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Parking on the Pavement in London

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dn38416
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PostPosted: 10:12 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Parking on the Pavement in London Reply with quote

Ola

I've seen loads of references to how parking on the pavement in London is a massive no-no, but no actual references to the rules. (As far as i'm aware this is done on a council level, rather than London wide anyway). What about parking on a curb extended for traffic calming - that way you're not actually obstructing pedestrians?

Basically, quite often down my street there's normally one or two spaces for a car - rather than an inbetween space which is too small for a car but big enough for a bike. So by parking in that space i am denying some family saloon from parking in their own neighbourhood. There are curb extensions at the start of the street, where it juts out to narrow the road from both sides. Why can't i park on that?

The only legislation i've seen relating to this is Road Traffic Act 1988, Section 34 (b). But does a curb extension count as a footway...if it leads to nowhere?

It's London so it'll probably get nicked soon anyway.
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Tracer1234
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PostPosted: 10:19 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: Parking on the Pavement in London Reply with quote

dn38416 wrote:


It's London so it'll probably get nicked soon anyway.

This ^^^


Im sure Rog or others will be along soon to answer your other question soon though.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:46 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

any person who, on or after the appointed day in or on any urban road in Greater London parks a vehicle so that one or more of its wheels is resting on-

(a) any footway [i.e. pavement];
(b) any land (not being a footway) which is situated between two carriageways in any such road; or
(c) any grass verge, garden or space not falling within the foregoing paragraph (a) or (b);

shall be guilty of an offence and shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 1 on the standard scale

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lingeringstin...
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PostPosted: 11:20 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: You're screwed Reply with quote

My references for this are from my days as a courier which ended over ten years ago now but here's how it was.

No matter where you park a bike some car owner will think it's their right or even duty to have the spot you've parked your bike in. This even extends to motorcycle only parking bays.

Most buildings in London have the right of the pavement in front of or around them, sometimes marked by weird little markers imbedded in the concrete. Even if you could mount the pavement and park there a traffic warden with absolutely no grasp of the English language will be upon you in six seconds.

On urban side streets ignorant halfwits will put out traffic cones or planks on bricks or even signs up claiming the parking space outside their house on a public road. When you see this remove the obstacles, shout abuse in the general direction of the front door, park your bike there and take a photo. Mr or Mrs Retard will undoubtedly come home later and physically move your bike out of their "spot", possibly even knocking it out of the way with his car so that it ends up on it's side on the NO PARKING lines where the traffic wardens will immediately descend upon it. 99% of the time your photographic evidence will make no odds whatsoever when you try to contest the extortionate council parking fines.

In inner London cars used to regularly park sideways in motorcycle bays when I was a courier and it seemed like the generally Stormtrooper attitude of the traffic wardens didn't extend to this sort of behaviour for some reason. Consequently (and completely by an unknown means) when I found cars parked like this they often mysteriously sprouted radiator leaks or punctures. Must be something to do with the pain on the ground that says MOTORCYCLE PARKING ONLY.

In short if you park a bike anywhere in London, and I mean ANYWHERE, it spells disaster or theft, probably both.

But that's just my experience from back in the day, so it may be slightly different now but I doubt it.

As a health and safety note, always carry a really long, very sharp screwdriver as part of your standard motorcycle tool kit for roadside emergencies.
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barrkel
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PostPosted: 13:59 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you park on pavement that isn't privately owned you'll get fined sooner or later.

The typical signal for privately owned pavement is pavement lights - the building's basement extends out into the area of the pavement, so that section of pavement is actually within the boundary of a private property deed. Depending on the borough and the property owner, you can park on those lights without a problem. And depending on how enlightened the property owner is, there may even be ground anchors for motorcycles.

Boroughs I've safely parked all day long on private pavement include Islington and Hackney. But in Hackney you can park in any bay, as long as it's perpendicular to the kerb and ideally at the end of the bay. (Though there are exceptions around Hoxton Square.)

Here's an example of pavement lights and ground anchors on St John Street:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5247814,-0.1036021,3a,75y,34.99h,82.19t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sUc1L9WVAH0KUzS7wqOLJdA!2e0!5s20080701T000000!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

I can't speak for any other boroughs.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 14:43 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: You're screwed Reply with quote

lingeringstink wrote:
Even if you could mount the pavement and park there a traffic warden with absolutely no grasp of the English language will be upon you in six seconds.

https://i.imgur.com/HqlP3PQ.gif
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M.C
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PostPosted: 16:00 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you park on the pavement you have to cover your plate and be ready to throat punch any traffic wardens. Footprints of buildings seems to be ok.
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Andy_Pagin
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PostPosted: 17:22 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if there's any definition of 'Urban Road' or 'Greater London' in law.
Eg. Is the City of London 'Greater London'. I would have thought not since it's effectively a walled City state, Greater London being the shanty town built around it by the local paupers.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 17:28 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andy_Pagin wrote:
I would have thought not since it's effectively a walled City state, Greater London being the shanty town built around it by the local paupers.

That's my understanding. London's the city of London (the small center bit with its own popo etc.), Greater London's all the surrounding areas where the proles reside.
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dn38416
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PostPosted: 18:18 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.C wrote:
If you park on the pavement you have to cover your plate and be ready to throat punch any traffic wardens. Footprints of buildings seems to be ok.


Yeah i've been covering it just for security reasons, was wondering how they book you - do they go out of their way to take the cover off? Surely there will be some kind of H&S rule saying they shouldn't try, in case they do their back in.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 19:34 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

A traffic warden told me they will just lift a cover, need to electrify it Smile
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 20:15 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

dn38416 wrote:
M.C wrote:
If you park on the pavement you have to cover your plate and be ready to throat punch any traffic wardens. Footprints of buildings seems to be ok.


Yeah i've been covering it just for security reasons, was wondering how they book you - do they go out of their way to take the cover off? Surely there will be some kind of H&S rule saying they shouldn't try, in case they do their back in.


As always I'm ready to be corrected, but I believe Rog has pointed out in the past that it is actually an offence to cover your plate at any time, IIRC even on your own driveway.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 20:50 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.C wrote:
A traffic warden told me they will just lift a cover, need to electrify it Smile


Yes they are allowed to, have been for year but most of the wardens won't touch a cover for fear of getting blamed for damages.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 22:16 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andy_Pagin wrote:
I wonder if there's any definition of 'Urban Road' or 'Greater London' in law.

Urban road is defined in the same section that I linked to, the tl;dr version being anything with a speed limit up to 40mph.

Greater London is "The area comprising the areas of the London boroughs, the City and the Temples".


Commuter_Tim wrote:
As always I'm ready to be corrected, but I believe Rog has pointed out in the past that it is actually an offence to cover your plate at any time, IIRC even on your own driveway.

Or in a garage. It's a strict liability offence with no exceptions or defences at all that I can see.

I definitely do not secure a cover directly onto the plate with (not obviously) removable cable ties. Whistle
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hellkat
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PostPosted: 23:44 - 22 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: You're screwed Reply with quote

lingeringstink wrote:
that says MOTORCYCLE PARKING ONLY.


Just for the sake of pedantism, I think for the most part that those signs also say "between 7am and 7pm".

Interesting post, though.
Entirely true, parking in London is the divine right of everybody ... except for everybody else Laughing
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M.C
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PostPosted: 13:31 - 23 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:
dn38416 wrote:

Yeah i've been covering it just for security reasons, was wondering how they book you - do they go out of their way to take the cover off? Surely there will be some kind of H&S rule saying they shouldn't try, in case they do their back in.


As always I'm ready to be corrected, but I believe Rog has pointed out in the past that it is actually an offence to cover your plate at any time, IIRC even on your own driveway.

My cover has a plate peep hole but it's positioned so you can see the rear wheel Smile

Is I legit?
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Tigerlea
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PostPosted: 11:24 - 24 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.C wrote:
Commuter_Tim wrote:

As always I'm ready to be corrected, but I believe Rog has pointed out in the past that it is actually an offence to cover your plate at any time, IIRC even on your own driveway.

My cover has a plate peep hole but it's positioned so you can see the rear wheel Smile

Is I legit?


I have a cover with holes in it for the chain through the rear wheel.. which means you would have to rip the cover to lift it and see the plate.

But I only use this cover on my drive.
Because I don't want anyone removing the cover..

Legit? Probably not. Secure? Deffo.

Doubt I'd be able to use it in Londindium..
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el_oso
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PostPosted: 15:26 - 24 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Luckily I've not had to park in Westminster or Chelsea, which are the only two London boroughs that charge for m/c parking from what I can remember. I've been working in the city for a month or so now, and haven't had to fight to find a parking space yet.
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hellkat
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PostPosted: 09:23 - 25 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: You're screwed Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
https://i.imgur.com/HqlP3PQ.gif


Man, that gif just makes me want to smash the screen every time it hoves into view.

Mad
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 10:11 - 25 Jul 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if they do part time traffic wardens jobs in Milton Keynes? I'd be a right cunt Very Happy
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:31 - 25 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: You're screwed Reply with quote

I doubt you'd meet their ethics criteria - you seem to have some.

hellkat wrote:
Man, that gif just makes me want to smash the screen every time it hoves into view.

"It"? Shocked
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Tracer1234
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PostPosted: 11:16 - 25 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: You're screwed Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:


hellkat wrote:
Man, that gif just makes me want to smash the screen every time it hoves into view.

"It"? Shocked


https://media.giphy.com/media/4WHkXdDx8wjS0/giphy.gif
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Commuter_Tim
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PostPosted: 20:56 - 25 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: You're screwed Reply with quote

Tracer1234 wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:


hellkat wrote:
Man, that gif just makes me want to smash the screen every time it hoves into view.

"It"? Shocked


https://media.giphy.com/media/4WHkXdDx8wjS0/giphy.gif


Well Kradmelder left (presumably to start some sort of ethnic cleansing) so someone had to fill in.

I, for one, Welcome our new racist overlord Hellkat.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 23:45 - 25 Jul 2017    Post subject: Re: You're screwed Reply with quote

Commuter_Tim wrote:

Well Kradmelder left (presumably to start some sort of ethnic cleansing) so someone had to fill in.

I, for one, Welcome our new racist overlord Hellkat.


I miss Kradders. He was really good at propagating genocide Thumbs Up
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