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is there a modern equivalent of the old zzr6? (wot bike m8?)

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ocatoro
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PostPosted: 16:33 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: is there a modern equivalent of the old zzr6? (wot bike m8?) Reply with quote

I'm always tempted to change the bike... i test rode some vaguely similar stuff and didn't take my fancy.

i tried the er6... didn't have the pace.

tried a new duke 690, also didn't have the pace and felt too small/narrow/odd.

I'm tempted by the look of several things, zx7r (but not sure of riding position), daytona 675 (similar ergo worries), xj6n (worried might feel slow also), street triple stands out... (will have to try one out, but then thought about fairings and how big/wide mine currently is and I like it), the new 1000sx thing is too dear for me. k1200s? (reviews say the power figure is dreaming and that it's slow), blackbird? (possibly not very "modern" at all)...

any suggestions or advice?

I'm thinking of going back on the bike for commuting so comfort and economy have to be at least "OK"... (the xj6n claims 200+ miles from a tank, which caught my eye). It'll be getting toured on, occasionally. has to have that "something" about it, and be at least as fast as my zzr....
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 16:53 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fazer 600?
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c_dug_the_bastard
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PostPosted: 17:04 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Closest modern bike I can think of that compares is probably a Vfr800 of some sort, in that they're both sub litre, fully faired, ~100bhp, sports tourers.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 17:09 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ZX7R riding position is the quintessence of the 90's. You sit inside the motorcycle rather than on it. When the rear suspension does what it should, then it's a pretty nice and comfortable motorcycle, but it's terrible in city.

I also enjoyed the engine, the sound, the power delivery, everything was just about right for you to have some fun, yet keeping it safe. The stability of the motorcycle at high speed is exeptional and gives you a lot of confidence.

There is also a lot of storage space under the seats. The rear seat may be swaped for a plastic one, which gives you even more space under it.

The only thing I changed were the front brake calipers. Nissin 4 pot calipers are a direct swap. The Tokico 6 pots were crap on my machine.

Lastly it is still a ''Superbike'', so it does require a certain physical fitness (core strength) to enjoy riding it. Very far from a ZZR600. Thumbs Up
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ocatoro
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PostPosted: 17:15 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

fazer just doesn't do it for me.

vfr is a good shout, I hadn't thought of the newer 800s. will have a mooch.

I really do like the zx7r... I've only sat on one in a showroom though so no reference for actually riding it. all I knew really was that the peg position means my legs are very comfortable. and that the zx9r parked next to it was more like my zzr in upright position. I do also then think... aside from gaining some speed and handling, it's no more modern etc than the zzr underneath the skin
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bacon
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PostPosted: 17:21 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ocatoro wrote:
fazer just doesn't do it for me.

vfr is a good shout, I hadn't thought of the newer 800s. will have a mooch.

I really do like the zx7r... I've only sat on one in a showroom though so no reference for actually riding it. all I knew really was that the peg position means my legs are very comfortable. and that the zx9r parked next to it was more like my zzr in upright position. I do also then think... aside from gaining some speed and handling, it's no more modern etc than the zzr underneath the skin


I love my zx7r, I had one as my only transport for several years also without issue, however they aren't particularly comfortable, 8k valve clearance checks, mine needed adjusting around 20k from memory, tokico 6 pots need regular maintenance and are a bar steward to bleed.

The zx9r would make a better commuter, it's more grunty, more roomy, more upright etc
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 17:21 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about a CBR600F4? Even a F3 if you don't have the money. The F4 has a DFi version as well (F4i). That seems very close to a ZZR600, although I've never had a chance to ride a CBR600.
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bluezedd
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PostPosted: 17:38 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ocatoro wrote:
fazer just doesn't do it for me.

vfr is a good shout, I hadn't thought of the newer 800s. will have a mooch.

I really do like the zx7r... I've only sat on one in a showroom though so no reference for actually riding it. all I knew really was that the peg position means my legs are very comfortable. and that the zx9r parked next to it was more like my zzr in upright position. I do also then think... aside from gaining some speed and handling, it's no more modern etc than the zzr underneath the skin


Which 9R did you look at? Was it a B model?

the C, E and F models destroy the ZZR in terms of being closer to modern handling, although the ZZR offers a fuel gauge, better dash, much more comfortable position. I can't talk for the B model, but as it's ZXR750 era, then I guess it's probably not modern feeling.

I'd avoid the 9R for soemthing similar to your ZZR. A lot of people tout the 9R as some sports tourer position, which is reasponable when you compare it to R6/R1, GSXR 1000 etc, but not the ZZR.

Honestly, I think you should be looking at large CC sports tourers, such as the blackbird that you mentioned, or VFR750/800 (heard vtec should be avoided though).
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 18:50 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

What's your budget?

When you say "at least as fast", do you mean:

Topping out at 150mph+
Accelerating between X mph and Y mph?
From point A to point B through the twisties.
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duhawkz
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PostPosted: 19:32 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ocatoro wrote:
fazer just doesn't do it for me.


Shame, he might have took his teeth out and give you a gummer
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stonesie
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PostPosted: 21:01 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tiger 800? It's surprisingly fun and good on fuel for your commuting / touring with plentiful luggage options. Also not that slow and will easily run with a 675 street triple. If your budget goes up to £5K then you can pick up a decent one for that.

Sprint ST? older, cheaper and a little more thirsty but the 1050 engine is brilliant. Probably the closest I have thought of to your zzr.

Bandit 1200 / 1250, the buggers are everywhere for a reason, good all rounder in faired or naked flavours, good VFM.

Blackbird, my friends rides really well but he is OCD on maintenance so it really doesn't show it's 40K miles at all, he's just been all round Europe on it with the mrs on the back and he loves it.

Just a few Ideas for you.
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 21:20 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Re: is there a modern equivalent of the old zzr6? (wot bike Reply with quote

ocatoro wrote:
tried a new duke 690, also didn't have the pace and felt too small/narrow/odd... the new 1000sx thing is too dear for me..


Isn't a brand new Duke 690 in the same ball park as an early S1000SX price-wise?
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 23:08 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems to me that your just bouncing around alot of ideas for bikes that you like the sound of irrespective of how or if they suit your brief/needs.

Firstly you gotta know what your plans are and what your going to be doing with it? So is regular commuting and touring definitely on the cards? Could you end up not doing any of these things and just want a fun or weekend bike?

Once decided forget jumping around all kinds of bike ideas you fancy, and draw up a list of must haves.

It sounds like you need to get a ZZR 600 replacement, but want something newer and possibly a bit faster or bigger cc?
How are you fixed for running costs? Big heavy but fast bikes are wallet eaters, so I'd really avoid big fast sports tourers like Blackbirds, Busa's and ZZR's unless you want to ride 100's of miles two up at 100mph+.

I'd also draw a line and say nothing more sporty in terms of riding position than a C/E model ZX9R. Whats the budget like, and do you want as modern and up to date as possible, or something old but comfy and good?

VFR's, ZX9R's Thunderaces, RF900's are all fairly cheap for a good condition bike. Newer stuff like BMW K1200's and Triumph 1050's are probably another few grand for a nice one.

What I don't think is any good to you or your requirements is any 600cc IL4, budget all around Street bikes like Fazer's, ER6's, Z750's etc, or funky nakeds like Street triples, KTM's etc.

And a Daytona 675R? Not for a daily bike that you want cover lots of touring miles on or much two up riding etc.
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ocatoro
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PostPosted: 23:16 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

bluezedd wrote:


Which 9R did you look at? Was it a B model?

the C, E and F models destroy the ZZR in terms of being closer to modern handling, although the ZZR offers a fuel gauge, better dash, much more comfortable position. I can't talk for the B model, but as it's ZXR750 era, then I guess it's probably not modern feeling.


it was a C1 model on a 98 plate. it was quite comfy, and ergonomically a bit more like the zzr. which obviously I'd find familiar and comfortable.

why avoid it? anything in particular? or just overkill.. or?
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ocatoro
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PostPosted: 23:22 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
What's your budget?

When you say "at least as fast", do you mean:

Topping out at 150mph+
Accelerating between X mph and Y mph?
From point A to point B through the twisties.


I'm rarely going to be doing 150mph... but when in country crossing mode... the ability to cruise in the 130s sort of comes with a 150mph bike...

I do enjoy the delivery of the zzr, it's quite frantic once it gets on song. not essential, but amusement is always beneficial.

I'm not the most experienced rider, nor will I claim to be a fast rider in the way that counts... so handling is important to aid in forgiveness of any mistakes I'll make. (another reason I'd be drawn to the zx7 as it's reputation is that it's pretty unflappable on the road)

budget depends on what I'm getting I guess... anywhere from 1500 to 4k probably ballpark
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ocatoro
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PostPosted: 23:25 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Re: is there a modern equivalent of the old zzr6? (wot bike Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
ocatoro wrote:
tried a new duke 690, also didn't have the pace and felt too small/narrow/odd... the new 1000sx thing is too dear for me..


Isn't a brand new Duke 690 in the same ball park as an early S1000SX price-wise?


a new one yes.. but the opportunity came up at the m&p demo weekend, so was the new one I took out. which by all accounts is very slightly better a bike than the older, cheaper one. but I've ruled it out. I especially didn't like how narrow it felt and how little bike there was in front of me
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ocatoro
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PostPosted: 23:32 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
Seems to me that your just bouncing around alot of ideas for bikes that you like the sound of irrespective of how or if they suit your brief/needs.

Firstly you gotta know what your plans are and what your going to be doing with it? So is regular commuting and touring definitely on the cards? Could you end up not doing any of these things and just want a fun or weekend bike?

Once decided forget jumping around all kinds of bike ideas you fancy, and draw up a list of must haves.

It sounds like you need to get a ZZR 600 replacement, but want something newer and possibly a bit faster or bigger cc?
How are you fixed for running costs? Big heavy but fast bikes are wallet eaters, so I'd really avoid big fast sports tourers like Blackbirds, Busa's and ZZR's unless you want to ride 100's of miles two up at 100mph+.

I'd also draw a line and say nothing more sporty in terms of riding position than a C/E model ZX9R. Whats the budget like, and do you want as modern and up to date as possible, or something old but comfy and good?

VFR's, ZX9R's Thunderaces, RF900's are all fairly cheap for a good condition bike. Newer stuff like BMW K1200's and Triumph 1050's are probably another few grand for a nice one.

What I don't think is any good to you or your requirements is any 600cc IL4, budget all around Street bikes like Fazer's, ER6's, Z750's etc, or funky nakeds like Street triples, KTM's etc.

And a Daytona 675R? Not for a daily bike that you want cover lots of touring miles on or much two up riding etc.


yes I am bouncing ideas around. it won't be my only transport. and my commute is going to be 10-15 mins on quiet a-roads. (I start work at 6am). as it will be my only bike, however, I don't just want a boring hack. I want to look back at it in the car park. much like with women... if they don't grab my attention, I'm less inclined to want to get to know them

so must haves are being somewhere half way to comfortable. be at least as fast as a zzr600. and be fun to ride.

would likes... modern (so fuel injection, digital speedo, etc... granted I know some of the ones I listed don't have that). value/bang for buck. vaguely good fuel economy (I currently get poor economy from a 6cyl bmw when commuting anyway).

2-up not important. we have a little boy and another on the way in spring, so the mrs isn't coming on it, and only reason I'd need to give mates a lift is to pick up their bike from tyres or something.
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jjdugen
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PostPosted: 23:59 - 19 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

There isn't one.... Fact.
Go up in CC's (and weight) or stay with hollow, gutless 600's. They CANT make them like that any more. Noise, emissions, cost, etc. etc. etc. Had them all through my hands, Yamahas, gutless. Hondas, smooth, revvy, gutless, Suzukis, fast, viby. Forget low CC Ducatis.
Kawasaki spent a lot getting that one into production, kept it going as long as they could get away with it. Nobody bought it because, Fireblade, R1, innit. The only engine that actually surprised me, the balls of something much larger, smooth, but with a solidity missing in anything else but the bigger 900's. A gem of a bike that was never given anything like the credit it was due.
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bluezedd
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PostPosted: 00:51 - 20 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ocatoro wrote:
bluezedd wrote:


Which 9R did you look at? Was it a B model?

the C, E and F models destroy the ZZR in terms of being closer to modern handling, although the ZZR offers a fuel gauge, better dash, much more comfortable position. I can't talk for the B model, but as it's ZXR750 era, then I guess it's probably not modern feeling.


it was a C1 model on a 98 plate. it was quite comfy, and ergonomically a bit more like the zzr. which obviously I'd find familiar and comfortable.

why avoid it? anything in particular? or just overkill.. or?


Ah right, the C models are good, and very similar to the E model, except a few relatively minor changes. The C models did have a bit of a reputation of eating gearboxes though. Not certain how genuine that was though, as so did the ZZR600, but I didn't have problems with mine.

Tbh the 9R isn't terribly uncomfy, it's just it's not as comfy a position as the ZZR (seat is a good bit harder, pegs are closer to the seat, a bit more of a reach down for the bars, tail higher up). So after a while it can get pretty uncomfy compared to the ZZR and equivalent bikes.

The 9R has a decent amount of power, along with being lighter than the ZZR600 (by roughly 20kg if I remember right) so will tick that box.

Tbh though, if you're considering a bike as uncomfy (and beautiful) as the ZX7R, then I'm sure the 9R would be fine if that's what you wanted.
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c_dug_the_bastard
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PostPosted: 06:18 - 20 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

jjdugen wrote:
There isn't one.... Fact.
Go up in CC's (and weight) or stay with hollow, gutless 600's. They CANT make them like that any more. Noise, emissions, cost, etc. etc. etc.


This is really hitting the nail on the head, and I was going to tack something similar onto the back of my vfr800 suggestion but couldn't think of how to write it.

When my late 90s Fazer 600 is consistently quicker than an MT07, it gives an idea of the state of play of modern bikes. I owned a ZZR600 for a few months and it was a corker of a bike for the right situation, I've owned lots since then and the VFR is probably the best comparison, funnily enough I didn't enjoy either as a commuter much!
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 08:30 - 20 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

CBR650F. End of thread.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 18:54 - 20 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

CBR 650F ain't a bad suggestion, as it's modern and would have the EFI and electronic dash and ABS and things the OP said he'd like. Can you get them for £4k?

I think he needs to decide how important modern bikes with the electronics are to his needs?

If they arnt at all important, then there's a ton of 90's-2000's roomy sports bikes that'd all do the job very well.

A late CBR 600FX would be as good as the ZZR and have the centre stand too. The VFR 800's would be better than an old ZZR and the late A-series 636 ZX6R's would be very roomy, comfortable and fast for the size.

A 9R Ninja is still lighter than a ZZR 600, is a ton of roomy rapid bike for the cash, and still looks good today. He won't need anything bigger or faster, but going to an old but great sports bike probably brings much more positives to the experience and you wouldn't sacrifice much practically or comfort that he had with his old ZZR either.

New isn't always good, but only OP can decide if this is what he wants?
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spnorm
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PostPosted: 22:53 - 20 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

K1200S slow! Where did you read that crap? Sub 3 seconds 0-60 thanks to the long and low chassis, sub 11 second 1/4 mile, 170+ top speed and a pretty impressive Nurburgring lap speed Thumbs Up

Whilst not as fast as a ZZR1400 or ‘Busa, it’s still a very fast bike. I ran one for three years and it was definitely faster than a GSX-R750 or 954 Blade, and matched a GSX-R1000K3/K4
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andyscooter
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PostPosted: 07:53 - 21 Sep 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

fireblade


come on bcf Shocked
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