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TheGazWaz
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PostPosted: 15:44 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Nearly had an off. Close call. Reply with quote

First time this has ever happened to me but statistically speaking if I carry on riding the way I do I'll probably have another which is why I now don't ride like a total c0ck.

On my K3 GSXR10000. Out and about in the Yorkshire dales round the twisties having lots of fun and learning to ride my bike.

I approach a hair pin bend knocking the speed off to about 20mph by the time I hit the bend. I'm all set up to get round when I spotted the big splodge of mud/horse crap right in my path. I panicked and pulled the front break. Not too hard but enough to bring the bike upright and send me in a straight line across the other side of the rode across another cars path.

The car was nowhere near me tbh and he was going extra slow because of the tight bend also but it could have been a different story if I'd got there a 2 seconds earlier.

At this point I remember seeing the other side of the road getting closer and closer thinking the best I'm going to get away with is smashed fairings.

Anyway, I got lucky again because on the other side of the road wasn't a ditch, lamp post or brick wall.. No... It was a very soft muddy verge that very softly brought my bike to a stand still as the front wheel dug in.

The car stopped and asked if I was OK. I couldn't believe my luck. I apologized the car driver for putting him through that experience then I had a swift word with myself about rider experience.

I rode a lot more careful for the rest of the day.

I feel very luck to have gotten away with this. The Mud/horse poo didn't help the situation but I feel if I was more experienced I would have handled it differently.

Before this incident I'd been happily flying round corners without any knowledge of what might be round the other side... A Tractor, a stationery car, Cyclist or even horse poo.

I'm slowing down now and saving the lunacy for the track. I have way to much to lose and I nearly lost it.

Thanks for listing all.

G
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NJD
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PostPosted: 15:56 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Advanced training with a training school since, from what I was told, they focus on gearing and cornering specifically.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 15:57 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

At 20mph you'd have probably been alright either way tbh. Yeah you'd have smashed the bike, broke a bone or two maybe.
But you'd be pretty damned unlucky to have a fatal in those circumstances. There is no excuse for horse shit on
todays roads though. Absolutely none, if you can afford a horse and its upkeep and wish to ride it on public roads, then
you can afford a shit catcher.
I clean up after my dog when it craps in a public place but I suppose that's beneath
the typical plummy slightly chubby horse riding bitch waving her arms around at everybody else like they are the
inconsiderate arse.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 16:07 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

NJD wrote:
Advanced training with a training school since, from what I was told, they focus on gearing and cornering specifically.

Rated "Funny" because of my experience with the local IAM.

It's not brain science to figure out how to ride at a speed that lets you always stop safely on your own side of the road in the space that you can see to be clear.

The problem is, that speed tends to be a lot, lot lower than most road users are prepared to go in reality. How many of us are actually prepared to stop - I mean, 2nd or 1st gear, covering or even dragging the brakes, keeping as upright as possible - when going round tight or blind bends?

Ah, it's clear the last 20 times I rode it, it'll be right.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 16:17 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
It's not brain science to figure out how to ride at a speed that lets you always stop safely on your own side of the road in the space that you can see to be clear.

The problem is, that speed tends to be a lot, lot lower than most road users are prepared to go in reality. How many of us are actually prepared to stop - I mean, 2nd or 1st gear, covering or even dragging the brakes, keeping as upright as possible - when going round tight or blind bends?

Ah, it's clear the last 20 times I rode it, it'll be right.

I think this is what you're after:

https://seanews.ru/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/первая.jpg

You always drive/ride weighing up risk, no risk would be never starting the engine. The OP panicking was the problem.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 16:17 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also worth practicing braking without letting the bike stand up. The main thing for this is to learn to take the decelleration through your knees and the tank, leaving your arms free to steer.

However, braking mid corner isn't ideal and can lead to loss of traction etc. so could your line into the corner have been different? Wider,? Perhaps allowing you to see the horse shite sooner and make a subtle alteration to your line?

Also worth training yourself out of target fixation. Tricky. You need to visualise the line you want to take to avoid the obstruction rather than the obstruction itself. I use road markings to do this and I personally try to visualise a virtual line on the road where I want the bike to go.
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NJD
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PostPosted: 16:20 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
It's not brain science to figure out how to ride at a speed that lets you always stop safely on your own side of the road in the space that you can see to be clear.


For those of whom have been riding for a short while, perhaps, but as per original post:

GazTheWaz wrote:
but statistically speaking if I carry on riding the way I do I'll probably have another


GazTheWaz wrote:
Out and about in the Yorkshire dales round the twisties having lots of fun and learning to ride my bike.


I've never ridden one but I doubt a GXSR 1000 is a bike to be toying with when experience is lacking.

Beside training I'd say keep riding, mind, given that there's nothing more refreshing than getting miles under the belt.

Rogerborg wrote:
Ah, it's clear the last 20 times I rode it, it'll be right.


Aye, agree.

Suns out so one might want to venture on a new commute route but for the majority of the rubbish weather ridden year taking the shortest or most ridden route does create the problem of complacency.
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BTTD
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PostPosted: 16:24 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

As lessons go, that one's a good one to learn early.
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weasley
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PostPosted: 16:29 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another angle is to anticipate mud/poo if you are on a road that has fields around it, maybe there was a "beware horses" or "beware cattle" warning sign a little way back, maybe there are tractors that use this road and so on. And having found the poo, the next question to ask yourself is "where is the animal that dropped it?". Maybe around the next corner...?
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 16:31 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

NJD wrote:
I've never ridden one but I doubt a GXSR 1000 is a bike to be toying with when experience is lacking.

If OP had been riding an Enfield, would the horse have refrained from defacating on that bend?

I don't have any experience of GSX-R1000s, so I need to ask.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 16:33 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:


Also worth training yourself out of target fixation.


That is the real biggie in my eyes. When something starts to go wrong you end up looking at the worst option that can happen, the ditch, the brick wall etc. and thats where your bike goes.

When I was young, back in the days of Boudicca, a very very good chariot driver (biker Wink ) told me time and time again. Ignore what might happen, just keep looking where you want to go.

It took me a long time to be able to do that but I have never, since then, had target fixation problems. It doesn't mean I haven't shat myself but I haven't crashed for that reason either. Thumbs Up
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NJD
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PostPosted: 16:34 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
If OP had been riding an Enfield, would the horse have refrained from defacating on that bend?

I don't have any experience of GSX-R1000s, so I need to ask.


I don't have the horse who shat on the road to hand, so I can't answer.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 16:36 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
Also worth practicing braking without letting the bike stand up.

I'm always perplexed by this. I've braked mid-corner loads of times (even as a 125 noob) and never had the bike stand-up.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 16:41 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

NJD wrote:
Rogerborg wrote:
If OP had been riding an Enfield, would the horse have refrained from defacating on that bend?

I don't have any experience of GSX-R1000s, so I need to ask.


I don't have the horse who shat on the road to hand, so I can't answer.


Horses cannot see red. They can see blues and greens so they can see Gixxers and Kawasakis however they can't see Ducatis. Therefore Ducatis frighten them and they shit in the road.

I know about horses me! Cool
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Freddyfruitba...
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PostPosted: 16:56 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

grr666 wrote:
There is no excuse for horse shit on todays roads though.

Oh c'mon, around town I totally agree, but out in the sticks? It could just as easily have been the detritus of a flock of sheep - or would you have farmers attaching poop catchers to their entire flock before they let them cross the road? Cool
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 17:26 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Modern bikes are worse for standing up in a bend because the tyre deformation from braking will often initate a countersteer-like effect.

Along with target fixation, stiffening on the bars and all the survival reactions we know and love from Keith Code, it conspires to have you off.

I wouldn't be riding a GSXR1000 if I was a newbie. I'd never suggest it to a newbie, and I can't think of anyone who would suggest it to a newbie. It's not known as a pussycat of a bike, and with 150bhp+ on tap, it's enough to send you into a hedge over the national speed limit in any gear probably ten times over before it's even broken a sweat.

I think you can draw your own conclusions from this.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 18:38 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

First I'll start by stating I'm not anti livestock at all and take every precaution when riding near animals.

Freddyfruitbat wrote:
Oh c'mon, around town I totally agree, but out in the sticks? It could just as easily have been the detritus of a flock of sheep - or would you have farmers attaching poop catchers to their entire flock before they let them cross the road? Cool


No, but I'd have them go back with a shovel and clean up behind them, they may own the land either side but they
own the road as much as I do. They're expected to clean the roads when they make them all muddy using
their farm vehicles.
For instance moving repeatedly between two fields linked by some public highway, so what's the
difference? If it's too much trouble for a horse rider riding their beast entirely for leisure to take reasonable
steps ie using a purpose made poo catcher, then it's fine for me to not bother backing off the Akrapovic firework
display or altering my approach speed when I see one ahead? No?

Exactly!! We all have to make allowances for others using the roads. Difference being having passed numerous driving tests
and driven and ridden all classes of vehicles in my time, I'd say I'm a more qualified road user than the majority of teenage
girls I see riding horses round my way. That doesn't stop them flapping their arms around when they see a bike that has
already slowed, already backed off the revs and already moved away from the beast as much as possible, the assumption
is the bike is being ridden by a complete retard and they somehow know better. Given the slightly entitled nature I've observed
in horse riders, they probably expect us peasants on bikes to switch off and walk them past their precious animals.

Truth is, I even slow down and back off the gas for a dog walker should I pass one knowing how much my bike upsets mine.
I live in a semi rural area and horses go right past my house fairly regularly. Usually ridden by children with no appropriate
adult around, which boils my piss no end. I had to wait until I was 16 to use the roads, some of these girls are like 12.
But I digress. In this litigious age, it's only a matter of time until a farmer or stuck up horse owner is in the dock for not
clearing up behind the beasts in their care and the inevitable fatal motorcycle accident their poop has created,
many bikers head into the sticks for a sunny ride, it's only a matter of time when you consider how likely the horsepoo vs
bike scenario is out in the countryside.

If my van leaks diesel or oil all over the road while I go about my business, is that okay too?

Quote:
A range of powers are available to the Police and the Highways Department, primarily the Highways Act 1980; and the Road Traffic Act 1988:

Highways Act 1980 Section 137 states: “If a person, without lawful authority or excuse, in any way wilfully obstructs the free passage along a highway he is guilty of an offence”.
Highways Act 1980 Section 148 states: “If without lawful authority or excuse a person deposits anything whatsoever on a highway to the interruption of any user of the highway he is guilty of an offence.”
Section 149 of the Highways Act 1980 states: “If anything is deposited on the highway so as to constitute a nuisance/danger the Highway Authority can require the person who put it there to remove it forthwith”. Mud causes skidding and is therefore dangerous and a nuisance.
Highways Act 1980 Section 161 states: “If a person, without lawful authority or excuse, deposits anything whatsoever on a highway in consequence of which a user of the highway is injured or endangered, that person is guilty of an offence”.
Furthermore, the Road Traffic Act 1988 covers situations where a mechanically propelled vehicle is driven dangerously on a road. Driving dangerously can include driving a vehicle in a state that could cause danger to others.


I never made the rules.
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Last edited by grr666 on 19:19 - 19 Apr 2018; edited 1 time in total
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 18:44 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

grr666 wrote:
Freddyfruitbat wrote:
Oh c'mon, around town I totally agree, but out in the sticks? It could just as easily have been the detritus of a flock of sheep - or would you have farmers attaching poop catchers to their entire flock before they let them cross the road? Cool

No, but I'd have them go back with a shovel and clean up behind them, they may own the land either side but they
own the road as much as I do. I live in a semi rural area and horses go right past my house fairly regularly usually
ridden by children with no appropriate adult around which boils my piss no end, I had to wait until I was 16 to use the
roads, some of these girls are like 12 . But I digress. In this litigious age, it's only a matter of time until a farmer or stuck
up horse owner is in the dock for not clearing up behind the beasts in their care and the inevitable fatal motorcycle
accident their poop has created. If my van leaks diesel or oil all over the road while I go about my business, is that okay too?


Has anyone ever been done for spilling diesel though?

The amount it happens is still criminal although I don't see it as much nowadays. Have they finally worked out how to stop lorries spilling it?
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weasley
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PostPosted: 19:14 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

I’m pretty sure I was around 4 when I started using the roads. On my bicycle. Which, like a horse, incurs no “road tax”, has no mandatory insurance, requires no licence to ride but is entitled to be there.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 19:33 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

An UNACCOMPANIED 4 year old riding a bike on a road??? Seems poetic to call horseshit on that one.
You could ride a two wheeler at 4 could you? Competently and with the presence of mind to react appropriately to traffic?

I don't believe you.

You could have blatantly ridden on the pavement until age 10 like I did with absolutely no fear of arrest, caution or fixed
penalty. Besides as I'm sure you already know, Police cannot confiscate a cycle from anybody at all regardless
of age so I can't see how or why your folks pushed you to go on the road at all. I was told to specifically stay OUT of
the road unless I was crossing it by mine. You should ask them why they abused you in this way? Because just the thought
of a 4 year old boy alone wobbling along the high street on a pushbike would have social services involved these days.

Also fluid leaks are now to be considered an MOT failure, for environmental reasons. So leaky vans and lorries should be
impacted significantly within 12 months from May this year. That said, most diesel leaks are caused by overfilling, the buses used to
slosh it about when you took one out from the garage as the engineers would fill them to the brim when they came back in.
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arthurmo
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PostPosted: 21:12 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having the attention span of a gnat I’ve often gone into a corner at the wrong angle and brain speed but so far have always got away with it by forcibly looking at where I want to be going and keeping my chin up*.Its worked so far apart from a couple of gates and a few pheasants.






* not in a cheeky chirpy cockney way.
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 21:28 - 19 Apr 2018    Post subject: Target fixation. Reply with quote

Look further up the road. No horse rider would be riding in the middle of the road after the bend. They tend to try and stay to the side away from trouble. I'd say your glance at speedo was the wrong thing to do. You look up and see shit, panic and as we've all done....forget what you did wrong before getting away with it. Learn and move on.
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goto10
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PostPosted: 08:57 - 20 Apr 2018    Post subject: Re: Nearly had an off. Close call. Reply with quote

TheGazWaz wrote:
...
Before this incident I'd been happily flying round corners without any knowledge of what might be round the other side... a stationery car...


https://i.imgur.com/jr9XkH4.jpg
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Speedy23
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PostPosted: 10:19 - 20 Apr 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.C wrote:
stinkwheel wrote:
Also worth practicing braking without letting the bike stand up.

I'm always perplexed by this. I've braked mid-corner loads of times (even as a 125 noob) and never had the bike stand-up.
....but you have....it's just that on a 125, the gyroscopic forces resulting from accelerations that twist the bike around its longitudinal axis are comparitively small and you probably wouldn't notice it if you weren't looking for it.....if you can find a quiet roundabout, try riding round it at a constant speed and then (GENTLY) roll off and apply the brakes. You will feel the bike try to sit up.

Obvs. effect is amplified with bigger, more massive tires and wheels and greater velocity change.....but, as a prominent Scottish engineer once said, "ye canna change the laws of physics"......
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