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Pulling in to let people past?

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tentativebike...
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PostPosted: 14:42 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Pulling in to let people past? Reply with quote

I know we're not supposed to ride in the gutter, but when riding below the speed limit on the road you are on (out of mechanical sympathy or because your bike just can't do it -i.e riding a 125 on a NSL road) and on a normal two lane road rather than a dual carriageway (where it's easy for people to overtake you) is pulling in to the gutter for a few seconds to allow traffic behind you to overtake safe? Or should you just stick to the central lane and not give a damn about those behind you?
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Analogkid
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PostPosted: 14:52 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ride your own ride, it's up to those behind to keep out of your way, the gutter can be full of holes and dips that could have you mount the kerb meaning probably an off.

Having said that be prepared to put up with impatient drivers behind, perhaps go a less busy route, or if you are sticking well below the speed limit consider using a road with a 30-40-50 limit, you shouldn't have to, but it will help keep your stress levels down until your confidence builds or you get a more powerful bike. Imagine everyone is trying to kill you and you won't go far wrong. Very Happy
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M.C
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PostPosted: 15:32 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

They should decide when to overtake, by moving over you could encourage a bad overtake, you see it quite a lot with cyclists who choose poor road positioning.
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tentativebike...
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PostPosted: 15:36 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.C wrote:
They should decide when to overtake, by moving over you could encourage a bad overtake, you see it quite a lot with cyclists who choose poor road positioning.


Whilst they should decide when to overtake some-times the only thing stopping them doing so is there concern for your safety, making enough room and signalling them past seems a nice thing to do once in a while if its safe.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 17:11 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Re: Pulling in to let people past? Reply with quote

tentativebiker wrote:
I know we're not supposed to ride in the gutter, but when riding below the speed limit on the road you are on (out of mechanical sympathy or because your bike just can't do it -i.e riding a 125 on a NSL road) and on a normal two lane road rather than a dual carriageway (where it's easy for people to overtake you) is pulling in to the gutter for a few seconds to allow traffic behind you to overtake safe? Or should you just stick to the central lane and not give a damn about those behind you?


I used to do it all the time, although I'd usually pick the best moment to do it. So I'd be looking ahead, trying to plan for the vehicle(s) behind, and giving them relevant cues like a glance over me right shoulder prior to getting over to the nearside etc. etc. I often got a wave as they passed, so people usually appreciate the gesture. I don't think there's any point trying to give them space to overtake if there's oncoming traffic or if it's a road with poor forward visibility. In those kinds of situations you're running the risk of "inviting" them to tailgate you, and drive ever closer to you. So when there's no decent opportunity for them to overtake I think it might be better to just "own" your lane and your right to a decent amount of space left and right, and to just occupy the centre of your side of the road. This should be your default position as a learner, imo.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 17:18 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's something caravanners and farm vehicles round my way ought to do a bit more often tbh.
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 17:24 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

tentativebiker wrote:
[
Whilst they should decide when to overtake some-times the only thing stopping them doing so is there concern for your safety, making enough room and signalling them past seems a nice thing to do once in a while if its safe.


If it's not safe for them to do an overtake then you should not encourage them to do so. If it is safe, they will do so.
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thepuma
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PostPosted: 17:24 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Obvious troll.
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andyscooter
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PostPosted: 17:42 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

If your 125 can't do 60 mph fix it


Even my 9hp lml auto would hit 60
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tentativebike...
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PostPosted: 20:31 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

andyscooter wrote:
If your 125 can't do 60 mph fix it


Even my 9hp lml auto would hit 60


It can do 60mph, it just takes 20-30 seconds or so to get there, by which time there's either a corner or a roundabout.
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 23:28 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

As far as I can tell this is a non-issue, and/or merely one of confidence.

I used to ride the O/H's Chinese 125 Cruiserette quite regularly 2-Up with her on the back, and that thing struggled to go over 55mpg thanks to Chinese regional speed restriction. It also couldn't be criticized as being endowed with any particularly wonderful 'handling', or ground clearance!

On a NSL A-Road, it would chug up to its terminal (as in it could kill you with boredom!) top speed.. and what was behind would either put up with it or find safe place to pass.

I felt little compunction to pull for for them to let them pass, but then neither did I feel very much need to slow down for corners!! Roud-a-bouts? Every one should slow down and be ready to stop.

YOU should be riding YOUR road, and riding both within your own and the capabilities of your machine, A-N-D concerning yourself with what YOU need to do... not what YOU MERELY THINK other traffic may 'like' you to do.

Riding a motorcycle is ALL about control. We don't have anywhere near as much as we'd like to believe, sat in the middle of a host of competing forces, to begin with, and the moment you start to worry about forces you CANT possibly control, like what another driver may do... and changing what you might do based pretty much on guess-work of what you think they may think.... you are NOT in control... you are letting not the other driver... but your own guess of what you think that other driver may want or expect, take control!

Good control is effected by taking action based on good information, well considered. Here you have NO information, just guesses, and making likely BAD decisions to take BAD actions entirely based on presumption and fantasy! This is NOT likely to end up well.

First up, on a motorcycle, following traffic will tail gate.

To be honest they would probably do that even if you were in a car. Stand by a busy road and count how may cars obey the two-second rule as they pass you... it wont be many.

On a bike, you a person, are the obvious focal point of any-one looking. If you were in a car, they wouldn't focus on the back of your head, they would focus on the lights above the bumper. already they will be inclined to close the 'gap' they leave by two or three feet or more, over what they might leave for a car.

You, on a bike, are also sat close to the handle-bars and the handlebar mirrors. Objects n the ear-View Mirror may appear closer than they are... and sat that close to the mirrors, and with so little vehicle around you, and a vehicle likely too close to start with, and closer still as they are looking at your hat, not your number-plate, they will seem INCREDIBLY close.

Completely natural then, to feel they are 'tail-gating' more that they are intimidating you, and hence they 'must' want you to go faster or get out of their way...

Actually, that is incredibly arrogant and egocentric of you... they may... but more likely, they are singing along to the radio, or contemplating what's for tea tonight, or what they need from the DIY shop.... YOU, I am sorry to say, barely warrant as much attention as they likely don't pay the dipstick in their engine, until the oil light flashes.

And they will continue to pay you scant attention until YOU do something to make them pay it... like swerve to the gutter, or brake, or brake violently, as you have just spotted a farm gateway, that you then indicate to turn into... THEN they pay attention, and probably start with a moment of utter astonishment, and bewilderment... because there's nothing obvious to them to make you swerve or brake, and whats that amber light for?.. and likely too close in their auto-pilot mind-set anyway NOW you are a menace MAKING them brake, or swerve, or do 'something' they didn't expect.

At just the time YOU are dong something likely less well considered or planned, probably more violent, and certainly effecting a 'change' to the status quo, in which there is ever greater opportunity for effup! Like skidding!

ALL because YOU didn't know what they were thinking, made a bunch of assumptions, of what you THOUGHT they must be thinking and acted very errantly upon them!!!

So!!!!

RIDE YOUR OWN VEHICLE ON YOUR OWN ROAD.

If they cant deal with other traffic, and that's what you are, that's THEIR problem NOT yours. And you certainly shouldn't make it yours, worse still make more problems for either of you trying to do 'something' based on shear guess work of their aspirations!

Highway code, says you should pay due curtecy to all other road-users.... his is a two-way street! They should pay you that same curtaey; Which MEANS having patience for other vehicles, like bin lorries or milk-floats or tractors OR motor-cycles that MAY not be able to travel as fast as their homogenized eco-box with inbuilt numpty-proofing!

If they don't... again, their problem NOT yours, don't MAKE it your problem, worse, don't make more in the process!

Which meas DON'T BITE! Even if they are steering wheel gnashing road-hogs trying to give you a shove.... ride your own road!

Don't dab the brakes and try and make them back off! Dont start avig arms or trying to communcate with other gesticulations, particularly v-signs or wanker hands signals!!! Don't give them ANY cause to pay you more attention that they are already, aren't especially negative attention.

YOU, biker are soft bit on the outside. They may be softer, but they have a metal box around them, in any conflict YOU are the one who will come out worse of it!

IF you lack the competence and confidence, that this IS a regular occurrence.... take the hint you are NOT really ready to be tackling this short of chit on a regular bass.....

No-One MAKES you ride a motor bike, any time, any where. Its YOUR choice, so pick your time, pick your place, and go find a time and place you can practice and build up confidence and competence, away from more likely other traffic. And THAT is what an L-Plate is for... not dodging tests whilst you tackle the daily commute, in THE most hazard strewn conditions on our roads.

IF, after gaining more confidence and competence, you still gel so intimated, and still feel YOU have to do something to combat this problem....

Ask yourself REALLY is it YOUR problem?
Can you actually do ANYHING about it?
And of the things you may 'think' to do about it, are they necessarily the 'best' thing you can do?

If you cannot wrap your head around doing nothing... then sorry get off bikes NOW.. if you are determined you have to bow to peer pressure and do what you think, other road-users think you should you will NEVER learn to ride for yourself, you will ALWAYS try and do what you think others want or expect of you, NOT necessarily what's 'best'.

Pulling over? Letting other traffic past? It is one possible solution, and I have done t and will recommend it, IN the right situation. But that should be incredibly rare.

I can say that in thirty years on two wheels, the number of occasions it has bee my 'best' cause of action, can probably be counted on the fingers of one hand... and almost all of them on roads recently resurfaced with loose chippings, with 20mph warning signs still in force, and cars determined to still do 70 down them! And even THEN, on loose surface, act of pulling over and stopping is itself a hazard, best avoided if possible.

So, remember you the learner... THAT s your biggest problem right now, you need competence and confidence and not to pander to nerves, and dodge getting that, same as in other posts you planned dodging tests to get a full licence; L-Plates to learn, not dodge tests. Go lea, and you can pick time and place, no-one makes you commute or tackle busy roads at peak times. And even on a 55pmh 125, you are NOT the slowest vehicle around other traffic should make allowances for, and when YOU have the throttle in your mitt YOU are the one who should be in control; don't abdicate it to other road users, less 'ghosts' in your head you just think other drivers are. Or YOU are not in control, the voices in your head are! and THEY will make you crash, being over cautious for them, just as surely as any-one listening to the exited ones telling them to ride faster will... difference is you are more likely to involve another vehicle.
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ThatDippyTwat
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PostPosted: 23:48 - 03 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

tl;dr

Generally, no, I didn't.

However I can never resist this road, even when I had an asthamtic YBR 125, so I pulle over, because I'm not a dick. Not in the gutter, but a layby.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.851049,-3.4348362,3a,75y,266.49h,89.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sfC83ZcdzFKouLyR4NTQXBw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
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M.C
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PostPosted: 01:36 - 04 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

tentativebiker wrote:
M.C wrote:
They should decide when to overtake, by moving over you could encourage a bad overtake, you see it quite a lot with cyclists who choose poor road positioning.


Whilst they should decide when to overtake some-times the only thing stopping them doing so is there concern for your safety

Your experience on 2 wheels must be very different to mine Laughing
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:19 - 04 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

tentativebiker wrote:
Whilst they should decide when to overtake some-times the only thing stopping them doing so is there concern for their paintwork

Ignore the absolutists, they're all Hitler. It's fine to do it if you feel there's a genuine risk of a rage-overtake, or being taken roughly from behind by White Van Man after last orders (oh deer).

Although in your case they might be doing us a favour.
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Evil Hans
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PostPosted: 11:57 - 04 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

tentativebiker wrote:

Whilst they should decide when to overtake some-times the only thing stopping them doing so is there concern


There concern? Where?
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doggone
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PostPosted: 12:17 - 04 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

grr666 wrote:
It's something caravanners and farm vehicles round my way ought to do a bit more often tbh.

The problem if driving a farm vehicle with trailer is there is rarely anywhere to 'pull in'.
You can't go on the verge and risk getting stuck with loaded trailer, or draw out a load of mud.
Try layby spotting, they have mostly disappeared as it's too difficult to keep control of the sea of litter.

If there is a spot and the road is busy it can be extremely risky getting out and accelerating again.
Often it's best to just keep going as smoothly as possible.

Usually what happens is 2 or 3 overly timid drivers crawl along quite close behind and can't/won't overtake when there is an opportunity.
Anyone behind then has to try get past a longer line.

Its unusual for farm traffic to go more than mile or so, usually less.
Also most tractors now have 40kph or 50kph top speed which is not that slow anyway
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tentativebike...
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PostPosted: 13:19 - 04 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

doggone wrote:
grr666 wrote:
It's something caravanners and farm vehicles round my way ought to do a bit more often tbh.

The problem if driving a farm vehicle with trailer is there is rarely anywhere to 'pull in'.
You can't go on the verge and risk getting stuck with loaded trailer, or draw out a load of mud.
Try layby spotting, they have mostly disappeared as it's too difficult to keep control of the sea of litter.

If there is a spot and the road is busy it can be extremely risky getting out and accelerating again.
Often it's best to just keep going as smoothly as possible.

Usually what happens is 2 or 3 overly timid drivers crawl along quite close behind and can't/won't overtake when there is an opportunity.
Anyone behind then has to try get past a longer line.

Its unusual for farm traffic to go more than mile or so, usually less.
Also most tractors now have 40kph or 50kph top speed which is not that slow anyway


There usage for drug trading, prostitution, dogging, black market salesmen, unofficial camp-sites and other anti-social behaviour is an often-cited reason for closing them. Passing places also seem to be going to the way-side, as the knock-on effect of them closing lay-bys is passing places are now used as unofficial lay-bys. Who'd have thunk it?
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P.
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PostPosted: 13:38 - 04 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would not pull over. At all.
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thx1138
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PostPosted: 15:05 - 04 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

very occasionally I do it, if I'm riding progressively, which on a 200/250/300 usually means on the speed limit, rarely over it, and enjoying the twisty roads, I keep an eye on the mirrors (when I have them) and if another bigger bike is keeping with me but not overtaking, I might put my left indicator on and move left and slow slightly.

only usually do it for cars, if I'm being followed by a slow novice rider, and they get in between me and them, or very occasionally if they are bothering me, and not overtaking me, this would mostly be a headlight/mirror issue

I virtually never stop to let anyone cross a road, or drive out of a side turning, in case numpty car driver goes sailing past and causes an accident.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 10:36 - 13 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

As others have said don't ride in the gutter. However if you have someone dangerously tailgating you then caution will be the better part of valour. Pull in with the proper obs and signals. Then rejoin the traffic. Your always better off behind an idiot than in front of them. The rest if the time you have every right to proceed at your own pace. A 125 is still capable of normal road speeds.
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Triton Thrasher
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PostPosted: 10:46 - 13 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

tentativebiker wrote:


There usage for drug trading, prostitution, dogging, black market salesmen, unofficial camp-sites and other anti-social behaviour is an often-cited reason for closing them. Passing places also seem to be going to the way-side, as the knock-on effect of them closing lay-bys is passing places are now used as unofficial lay-bys. Who'd have thunk it?


That's how the war on drugs, vice, smuggling, etc., will he won.

Remove all laybyes!
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 12:48 - 13 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

To win the war on immorality, remove all labias.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 13:53 - 13 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

tentativebiker wrote:


There usage for drug trading, prostitution, dogging, black market salesmen, unofficial camp-sites and other anti-social behaviour is an often-cited reason for closing them. Passing places also seem to be going to the way-side, as the knock-on effect of them closing lay-bys is passing places are now used as unofficial lay-bys. Who'd have thunk it?


dogging is a very social behaviour. You can't do it on your own.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 15:00 - 13 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

What's BCF's position on pulling out to avoid an unplanned accident?
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Cbs2
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PostPosted: 19:39 - 13 Dec 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Was always told to hold my lane position.
To keep away from the potholes, rubbish etc up the side of the road and to make anybody behind make a "proper" overtake.

I moved in once when i was on L plates. My 125 decided it didn't like the rain & proceeded to cough & fart its way along a country road.
I moved over while it was running rough, only for a fiesta van to try & overtake me while a HGV was alongside in the opposite direction.

Never done it again.
Haven't needed to since passing & getting the 650
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