Anybody got a car license recently?

[lingeringstin...]

I've tried looking for relevant info about something but can't find any.

I've had a full bike license since 1996. I recently decided to also get a car license. As my motorcycle license is from before 1997 it can be used as a provisional for a car. This information is pretty much impossible to find on the DVLA website anywhere, but if you do an online check of your license on their official website you can get what's called a "check code" that spells out everything you are entitled to with your current license. This costs nothing and you should do it just to make sure of what DVLA has about you as we all know they are a bunch of retarded, lying, halfwit morons who screw up repeatedly. Anyway, you can print out the check code in PDF form and it's an official record of your DVLA shit that's valid for 21 days.

OK, having said all that the point is that the check of my full motorcycle license that I've had since 1996 entitles me to drive the usual various things but ALSO can be used (as stated in the check code which I have a valid current copy of) to PROVISIONALLY DRIVE (the actual words on the check code) among other things, category B, which means car.

Now, having carefully ascertained all this relevant information and printed off the official document from the DVLA stating all this, my missus went to her insurers to see about having me put on her insurance so I could L-plate her car and do my provisional shit that way.

They flatly refused. Various other insurances were consulted and also refused.

Apparently several phone calls were made between DVLA and the insurers the upshot of which was that as I've had a potential provisional car for the past 20 years no insurance will touch me. Their view is that anybody with a provisional license for that long is unable to be insuired under any circumstances. Clearly they just tick boxes and the computer says no, and there is no way to refute this.

Apparently, if all the assorted gimps are to be believed, no human being in history with a full motorcycle license obtained before 1997 has ever tried to actually use it as a provisional car license 20 years later. Apparently even the scrotes at DVLA don't believe it can be done even though this information is right there on their website and on my official check code.

SO...

This will undoubtedly be another DVLA-associated fiasco that will run and run. My question is has anybody else with a full motorcycle license from before 1997 ever used it as a provisional for a car, and if so what were the insurance complications and how can I get this shit accomplished.

I am not about to start all over from scratch and apply for a first provisional car license (£34) and lose all my years of valid driving history on a bike just to get a fecking car license and lose my motorcycle entitlement, which is guaranteed to happen if I apply for a first provisional car license now. I do not by law have to chuck everything down the shitter and start all over and retake my CBT and motorcycle test and all the rest of it all over again just because retarded DVLA morons don't know how their shit works and insurers make it up as they go. I have played by the rules since the beginning and the DVLA information on their official website tells me I can use my license as a provisional for a car, but nobody seems to think it can actually be done. Surely I am not the first person with a bike license to ever decide years later to get a car entitlement as well.

[andyscooter]

did mine last year

I had my provisional since I was 17 I'm now 38 so same sort of time

I bought and insured my own car to have extra lessons in only cost me a few hundred quid

not sure why you are having so many problems
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gilera runner vxr200 (chavped)
if its spelt wrong its my fat fingers and daft auto correct on my tablet

[Rogerborg]

[Pjay]

Just get driving lessons from a school and then pass your test.

Bingo!
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struan80 - I'll go first - satisfied tick 1

[Jmoan]

With you paying for them on the DVLAs behalf presumably

There's always the common breaking the law right to travel path if you're in the mood for trouble.

[lingeringstin...]

I think this is going to be a case of doing the driving school thing, which is a pain in the butt but it's the only thing I can think of that will work.

The missus has a new Mini so her insurance quoted absolutely thousands to put me on her insurance for a little while. The local insurance brokers in town made a bunch of phone calls and got idiotic answers from others as well.

One company I spoke to on the phone today said they could do it for some astronomical price but only if I bought my own shitty cheap car and applied for a new first provisional car license from scratch, but they couldn't accept my Motorcycle license as a provisional under any circumstances even though I pointed out it was all perfectly legit according to DVLA. I argued the toss but they just weren't having it so I decided it was a waste of time speaking to them. You simply can't MAKE insurance companies play by the book if they don't want to. Makes you wonder just how valid their fucking insurance is if they can just make up their own rules as they go.

[lingeringstin...]

[lingeringstin...]

I just spoke to a major insurance broker on the phone, the one I've got my bike insurance with but they do cars and all the rest of it, and they didn't have a clue what I was talking about when I said a full motorcycle license issued before 1997 could be used provisionally for car etc.

BUT, to be fair after much waffle and scrutinizing the DVLA website the guy on the phone did accept that it is indeed a real thing only nobody knows about it. No one at the insurance place had ever heard of such a thing and I didn't even know of it until a day or so ago and I've had my license for like 20 years.

I figure there's a lot of motorcyclists out there who don't know they're walking around with a perfectly valid provisional car license.

Unfortunately none of that addresses the issue that it is impossible to put me on anybody's insurance for provisional purposes using my perfectly legitimate bike license unless I pay absolutely astronomical mountains of money for it. Seems that insurance, as usual, is just a money making scam.

[carvell]

I must be missing something here surely!

Unless you have some kind of medical exemption, everyone's driving licence includes the ability to provisionally drive a car, doesn't it? Doesn't matter what any of the other categories are, you could have a full tractor licence or whatever, but you will still always have provisional car.

I passed my bike test in 2003 and my car test in 2004. My pink driving licence after my bike test pass included the provisional car entitlement. No problem. Not sure what all this 'pre 1997' stuff is about?

I think you're overthinking it and asking too many questions. The reason that the insurers seem like they don't know what they're talking about is that no-one asks these kind of questions.
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Yamaha TDM 850

[Jardine]

I used to work for More Than, shit insurance company but we accepted provisional drivers, the longer the person had their provisional the better usually.

And then when they passed their test the price rocketed because they had only had their licence for a few days.

It's all system generated premiums, unfortunately some insurance companies are just a load of shit. I've worked for several now and the only one I've seen that doesn't make things complicated are Hastings.

But give more than a go, their systems are ancient so you might get round this with them. Also since leaving they haven't updated it yet according to a friend who still works there. Your wife would have to be the Policyholder and main driver though.
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CG125 1991[Sold] YBR 125 2009[SOLD] SV650s 1999-CBR600F-H 87
[Mod1 Passed 23/05/2016] [Mod2 Passed 09/06/2016] Update: I like cake
BCF BBQ 2017 I was the one who dropped the SV haha

[lingeringstin...]

The thing that pisses me off is that the thieving scumbag insurance people aught to know what they're doing without me having to explain it to them. They shouldn't be allowed to extort money from people if they don't even know how the law works. At least some of the morons I spoke to recently flatly refused to accept that my full motorcycle license was valid as a car provisional, which either makes them outright liars or incompetent which begs the question of how legit their insurance cover actually is. They just make up the rules as they go along.

[Rogerborg]

I'm confused, why is the word "motorcycle" even coming up in the conversation?

They're asking about category B provisional entitlement, you (your missus) tells them what your online licence record says about category B provisional entitlement: why is the conversation continuing?

[UPDATE]
Oh, I've re-read the original post. It's the 20+ years of entitlement that's causing problems.

Tell them you've just got it. Get full licence without crashing. Zero issues.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Northern Monkey]

Have you bough a fireblade yet? They're the ideal 1st bike
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Fisty: after polishing the tank with the glistenng beads of sweat from my full hot scrotum, I filled the headrace bearings with 10cc of my manmilk

[duhawkz]

[Teflon-Mike]

Tiss true, you don't have a 'motorcycle' licence. What you have is a FULL UK DRIVING LICENCE.. With 'full-entitlements' as endorsed on that licence for different vehicle categories, for tests passed, and 'provisional entitlement' for all others.

There IS only ONE licence. Just different entitlements. Get 3 points for speeding on a bike, you get three points on your licence. Get another three points for speeding in a car, they get added to the three on your licence; you dont have 3 against bike and three against car; you have six. Get twelve, you loose the licence; end of; you cant say "Oh, well, that was just my CAR licence... I'll just ride the bike" you loose your licence you loose your licence and ALL entitlements on it; works both ways about. So you have a FULL UK DRIVING LICENCE, not a 'bike' licence. Got it?

That bit of semantics, hasn't changed to my knowledge, since they centralized licence issuing at DVLA some-time I think in the '70's.

AFAIK there is nothing in the 'granddad-rights' to confound that, and the only thing that changed circa '97 was the introduction of the DAS scheme, and the creation of the A1 'lightweight' entitlement.

I suspect, that the 'niggle' is that you are telling the ins-co's that you have a motorbike licence, that offers provisional car entitlement, RATHER than telling them you have a "full UK driving licence".... held since 1996.....

Same erroneous notions you have that some-how there are 'different' licences for bike and car, would likely mean they 'assume' that you have full car entitlement on that 'full-UK-Driving licence', until they ask or check... but you have't lied to them, you DO have full UK DRIVING licence..... not your fault that 99.5% of the UK licence holders pass car tests before adding any other groups to it, if ever, so it's 'usual' Full-UK Driving-Licence, is presumed to have full car entitlement on it...

I Put Snowie on the Chavic policy a couple of times; similar situation; first time round she had only ever had a provisional; I think since circa '93, and perpetually L-Plated on 125's on it. Question did get raised; "So why has she never taken her test?" to which I replied, "She's never driven a car! She's been riding a little 125 motorbike on L's to get to and from work".. "Oh! That explains it!" They replied.. and ramped my premium up astronomically.... from aprox £300 a year to I think £350!

Second time was after she'd passed her bike tests, just ahead of 3DL changes, September 2012; and keeping the ball rolling, booked her in for some car lessons.. declaring that she had a 'full-UK-Driving licence' didn't raise an eyebrow, until they queried entitlements on it, and no, she doesn't have 'full' car entitlement on her UK driving licence.... she's got motorcycle entitlement... "Ah! OK!" was reply, and I think that added only a tenner to the premium!

Something we may have to revisit at some point; as she never finished the lessons; she was in a car accident when she was younger, and REALLY gets claustrophobic in a car.. but still.

I suspect the fact you are trying to get cover on a 'New' (not-so!) Mini, isn't helping; ISTR that is in a peculiarly high insurance bracket, and that you are inadvertently falling into a trap set to catch the kiddies running the second driver on mummies policy scam to get round it. But just a suspicion.

For lols, could be worth running a few quote comparisons on other smaller and cheaper hatch-backs; according to a couple of my kids, the Nissan Micra, a few years back, fell into an insurance 'shaddow', an old grannies car, with few recorded claims against them dropping off the ins-co's radar, until kiddies started buying them 'cheap' cos cheap to insure, when grannies hit 70 and stopped renewing thier licences, and put them back on the scanner shunting folk whilst checking face-broke alerts! Lol.

Last sprogette reports that, I think it's the Fiat Tipo that is the 'smart price' successor to that one, and cheapest car for new driver to insure... she was rather put-out, that she couldn't claim my Chavic.... they wanted £2K 'more' a year to put her on the dang policy when she hit 17! When that had at one point had a similar 'old-fogies' slip under the radar ins-co rep, until they cottoned on to the Fast & Furious inspired teens inheriting granny's car, painting them with flip metallic from Halfrauds and attaching "Spooner" stickers & spoilers! Lol!

B-U-T... is likely that new driver loading on anything is likely going to be a bit of a kick-in.

My advice is that it's probably going to work out 'cheapest' to go get commercial lessons; competition is fierce and there are some daftly low offers around; They all seem to be "Learn to drive from £99" round here; only difference is whether you get a instructor turn up in a shiny new VW Cabriolet, or a rather care worn Nissan blue-Bird, and how many hours you get for it! Some of them work out at less than £10 an 'almost' hour! More typically they seem to be about £25 p/h, after £99 intro offer for five or six has expired; but hey-ho.

Old Dogs and new tricks? You may struggle on some of the pedantry of how to hold a steering wheel, (like Snowie!) or 'something', probably trying to do shoulder checks and life-savers, and being moaned at for not keeping your eyes on the road! OR.. could go the other way, and after a twenty minutes to show you know how to work a clutch and what to do at a round-about... provided you don't try 'filtering' like you do on the bike, or anything daft! Be deemed test ready after two or three hours picking up the current test tips.

Test passed? You declare FULL UK DRIVING LICENCE.. held since 1996! As second driver on the policy... let them challenge the duration of UK 'car' entitlement endorsed on that IF they ask or ask you to send photo-copy of your licence!

And let the missus do the talking... play dumb, don't over complicate the issue; they are only shoe-shop assistants that have found somewhere they can sit to do their selling! Don't give them too much to think about, let them ask!
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[Rogerborg]

I AM NOT A SHIP!
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[sickpup]

[duhawkz]

[sickpup]

[duhawkz]

Yes I understand that he has a licence.

I asked you on what basis he would be prosecuted for sending an application for a new / first provisional licence when he already has a license, assuming he used all the correct details that are on his existing licence.

I suspect what will happen is that the computer will find his existing record and refuse to issue one, they will then send a letter saying something to the effect of.

"You already have a driving licence, if its been lost or stolen please fill in the correct form and pay the fee and we'll send it to you. Kthnkxbye"

It probably happens all the time, people apply for a provisional licence, don't pass or what ever then lose their licence and reapply for a new one.

Why would they prosecute him for being a dumbass,

Stupidity is not yet a crime, though sometimes i wish it was
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"The guy is a worthless cunt and I honestly believe I would be a slightly happier person if he died." - Chris-Red

[chris-red]

Have you tried an online quote? It sounds like you are telling them too much. Do an online quote for new busieness with your missus insurer and see how much it comes out as.

I have friends whom have had driving licences 10+ years before passing a test and getting a car. We all got them at 18 to get us into pubs.
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Well, you know what they say. If you want to save the world, you have to push a few old ladies down the stairs.
Skudd:- Perhaps she just thinks you are a window licker and is being nice just in case she becomes another Jill Dando.
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[sickpup]

[Jmoan]

Why should it matter to the insurance company so long as he's not banned or some nutter with umpteen points and he has proof he can drive something.