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Stolen Bikes/Peds In That London

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st3v3
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PostPosted: 10:47 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I get that many are at it, but what does locking them away actually achieve? it stops 1 man from being part of the activity for xx time but it doesn't stop the rate it happens or others taking that mans place - so what does it achieve?

What does it cost completely to lock 1 up for 6 months?
Compared to it not helping the cause.. I'm trying to understand the benefit of time in prison and whether it's cost effective.
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arry
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PostPosted: 10:53 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey I'm all for setting up weekly gassing sessions but some people find that a bit too Third Reich for their tastes.
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DRZ4Hunned
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PostPosted: 11:11 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
I get that many are at it, but what does locking them away actually achieve? it stops 1 man from being part of the activity for xx time but it doesn't stop the rate it happens or others taking that mans place - so what does it achieve?

What does it cost completely to lock 1 up for 6 months?
Compared to it not helping the cause.. I'm trying to understand the benefit of time in prison and whether it's cost effective.


It acts as a deterrent to their future criminal actions and also others. If their gang mates see them getting off with a slap on the wrist, they'll be more likely to continue, but if they see them locked up for 5 years they might then reconsider. I'd happily pay more taxes to get em off the streets.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 11:24 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
I get that many are at it, but what does locking them away actually achieve?

It stops that thief from stealing bikes while they're inside.


st3v3 wrote:
but it doesn't stop the rate it happens

Interesting fact. Can you share your source please.


st3v3 wrote:
so what does it achieve?

It stops that thief from stealing bikes while they're inside.

st3v3 wrote:
I'm trying to understand the benefit of time in prison

It stops that thief from stealing bikes while they're inside.


Hey, as it turns out, attempted robbery carries a 6 year tariff if you pick the wrong target.

But apparently the number of robberies in That London are limited by the Thieves' Guild rather than the number of available pikies, so another one will just fill his quota while he's inside. It's true, I read it on the internets.
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vice
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PostPosted: 11:59 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
I get that many are at it, but what does locking them away actually achieve? it stops 1 man from being part of the activity for xx time but it doesn't stop the rate it happens or others taking that mans place - so what does it achieve?

What does it cost completely to lock 1 up for 6 months?
Compared to it not helping the cause.. I'm trying to understand the benefit of time in prison and whether it's cost effective.


what's your grand solution then?
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Paddy.
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PostPosted: 12:02 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

vice wrote:
what's your grand solution then?


Buy shit car, no need for bike. Laughing
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bamt
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PostPosted: 12:05 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:

What does it cost completely to lock 1 up for 6 months?
Compared to it not helping the cause.. I'm trying to understand the benefit of time in prison and whether it's cost effective.


It is around £30k - £60k per year, depending on type of prison etc.

So, it would be cheaper to give them a new bike, insure and pay their test fees than jail them for riding a stolen, uninsured bike with no license. Not much of a deterrent though.
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vice
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PostPosted: 12:09 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paddy. wrote:
vice wrote:
what's your grand solution then?


Buy shit car, no need for bike. Laughing


or lock it up better, according to the met

it's our own fault, you know for owning something that someone wants to steal
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AshWebster
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PostPosted: 13:12 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamt wrote:
st3v3 wrote:

What does it cost completely to lock 1 up for 6 months?
Compared to it not helping the cause.. I'm trying to understand the benefit of time in prison and whether it's cost effective.


It is around £30k - £60k per year, depending on type of prison etc.

So, it would be cheaper to give them a new bike, insure and pay their test fees than jail them for riding a stolen, uninsured bike with no license. Not much of a deterrent though.


said it before, and ill say it again, they need to change the punishment for 100% proven guilty thefts. fingers cut off etc.

I watched a documentary about Russian prisons the other day. they don't fuck about. Drug smugglers / robbers doing hard time and I mean harsh conditions. Why are we so nanny state over here.
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Jmoan
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PostPosted: 16:45 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamt wrote:
st3v3 wrote:

What does it cost completely to lock 1 up for 6 months?
Compared to it not helping the cause.. I'm trying to understand the benefit of time in prison and whether it's cost effective.


It is around £30k - £60k per year, depending on type of prison etc.


People keep saying that but where's the breakdown of the costs.
I'm going to assume the bulk of that is floats around in brown envelopes.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 17:15 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also consider the opportunity benefit of pausing their procreation while they're doing porridge.
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arry
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PostPosted: 17:32 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
Also consider the opportunity benefit of pausing their procreation while they're doing porridge.


Nope, not having that one. Ho's gonna ho. It ain't the bitches going in the slammer, and they're gonna get some reggae reggae stick from somewhere regardless of whether Tyrone is doing a 6 stretch.
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vice
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PostPosted: 17:36 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
Also consider the opportunity benefit of pausing their procreation while they're doing porridge.


and the slight hope of them getting shanked to death by another inbred cretin

edit: although most of the time they're in there with mates, but no honour among thieves and all that. Wishful thinking
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st3v3
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PostPosted: 18:25 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:

st3v3 wrote:
but it doesn't stop the rate it happens

Interesting fact. Can you share your source please.
Who was it who posted at the start of the thread the figures of increased theft over the last 12 months? Wink The logical conclusion from those figures alone show the rate it happens at hasn't stopped. Thumbs Up

I'm just confused why everyone chants 'lock them away' when these figures show it costs more and doesn't actually help. Is it just an expensive peace of mind thing?
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andys675
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PostPosted: 18:26 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

there's been 4 bikes nicked local to me recently where the owner has put a CCTV clip of the theft up on facebook for all to see that nothing has been done to thwart the lowlife scum from stealing their bike's other than a steering lock, and they're pushed away in seconds.
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 20:03 - 04 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
Get out there, nick the bastards (or run them over, I don't care) and lock them up for a long time.
What does this actually achieve? They're dumped in a cell for a couple months at taxpayers expense and no obligation of remorse.

It's not a deterrent.

My point was that the police were putting the blame on manufacturers and owners for not sufficiently engaging in a security arms-race against these young thugs. Without some sort of negative consequence they'll go on to be career criminals. When you're happy to wield machetes, knives and acid in the street what won't you go on to do? If jail is no deterrent and the police don't see the point in tackling the problem themselves then what's left? We either accept that an underclass is out there looking to hurt and rob us with impunity, or we fight back with equal ferocity when it happens and hope that the state will turn a blind eye to that too. Anarchy or a possibly inadequate punishment/deterrent, which do you choose?
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st3v3
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PostPosted: 11:04 - 05 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
We either accept that an underclass is out there looking to hurt and rob us with impunity, or we fight back with equal ferocity when it happens and hope that the state will turn a blind eye to that too. Anarchy or a possibly inadequate punishment/deterrent, which do you choose?
I guess the state is proving it prefers an inadequate deterrent I just wish it didn't cost a whole lot of our cash to do it.

They aren't yet to realize or care that when you catch someone who isn't bothered about the consequences you can't punish them effectively. I don't have a grand solution but it doesn't take a genius to see prison isn't working, otherwise we wouldn't have teenagers scooting round riot with hammers robbing people in broad daylight down the high street.

another thread wrote:

I watched a few videos about motorcycle theft in London and in every single video I saw thieves on scooters using angle grinders. They didn't even care about noise (also from alarm) and people nearby... actually people passing by were just ignoring what was happening.
Maybe people seeing this need to give said thugs a good kicking on the spot for having the audacity? 2 wrongs don't make a right but it might save everyone more hassle in the long run.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 13:16 - 05 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
[locking them up] doesn't stop the rate it happens [...] Who was it who posted at the start of the thread the figures of increased theft over the last 12 months? Wink The logical conclusion from those figures alone show the rate it happens at hasn't stopped. Thumbs Up

Because they're not being locked up. Not soon enough, and not for long enough.

You're doing a great job of arguing that soft sentences don't halt or deter crime. Please continue.
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ThatDippyTwat
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PostPosted: 13:51 - 05 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
Maybe people seeing this need to give said thugs a good kicking on the spot for having the audacity?


Keyboard warrior antics aside, are you going to rush 2+ balaclava'd up cunts with a wielding a grinder, possibly machete's or acid, that clearly don't give a shit about anything other than taking that bike and not getting nicked in the process of doing it?

Thought not.
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st3v3
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PostPosted: 20:38 - 05 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
st3v3 wrote:
[locking them up] doesn't stop the rate it happens [...] Who was it who posted at the start of the thread the figures of increased theft over the last 12 months? Wink The logical conclusion from those figures alone show the rate it happens at hasn't stopped. Thumbs Up

Because they're not being locked up. Not soon enough, and not for long enough.

You're doing a great job of arguing that soft sentences don't halt or deter crime. Please continue.


I can't see it, if someone nicking a bike gets caught and serves 6 months and decides they've learned a lesson so will reform and stop then it would happen less, and the problem would decrease. It hasn't, it's increasing. How is prison helping?
Quote:
“This failure really matters. It matters to the public purse: this cycle of reoffending costs up to £13 billion a year.”

David Cameron, 8 February 2016
If prison is a real solution then I would hate to see the system not working. Shocked Rolling Eyes

ThatDippyTwat wrote:


Keyboard warrior antics aside, are you going to rush 2+ balaclava'd up cunts with a wielding a grinder, possibly machete's or acid, that clearly don't give a shit about anything other than taking that bike and not getting nicked in the process of doing it?

Thought not.
Keyboard warrior? For having an opinion? Laughing I don't recall threatening to go out and do it. Neutral But as it happens, yes, when my NS was nicked 10 years ago I jumped on my other and chased them down the cycle path, kicking the pillion off the back. Would I want to approach 2 thugs with a grinder? hell no, nobody sets out in a morning wanting that.
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ScottT
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 05 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
Maybe people seeing this need to give said thugs a good kicking on the spot for having the audacity? 2 wrongs don't make a right but it might save everyone more hassle in the long run.


Waste of time and you're more likely to end up inside yourself, the answer is if you cant beat them join them.
Get a few mates, buy some 125 scooters, taxed, insured and mot'd, take off the number plate and ride round looking for these scum, when you find them rob them, (if you're the sort of person who would give them a good kicking, this wont be a problem for you) take their expensive trainers and designer hoodys off them, ride a couple of 100yds away and burn their gear in the street and where they can see it being burnt.
Its a minor crime, it wont get reported and if it did there's not much chance of the police doing anything about it.
If you did happen to get stopped the worse you'll get is a fine for no number plate, unless you can convince them it fell off.

Meanwhile some chav scum is left staring at the burnt out mess that used to be his prized trainers and hoody (get someone to video the look on his face).
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vice
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PostPosted: 20:54 - 05 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

If they’re foreignese they should be shipped the fuck out and banned from coming back. If they’re locals the sentences for offenders and escpecially reoffenders should be tougher, most of them are out in a couple weeks or months, it’s a joke, the reason they do it is because the risk is worth it. If they got a hand lopped off like in sand land, you could bet your left nut there wouldn’t be a second time... who’d wipe their ass? Oh right the taxpayer again probably.

There’s a few things that stop people committing crime, morals/ethics of which they have none and fear, they are not afraid. If they started disappearing and bodies started turning up, their mates would probably think twice.

Not sure if London, but still funny, too bad his head didn’t end up under that wheel

https://i.imgur.com/5KVALTh.gifv
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M.C
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PostPosted: 00:20 - 06 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

vice wrote:

Not sure if London, but still funny, too bad his head didn’t end up under that wheel

Boris bike so a pretty safe bet. Helmetless rider tho, they shouldn't have pursued him Tut Tut
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 17:42 - 06 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

st3v3 wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
Because they're not being locked up. Not soon enough, and not for long enough.

You're doing a great job of arguing that soft sentences don't halt or deter crime. Please continue.

I can't see it, if someone nicking a bike gets caught and serves 6 months

They don't though, do they? Until they make the mistake of targeting someone newsworthy, they go through the revolving door of justice, being handed out civil injunctions / criminal behaviour orders (badge of honour), fines (not paid), community service (not served), or suspended sentences (got off with it, innit).

Even if sent to gaol, they're never going to serve six months anyway, since it'll be disposed of summarily in the magistrates' court, they'll be given at the very most 6 months, of which they'll serve at most 3, and punted to an open prison as soon as possible.


st3v3 wrote:
How is prison helping?

Let's help it to help us by actually using it. It's one of the very few things for which I don't begrudge being taxed.

We could start with a 3-strikes rule, and then move up to gassing.
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vice
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PostPosted: 17:48 - 06 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:


We could start with a 3-strikes rule, and then move up to gassing.


or just gas them a little more each time

M.C wrote:

Boris bike so a pretty safe bet. Helmetless rider tho, they shouldn't have pursued him Tut Tut


you never know, he probably knicked that too...

"boris" bike in gambia

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02768/gambia_2768568b.jpg
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