim-for-subsidence-damage-caused-by-coal-mining

https://www.bureauinsure.com/subsidence/

I hear that on still moonlit nights, if you put your ear to the ground and listen really closely, you can Theresa May burrowing underneath Labour voters' houses.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 10:13 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:


1) I am against Trident. I've never said or even intimated that I'm in favour of it. It's not a deterrent since we'd never use it, even in retaliation.


Today a new Rogerborg fact was learned Karma

Quote:

2) No major party is promising to scrap Trident, so for whom do you imagine I'd vote?


Probably Tory Laughing

The use of trident as an example was a bit arbitrary. The main point was that those who dislike taxation should surely be just as annoyed that their money is still being thrown fully at things like nuclear armed subs, and almost the highest military expenditure in Europe, while useful things that are worth keeping in good order like healthcare, education etc are in varying forms of crisis. If I were a super-high-tax paying zillionaire I know what I'd rather see kept in shape, if I had to pick something for my forcibly stolen money to be spent on.
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 10:35 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:

You missed the bit about ISIS having a caliphate stretching across much or Iraq and Syria then?


The areas under their control aren't that big.

I guess you forgot that a deterrent requires a good target and and enemy that cares if where you hit or if you wipe out innocent people.

It's not an effective deterrent against nomadic enemies.


mpd72 wrote:

Ah, so we should build schools in Muslim countries. Good luck with that one, I'm sure ISIS and all other Muslims will welcome our non Muslim interference.


You left your straw man behind.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 11:06 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
The main point was that those who dislike taxation should surely be just as annoyed that their money is still being thrown fully at things like nuclear armed subs, and almost the highest military expenditure in Europe, while useful things that are worth keeping in good order like healthcare, education etc are in varying forms of crisis.

Yes, I am. Let's not forget the £12 billion a year in despot bribes either.

However, my primary interest is in being mugged for less, not in the notional benefits of where the State chooses to waste that stolen money.

So given the actual choices on offer rather than some imaginary party that doesn't exist, what are my options?

The Tories and UKIP don't seem to view taxation as a merit in and of itself, and my tax mugging has come down very slightly under the Tories.

Comrade Corbyn's Labour, the Limps, Ecomentals and Scotch Racialists are all threatening tax hikes to pay for their fantasy Utopias. Punitive hikes, one might call them. And no, I don't believe for a second that they'll stop with taxing anyone making ($MP_SALARY + £10).

Fortunately I don't need to agonise over it too much since my constituency is going to either Corbyn or Krankie, not Sharia / Nutter / Tiny Tim / Starshine Mooncup . I can throw my vote away on anyone that I like with a clear conscience.
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arry
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PostPosted: 12:54 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:

A bit like buying a cheap house with great views about 20ft from a chalk cliff.


You're just so salty, with a sandy little butthole Laughing I have you down as the angriest man on teh webz.

You do realise that some folk bought their homes some years ago and whilst it might now be 20 feet from a chalk cliff, 20 years ago it was more like 400 feet away? You do realise that coastal erosion is effectively a system and any intervention has an effect further along the coast? You do realise that successive governments have failed in their Environment Agency responsibilities for managing flood and coastal erosion and have often intervened for the protection of 'high value' property at the detriment of other properties?

You do realise that all of these things could affect you just as well despite you being such a smartiepants? Wink

In my area we've had a number of sink-holes open up where garden walls and roads have collapsed into them because of Deneholes. They date back centuries not decades. Similarly there was an entire street in Stoke some years back that was condemned about 50 years after build due to issues with the ground underneath which residents were entirely unaware of until a few of the houses started to fall in on themselves.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 12:56 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
I am against Trident. I've never said or even intimated that I'm in favour of it. It's not a deterrent since we'd never use it, even in retaliation.

AFAIK only Corbyn has stated he wouldn't push the button. It's an interesting one, I believe even at the height of the cold war the ruskies wouldn't pull the trigger either. So realistically any threat lies with whatever bottle rockets the North Koreans come up with.
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Nexus Icon
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PostPosted: 13:16 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
I am against Trident. I've never said or even intimated that I'm in favour of it. It's not a deterrent since we'd never use it, even in retaliation.

AFAIK only Corbyn has stated he wouldn't push the button. It's an interesting one, I believe even at the height of the cold war the ruskies wouldn't pull the trigger either. So realistically any threat lies with whatever bottle rockets the North Koreans come up with.


Well, them and the Yanks. Trump insists there's no point in having nukes unless you use them and he hasn't ruled out nuking Europe. So there's that.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 13:33 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
I am against Trident. I've never said or even intimated that I'm in favour of it. It's not a deterrent since we'd never use it, even in retaliation.

AFAIK only Corbyn has stated he wouldn't push the button.

We've been over this.

It's not a case of him "pushing the button" since we'd never use them a first strike weapon. It comes down to what he'd put into the letters of last resort, which could be "Sail into St. Petersburg and learn Russian.". Similarly, Sharia could (and knowing her, probably has) written "Do what Uncle Sam says".

So that leaves London getting glassed and the Vanguard / Dreadnought captains making the call based on their orders.

Even if we have any in service (we have a tendency to retire ships before replacements are in service) and even if they're at sea and even if they actually function, it comes down to whether they'd follow those orders.

Consider the situations under which this happens:

1) Global thermonuclear war, in which case our contribution is utterly irrelevant anyway.

or

2) A missile or two being lobbed from Iran or NorKor. Just at us, rather than the Great Satan, apparently. What do? Glass Tehran or Pyongyang in retaliation? To what end? They've probably shot their bolt, and we don't really do vengeance (sadly). Uncle Sam might enjoy doing the job for us as a casus belli anyway.

or

3) Some boat sailing up the Thames and going pop. In which case, who do you even retaliate against? Fake news! Would you kill millions just on an accusation?

They'll never be used, or at least not in a way that anyone will be around to analyse afterwards.
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Jewlio Rides Again LLB
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PostPosted: 13:58 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:


If you're going to make stuff up, at least try to make it believable.


HAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA

The most delicious irony I've ever seen.
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arry
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PostPosted: 15:13 - 16 May 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:

If you're going to make stuff up, at least try to make it believable.

Try 4ft a year not 20ft, to be more accurate.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/environment/10040732/The-desperate-battle-to-save-our-coastline.html


Oh sorry, didn't realise I was going to press with my 2 minute post and everything needed fact checking- has that upset your sandy vagina? Laughing

But in principle you haven't disagreed that governmental intervention can have disastrous impacts on people and their homes without them having prior knowledge of any particular issue or its implications? Good at least we're on the same page on something.
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