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| Rogerborg |
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Rogerborg
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Falco
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| Rogerborg |
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Rogerborg
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 Posted: 13:59 - 19 Jul 2017  Post subject: |
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| Falco wrote: | the ire on BCF seems far more often aimed at the lower end of the pay scale, than the upper. |
mpd did actually raise a valid point, that the upper crust are a cheery bunch of bandits, while the teeming masses grouse while they grasp.
I'm all for replacing CEOs with 3 line algorithms too, it should be said.
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| Posted: 14:08 - 19 Jul 2017 Post subject: |
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| Suntan Sid wrote: | If the shareholders, of the parent company running the franchise, |
It's not really a franchise is it? Southern get paid a fee to run it for the government. They do not take profit.
| Suntan Sid wrote: | would stop fecking about and agree terms, the problem would go away. |
I don't believe it would go away. They've met union demands all along and the unions just move the goal posts. I don't actually believe this series of strikes on that line is anything more than becuase the unions can have a direct pop at the Tories and hurt the government financially.
Some of these Southern drivers already operate DOO trains on other Southern routes, with no safety issues and no striking. Why?
| Suntan Sid wrote: | But the fact remains, as long as there are people on strike the greater the shareholder's profits, (people on strike don't get paid)! |
Apart from union pay.
| Suntan Sid wrote: | As usual public money disappearing into the bottomless pit of shareholder profits, for very little in return. |
If they'd stop striking, the treasury could make a return.
| Suntan Sid wrote: | There is no incentive whatsoever for the franchise operator to resolve the problem, they get paid whatever happens, profits go up; even when they fcuk it up the government just hands them more cash. |
And the unions are fully aware of this. It doesn't bother them, they only want to hurt the Tories.
| Suntan Sid wrote: | The franchise operator's top priority is to maximise its profits for its shareholders, (its customers and the government are secondary concerns), currently the shareholders are laughing all the way to the bank! |
See above. This is not a dispute between Southern and the unions, it's Corbyn's union mates kicking the Tories in the balls via a proxy war. The tax payers and commuters are the real victims here.
| Suntan Sid wrote: | But you knew all this anyway, it was discussed, ad nauseam, in the previous thread you started! |
Where you still deined the unions were doing anything other than protecting their workers rights. You know, like turning down a 24% pay rise. Do you really believe this? 
If it bores you, don't reply.
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| Posted: 14:20 - 19 Jul 2017 Post subject: |
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| Falco wrote: |
No one is forcing Southern to use unionised drivers (Union membership is not compulsory). If southern are so desperate to run the trains I am sure they could find some willing strike-breakers (at competitive rates). |
No, but you're told to do it on joining the industry. It's not legal to enforce it, but people joining education, health, rail etc are often visited by the union rep and encouraged to join up. My ex was put through this and even paid up party fees without realising she was funding the Labour party.
Even a handful going on strike is enough to cock up an entire network.
Before strikes, this line was under permanent cancellations from massive levels of guard sickness, which was clearly deliberate to cause disruption. Part of the ongoing dispute was because Southern wanted to be able to let the train run in unusual circumstances, such as the guard pulling a last minute sickie (but of course, not at the request of the union. cough, cough...)
| Falco wrote: | Are you suggesting that southern doesn't use it's own money to pay the drivers? Or that it can't decide the rates it pays them? |
Correct. They offered a ridiculous 24% and the union said "No".
| Falco wrote: | You are drawing an arbitrary distinction, the roles are not identical but they are certainly analogous. |
They may be to you. I see it differently. If I choose to pay a CEO of my company 24% more, I don't expect him to throw a hissy fit and shut the company for 3 days in a row.
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| Ribenapigeon |
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Ribenapigeon
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| Suntan Sid |
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Suntan Sid
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| Posted: 16:52 - 19 Jul 2017 Post subject: |
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| mpd72 wrote: | It's not really a franchise is it? Southern get paid a fee to run it for the government. They do not take profit. |
So there is no shareholder profit, anywhere at all? Really, pull the other one, it's just inconvenient for your argument.
As you know quite well Southern is run by two private companies, one of them just happens to run SNCF, they have shareholders they make money for their shareholders!
| mpd72 wrote: | Apart from union pay. |
Strike pay, a tiny fraction of normal pay, paid by the union, not the employer!
| mpd72 wrote: | If they'd stop striking, the treasury could make a return. |
It would be even better if the treasury stopped handing out millions of £s to the shareholders for no reason whatsoever!
| mpd72 wrote: | Where you still deined the unions were doing anything other than protecting their workers rights. You know, like turning down a 24% pay rise. Do you really believe this? |
Bullshit, I was and still am more concerned that a government is prepared to dole out millions of £s of public money to a private company every time they fuck it up.
You on the other hand seem quite happy with that
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M.C
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| Posted: 22:09 - 19 Jul 2017 Post subject: |
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| Suntan Sid wrote: | | mpd72 wrote: | It's not really a franchise is it? Southern get paid a fee to run it for the government. They do not take profit. |
So there is no shareholder profit, anywhere at all? Really, pull the other one, it's just inconvenient for your argument.
As you know quite well Southern is run by two private companies, one of them just happens to run SNCF, they have shareholders they make money for their shareholders!
| mpd72 wrote: | Apart from union pay. |
Strike pay, a tiny fraction of normal pay, paid by the union, not the employer!
| mpd72 wrote: | If they'd stop striking, the treasury could make a return. |
It would be even better if the treasury stopped handing out millions of £s to the shareholders for no reason whatsoever!
| mpd72 wrote: | Where you still deined the unions were doing anything other than protecting their workers rights. You know, like turning down a 24% pay rise. Do you really believe this? |
Bullshit, I was and still am more concerned that a government is prepared to dole out millions of £s of public money to a private company every time they fuck it up.
You on the other hand seem quite happy with that |
You're entitled to your own opinion, no matter how far fetched.
Good for you tiger.
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M.C
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Suntan Sid
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Ribenapigeon
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Lord Percy
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Rogerborg
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| Posted: 15:40 - 26 Jul 2017 Post subject: |
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Discrimination cases are discriminatory because discrimination, gotchya. 
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| Posted: 10:00 - 27 Jul 2017 Post subject: |
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In a society obsessed by free money from taking someone to court, it sounded like a pretty good idea to me. Making it as cheap as chips to try it on, will just encourage every feckless idiot to try it on when sacked for being crap.
Far too many people, getting far too much money, by lying in court or just trying it on.
PPI, whiplash, "Is it cos I is black/gay/disabled"....
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Last edited by - on 11:51 - 27 Jul 2017; edited 1 time in total |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 6 years, 268 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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