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MCN review Suzuki's new GSX250R

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G
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PostPosted: 09:03 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.C wrote:

Shows how bad 'what bike' advice's on this forum Smile I can't think of anything worse than a restricted big bike, unless you're eyeing up taking your 'A tests'.

Lets say you also down geared to match the power... what would you dislike about the restricted bike over a fairly heavy 300cc or so bike?
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M.C
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PostPosted: 14:44 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
M.C wrote:

Shows how bad 'what bike' advice's on this forum Smile I can't think of anything worse than a restricted big bike, unless you're eyeing up taking your 'A tests'.

Lets say you also down geared to match the power... what would you dislike about the restricted bike over a fairly heavy 300cc or so bike?

If we take the usual recommendation (an FZS600), that's a 210kg bike with 47bhp. An R3's 42bhp and under 170kg (according to wikipedia). Is that extra 40ish kg worth a 5bhp gain?
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G
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PostPosted: 15:11 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

That wouldn't be my suggestion. My suggestion might be something like a SV650S or an older 600 sports bike.

However, let's say a 75kg rider. 285kg vs 245kg total so 86% of the weight of the bigger one for 89% of the power. Still a bit better power to weight, but not too far off.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 16:56 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
That wouldn't be my suggestion. My suggestion might be something like a SV650S or an older 600 sports bike.

However, let's say a 75kg rider. 285kg vs 245kg total so 86% of the weight of the bigger one for 89% of the power. Still a bit better power to weight, but not too far off.

So an extra 20ish kg for a 5bhp gain? And what 600 sports bike? I thought most of them were ineligible for A2.
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G
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PostPosted: 17:01 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Errr, that'd be 40kg Smile.

Benefit of the bigger bike is of course at some point for the sake of a little time you can derestrict it without spending anything extra and have a good bit more power in a chassis you know well.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 18:05 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

arry wrote:
Oldie wrote:
The guy complains that motorists assume that he's on a bigger bike and naturally pull to the side to let him pass

Maybe they're doing that because he's tailgating like a spastic.

Mmm, I find that I have to ride well back on the Ninja 250 in order to make it clear that I have no intention of overtaking.

If he's even thinking about making progress on a bike with about 3/4 the peak power, he's only kidding himself. Heck, the new Enfields claim more. Laughing
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 18:48 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

De-restricting bikes that were 33bhp or now 47bhp after two years doesn't work. Though in the first case there was no silly power to weight restriction.

Most older 400-1000cc bikes say, will be too old and wobbly after two years of restricted newbie, to feel good/rewarding or sometimes even safe at full power. The engines are coked up and gutless too. Add the biggest reason is that no matter what your first post test bike is, after two years it'll probably be boring you to sleep. Injecting a bit more power into it does not a new 2bikes for the price of one make.

However good it sounds when people spout it, it's often shit. Also a 47bhp 180kg bike, suddenly converted to 95bhp, does not make it more interesting or exciting.

You won't be able to throw it any harder into bends, brake harder or later, or have more damping or ground clearance. Also the bike will feel dull as the extra power is normally in the last few thousand rpm. If you've sampled all the midrange for two years, it ain't suddenly going to get more grunty sans restrictors. If your the type of rider that opens the throttle wider to go faster, you won't feel very blown away IMO.

When I joined BCF 15years or more ago. The advice to everyone coming through the door was pass your test and get the best sports bike 600 you can afford after.

The world has changed since then. Also it's like the fucking idiots that tell 2017 newbies to buy a 20year old two stroke 125, because automatically better is shit advice. In 2017 there are no 20year old two strokes to buy, (if everyone wanted one there wouldn't be enough to go around anyway, and no one can afford one). Also fucking millennials are generally dumb fuckwits that don't know how to hold a spanner, only a smart phone.

20years ago the sportsbike was king, and the vast majority of new riders probably went down that road, as bikes were booming and it was the age of money to burn, toys to play with, and the scene was huge racing following, bike meets, shows, pub nights etc.

All that's fucked off now, and we've had one or more devastating recession, and an austerity decade, where people coming into two wheels, wanted penny running costs and ways to save money and eek out fuel usage etc.

The burning round on noisy sports bikes in matching leathers just for the laugh and to show off decade is history now.

Point being 15year old advice ain't relevant or the same in 2017.
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G
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PostPosted: 21:20 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:

Most older 400-1000cc bikes say, will be too old and wobbly after two years of restricted newbie, to feel good/rewarding or sometimes even safe at full power. The engines are coked up and gutless too. Add the biggest reason is that no matter what your first post test bike is, after two years it'll probably be boring you to sleep. Injecting a bit more power into it does not a new 2bikes for the price of one make.

However good it sounds when people spout it, it's often shit. Also a 47bhp 180kg bike, suddenly converted to 95bhp, does not make it more interesting or exciting.

Plenty of people who's bikes I've helped derestrict have been very happy with the change.
Ok, this is from 33hp not 47hp. Only time I've found people feel 'meh' about it is 500cc twin commuters, where the extra isn't too noticable.
They haven't been noticeably 'coked up' or gutless after derestriction.
Only bike I've really found suffering from that was a RD350YPVS I bought from someone who told me he never went above 40mph really (and I would guess that was in top gear) - by the end of the first week of my ownership it was noticeably more perky.

A lot of new riders DO find more power fun and interesting.
I certainly did going from a KLR650 to a ZX6R - the power was the biggest 'wow' factor. Didn't really after that.
(Appreciated this is a bit more power to a bit less.)

There are plenty of options for 125cc 2 strokes. Fairly recently a friend was looking for his first 125. I went through the options and we looked at 2 and 4 stroke.
He was very pleased we settled on a NSR125 when he'd ridden another friend's 4 stroke. We found a good number of others we could have looked at too.
They aren't over priced yet and no, there aren't enough if everyone wants one - but they don't, they want a slower and massively more expensive R125 or whatever because it's got modern styling.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 22:13 - 11 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Errr, that'd be 40kg Smile.

Benefit of the bigger bike is of course at some point for the sake of a little time you can derestrict it without spending anything extra and have a good bit more power in a chassis you know well.

? 189kg wet according to wikipedia for the SV, 167kg for the R3.

Remember what you originally quoted? I can't think of anything worse than a restricted big bike, unless you're eyeing up taking your 'A tests'.
However if you only want an A2 bike I maintain the lighter bike will be more fun.

stevo as b4 wrote:
Also it's like the fucking idiots that tell 2017 newbies to buy a 20year old two stroke 125, because automatically better is shit advice. In 2017 there are no 20year old two strokes to buy, (if everyone wanted one there wouldn't be enough to go around anyway, and no one can afford one).

Depends, DTs were around 'til 07 and a few sold as late as '08. I don't think Aprilia gave up on 2-strokes until 2012, although they weren't quite the same. Sure it's an ever dwindling supply and an increasingly expensive option, but it probably still is option for a few more years, until they've all been locked away in sheds by people trying to reclaim their youth Wink
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 14:35 - 08 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

GSX250R appears to have a problem with E-Z-Blow headlight bulbs.

https://www.motorcyclenews.com/mcn-motorycles/2017/suzuki-gsx250r/suzuki-gsx250r-headlight-bulb-blown-twice

https://www.visordown.com/road-tests-first-rides/first-ride-suzuki-gsx250r-review

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear, Suzuki. Fix and recall, or full denial?
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biker7
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PostPosted: 21:48 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got a GSX250R. Great bike for town work. Looks the biz. Fuelling is good, I'm always away before most cars at the lights. I've ridden 1k miles this winter in the salt and no signs of crappy finish at all. Put together well. Once I added the Yoshi race can, turns heads everywhere. Large frame for a small engined bike - my mate thought I'd bought a Gixxer 750! Sure it's no Hayabusa, but I've got one of those, so that's ok. Down on bhp compared with other 1/4 litres but good torque which is great for my 100% urban rides. Apologies for being so positive but unlike some of the negative stuff on here my opinion of the bike is based on ownership not hearsay! Yes there are lighter, faster, cheaper etc bikes in the genre but I think Suzuki ( I have owned 10) rarely put out bad bikes imo. Of course we all like our bike otherwise we would ride something else. I do like to ride a bike before I rubbish it on a forum, mind. I look at some of the bikes you guys ride and smile but hey maybe I would be less critical if I actually rode the damn thing! Actually, I don't dislike many things on 2 wheels.
Bikers vary more! I have owned about 40 bikes in half a century. My Busa is easily the best but I have to say the GSX250R is about half way up the list.
Just saying! Very Happy
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Oldie
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PostPosted: 22:14 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oldie wrote:

I'm still not suggesting that it's a bad bike but I'd like to hear more about real world performance.


Just what I was looking for and I guess if it's ok for a Busa rider then it must be half decent. Thanks for the report.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 22:46 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

biker7 wrote:
Yes there are lighter, faster, cheaper etc bikes in the genre

Lighter, faster and cheaper.

If you're after torque, why not a CBR300R? Purely because the Suzuki badge?

Genuine question, I'm a 250 foggit as well.
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biker7
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PostPosted: 23:27 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
biker7 wrote:
Yes there are lighter, faster, cheaper etc bikes in the genre

Lighter, faster and cheaper.

If you're after torque, why not a CBR300R? Purely because the Suzuki badge?

Genuine question, I'm a 250 foggit as well.


I'm sure the Honda is a great little bike. In the scheme of things, virtually identical riding experience ie: slow but fun! I just prefer my Suzuki dealer to the Honda one.
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pepperami
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PostPosted: 23:31 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

biker7 wrote:
I've got a GSX250R. And said some positive stuff about a bike many slag off ! Very Happy


Good to hear some honest input Thumbs Up

How would it stack up against say a Hyosung gt250 or a Honda Superdream ie other 250’s?

Just interested Thumbs Up
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biker7
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PostPosted: 23:37 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oldie wrote:
Oldie wrote:

I'm still not suggesting that it's a bad bike but I'd like to hear more about real world performance.


Just what I was looking for and I guess if it's ok for a Busa rider then it must be half decent. Thanks for the report.


Thumbs Up Worlds apart my 2 bikes but in rush hour, across town I get home in about the same time....well slightly quicker on the 250 cos it fits in smaller gaps! No street cred mind although I think Suzuki's Moto GP graphics are up there with the best.
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biker7
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PostPosted: 23:45 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

pepperami wrote:
biker7 wrote:
I've got a GSX250R. And said some positive stuff about a bike many slag off ! Very Happy


Good to hear some honest input Thumbs Up

How would it stack up against say a Hyosung gt250 or a Honda Superdream ie other 250’s?

Just interested Thumbs Up


I would Imagine all 250's do a similar job - better than a 125 but still light enough to flick about. Some bikes look better than others, that's all. The best is the one we own of course. Very Happy
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pepperami
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PostPosted: 23:53 - 09 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

biker7 wrote:


I would Imagine all 250's do a similar job - better than a 125 but still light enough to flick about. Some bikes look better than others, that's all. The best is the one we own of course. Very Happy


Come stop sitting on the fence, tell us what you really think Wink
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biker7
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PostPosted: 00:02 - 10 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

pepperami wrote:
biker7 wrote:


I would Imagine all 250's do a similar job - better than a 125 but still light enough to flick about. Some bikes look better than others, that's all. The best is the one we own of course. Very Happy


Come stop sitting on the fence, tell us what you really think Wink


Well if we are talking 'silly money'..…..R3 by a mile!
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 07:28 - 10 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

biker7 wrote:
my mate thought I'd bought a Gixxer 750!


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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 09:03 - 10 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

biker7 wrote:
but I think Suzuki ( I have owned 10) rarely put out bad bikes imo.


I owned a GT500 from new back in 1977. The emasculated later brother of the T500.

It was the first and last Suzuki I owned until I bought a gen 1 Busa in 2007.

That bike was the only bike (in probably getting on for 100 bikes) I have owned in my 44 years of riding that I have nothing positive to say about and put me off Suzukis for 30 years. Bland, pigshit handling, horrible engine, no brakes, water absorbent electrics.

God, I hated that bike.

Therefore I have nothing valid to say about the Suzuki 250 other than its too small and is just another plain jane dressed in a ball gown.
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biker7
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PostPosted: 20:17 - 10 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:


I have nothing valid to say about the Suzuki 250 other than its too small


Rolling Eyes
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 21:07 - 10 Jan 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

I ain't ridden it, so don't know shit quite admittedly. But unlike the GSXR 125, they havnt tried to make it as class competitive as possible and priced to steal all sales away from the other brands.

On paper it's a bit meh! But it's all simple proven mechanicals and isnt expensive to make, so it should be cheap in its class, simple and cheap to repair or replace snapped off parts, seeing as it's not all magnesium and titanium or carbon fibre etc.

In theory a brilliant single cylinder engine at this size in a light enough trick enough chassis should be the best bike. Some just don't like singles though.

The KTM 390 should have cleaned up, but even if the engine is very eager and barely on the regulation power/weight limits, they couldn't build the bike well enough or finish it to a good standard, or provide a good enough spares/dealer back up.

If Honda or similar did the same thing they'd have the bike that KTM tried to dominate the A2 class with.

Aprilia should have done it too, as they had a brilliant chassis with the old RS125. It only needed a 45bhp 250-350cc single or twin shoe horned in to make it fun.

Kawasaki's 300 seemed ok and I like the looks better than the R3. But they've gone less sporty or focused with the new 400cc replacement on paper at least.

Maybe people buying these bikes want as much cc and torque as possible from an A2 bike, and they don't need light weight, or scalpel handling. Just like most commuters these days want to drive a TDI car with DSG, cos it's easier than having to really drive anything with a soul?

In this case you can see why the CBR500 cleans up, as it's what the buyers want, even if there's nothing CBR about it.
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