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Does anyonemake "fun" small cars any more?

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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 18:46 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Does anyonemake "fun" small cars any more? Reply with quote

In this instance, "fun" does not necessarily mean "Blistering performance" but fun to own.

The Mrs has a Daihatsu Copen. She really enjoys it and it's a hoot to drive.

It's also 12 years old with 120k miles on the clock and is used every day to go to work.

I'm looking round for a new-ish, fairly low-end of the market small car that looks a little out of the ordinary. Ideally small and light. In fairness performance would be playing second fiddle to economy as it's used for commuting.

There used to be loads of slightly oddball little cars about the place but I don't see many now? Maybe the Abarth 595?

Not a Mini. That is not fun. It's not anything.
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 18:57 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could always import (or get somebody to drive it back across Russia for you and I'm not doing anything in July Very Happy) a Honda s660 cheapest one is £15K and it probably needs an SVA test on arrival.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 19:10 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those do look a hoot and it would indeed tick the boxes.

However, one other thing I forgot to mention. It needs to be big enough to get a 3/4 size cello in it somewhere (fits in the passenger seat of the copen).
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Fisty
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PostPosted: 19:29 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Workmates Mrs has bought a Fiat Spider Abarth. I had a ride as a passenger it seems fun. The only downsides I can see are:-

It's nearly £30k
It's a Fiat.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 19:37 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fisty wrote:
Workmates Mrs has bought a Fiat Spider Abarth. I had a ride as a passenger it seems fun. The only downsides I can see are:-

It's nearly £30k
It's a Fiat.


I'd kind of noticed the same.

I'd add that it is also a Mazda MX5 (which she professes not to like). I'd got the Fiat Spider at the back of my mind to show her and see if she notices.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 19:43 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bearing in mind I know absolutely nothing about them and am only going on a 2 seater small 'sporty' car, a Smart Roadster?

Although I have no idea if you could fi a cello into it.

https://assets.catawiki.nl/assets/2016/12/14/4/e/5/4e557a52-c203-11e6-9e99-d51632d1a87a.jpg
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arry
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PostPosted: 20:47 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suzuki Swift Sport. Absolutely brilliant hoot of a simple, yet effective little back road hustler. The closest you can get to an original hot hatch these days.

Brilliant.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 21:27 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

MX5.

End of thread.

Or, if you want to go that way... GT86.
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Tracey Suntan-King
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PostPosted: 21:38 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
Bearing in mind I know absolutely nothing about them and am only going on a 2 seater small 'sporty' car, a Smart Roadster?

Although I have no idea if you could fit a cello into it.

https://assets.catawiki.nl/assets/2016/12/14/4/e/5/4e557a52-c203-11e6-9e99-d51632d1a87a.jpg


Yesss. I've got one of these (I may have mentioned it before a few times Silence Dance! ) but mine's a coupe, so you can get more in it.

Utterly, utterly brilliant.

Trouble is they're getting old now and get leaks and electronic problems, but if you find a goodun, they're simply marvellous.

Wub Wub

Here's mine Very Happy

https://i.imgur.com/qURMXGs.jpg
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G
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PostPosted: 23:12 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spend even more and an Alfa 4c for lightness?

Lots of decent little hatchbacks that handle pretty well and so on - mostly positive about 'fun' driving in the 1.0 Fiesta 125 from a few people I know - weighs just over a tonne, 125hp from a revvy 1lt.

Good economy if you don't rev it and not bad power to weight if you do.

Not really 'different' however - the opposite.
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kgm
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PostPosted: 23:47 - 15 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's an Abarth version of the smart roadster. A mate of mine had one alongside his blackbird and loved it. Only issue was that the auto box was slow changing gear.

I know they have a terrible image but the fiesta ST is a lot of fun for the money.

I'd go MX5 or the fiat as well though, but the fuel economy isn't great.

I'll watch this thread with interest as myrs is also looking for setting similar. Sadly the cooper SD is her favourite at the moment.
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Chuffin Nora
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PostPosted: 01:40 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://automotoclassicsale.com/sites/default/files/ebay_271693619943_1.jpg
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 06:30 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want newish / modern - Swift Sport

/end thread

If you don't mind second hand ....

Fiesta ST but they're not small
Toyota Glanza Turbo they're small but not modern
Charade Gtti - but you'll struggle to find a cheap one and those that are cheap are usually ruined / rotted.
Honda DelSoi SiR - but as above and the rear arches rust for fun.

Ragtops - MX5 or if you want more poke /revs then S2000

Hatches ... if you can find an old Honda Civic EG VTI that isn't rusted / ruined then they are a 8500k rpm / 160bhp riot in a very light shell.

All depends on how much tinkering you are happy to do.

We have an S2000 / DelSol and both are fun in their own way but we've also had them each 8+ years and neither are ruined / rotted.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 12:30 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think we need to go and visit this place, they seem to think along the right lines.:

https://www.thecarwarehouse.co.uk/
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I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 12:40 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

What stupid suggestions made in above post.

Stinkwheel's Mrs car is 12 and on 120k he's not going to older and crustier is he? Very lazy suggestions IMO. A CRX del sol?? Really? They will all be rotten to hell, and or badly or extensively modified now. They are a J-tin car that attracts this kind of thing. Find a very rare mint std one and the elderly owner will want alot of money for a 20year old+ car, so not meeting OP's requirements.

Forget old Jap tin unless you want a weekend/trackway/resto project and are a die hard car enthusiast who wants to restore 20year old cars.

If you'd said a used Honda CRZ you'd have made a bit more sense IMO as a modern day cheap to run CRX.

Stinkwheel, what does your Mrs want: A small city hatchback, a coupe or a roadster? Or would she consider any of the above if it was small, fun, and interesting to drive?

Generally your right that most new/modern cars arnt good fun, and are sterile and boring. Those that don't agree show me some fun modern cars, (and GTFO if you say 4wd Quattro S3/4 bollocks).

For small fun hatchbacks the recently discontinued Suzuki Swift Sport as Arry said is a great little car. The also discontinued Renault Twingo GT/Cup is supposed to be equally fun too. Then there's a new Twingo city car with a 0.9L turbo variant that's rear engined and rwd. Might be a fun little machine maybe? Even the Toyota Agyo is a fun little car to drive IMO too. Forget the old VW lupo Gti they are too old/hard to find and have scene tax common to rare fun to drive VAG cars. There's a new Lupo Gti out for about 17k though. Way cheaper than a new bigger small hatch like the excellent Fiesta ST though. I personally think 17k is too much for such a small car and it's also too understated for me.

For roadsters there's Tracy's Smart, but they are oldish now, cultish/ (read expensive and sought after by enthusiasts). I'd not suggest Fiat Spiders or MX5's etc as if you've got to spend 30k to bag a fun and interesting little car these days then your doing it all wrong and it's also so not worth the money.

Fiat 500's are expensive for what is a tiny car with fat tyres and contrived with all that popping exhaust crap IMO. The twin air version sounds more interesting on paper, but no idea what it's like. I can't see past the cutesy girly styling with silly light EPAS and overassisted light brakes and a generic to modern cars fly by wire throttle.

The new Smarts look ugly IMO, but less so is the new Suzuki Ignis. Its like a slightly overgrown G-whizz and if it's basic and light like small Suzukis of old it should be more fun than it looks to drive. I've always liked older Suzuki cars for this reason and I've had two, both which in day to day use were much more fun than my old comparatively heavy weight Rover, with its huge lump of iron block under the front, slowing down steering and encouraging even more under steer, combined with a very high gearing set up and laggy engine.

Not as fun or old as your Copen, but Mitsubishi did their own less pretty colt based folding tin top that was quite nippy too. Not sure I'd get rid of the Copen for one though.

Have a look at the Honda CRZ maybe, as though small coupes are rarely made today, it does have some appeal if you like the Honda spaceship style look?

At least no-one has been stupid enough to suggest a used new shape Audi TT. Show me any modern 4wd coupe or roadster that's fun and genuinely characterful to drive and I'll eat my Arai!

Looking alternatively at your existing hard to replace Diahatsu, is there anything much wrong with it? How about going through it replacing bushes and shocks and getting it professionally undersealed? If you see where I'm going?

My old Rover is a relic, and never was a great handling fwd'er. But theres not much out there coupe wise that's quicker to 100mph, or massively better looking or newer at under £7-8k. If I got rid I'd be looking at equally old crusty curvy coupes like Calibra's, MX6's, old Mitsubishi and Toyota coupes etc, so I'd not really ever move forward, as I just don't see it in modern cars. Someone said I should drive a BMW M140 or Nissan 370Z as they both have an old school feeling about them and are a last of the breed drivers coupe. For that sort of money I'd be thinking of all the 20-30yr old machines I could own and restore instead.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 12:52 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, she would be interested in anything a bit fun and out of the ordinary. In the same vein as the copen but it doesn't HAVE to be a coupe/sports car.

The current one is starting to rot away and parts are starting to seize/rust. That's the main problem. It needs to be reliable. Having the thing entirely detailed and reconditioned is a potential option though. Not sure if people still do that kind of work though and how much it's likely to cost. She took it to a couple of local body repair places and they were pretty much 100% not interested in the idea of getting it in and sorting out all the rust.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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Suntan Sid
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PostPosted: 14:13 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

kgm wrote:
There's an Abarth version of the smart roadster.


No there isn't!
There is a Brabus Smart Roadster, often tested against various Abarths!

The Brabus Smart roadster has a remap to up the HP to 110, everything else "Brabus" about it is bling that adds more weight.
You can have exactly the same remap on the standard roadster and not have the bling weighing you down.

kgm wrote:
Only issue was that the auto box was slow changing gear.


It's hardly noticeable!
As someone who actually drives one, there's sod all wrong with the auto and semi-auto gearbox modes, it takes 2 gear changes to get used to it.
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kgm
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PostPosted: 14:34 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suntan Sid wrote:
kgm wrote:
There's an Abarth version of the smart roadster.


No there isn't!
There is a Brabus Smart Roadster, often tested against various Abarths!


You are of course correct, my brain fart..

No need to get defensive though, I was just reporting what my mate told me about his that he had for several years. Like I said he loved the car but that was his only criticism. He's not the only person to say so either so I guess it bothers some more than others.
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Suntan Sid
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PostPosted: 15:21 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

The mistake people make when driving a Smart Roadster is they've failed to read the owners manual.
Had they read the owners manual they would know that when using semi-automatic mode you keep the accelerator pedal buried, on both up and down changes, this eliminates any "perceived" slowness of the gear change!
Having the opportunity to drive one on roads unencumbered by cameras, were, virtually, no one obeys speed limits, I can assure you, you can hustle one around the twisties very quickly indeed!
If you use the gears, rev range and throttle like you do on a bike it's great!
Would I like one, full time, in the UK, probably not.
They are a very low, small, car, there is too much traffic and too many artics who probably couldn't see you even if they were looking!
The UK weather will try its hardest to kill it, the electrics do not like the rain!
My only niggles with it are the dashboard constantly telling you to change up, (although it is rather satisfying ignoring it), and it's an absolute slug off the line!
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Tracey Suntan-King
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PostPosted: 15:35 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suntan Sid wrote:
.......you can hustle one around the twisties very quickly indeed!
If you use the gears, rev range and throttle like you do on a bike it's great!

My only niggles with it are the dashboard constantly telling you to change up, (although it is rather satisfying ignoring it), and it's an absolute slug off the line!


Oi Sidney! That's it, you're not allowed out in it on your own anymore Mad you naughty fellow Wink

Back on topic, I think the answer is no, there aren't really any newish quirky small cars anymore. The choices are older models for quirkiness/interestingness or newish but common/dull.

If Mrs S loves the Copen, why not replace it with a lower mileage one and keep the old one as a donor?
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thx1138
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PostPosted: 15:44 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blista Compact
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Tracey Suntan-King
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PostPosted: 15:54 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Fuel-Sipping Fun Cars for Summer" according to the short, fat, annoying one from Wheeler Dealers Very Happy

https://mikebrewermotoring.com/2018/06/07/are-these-the-best-fuel-sipping-fun-cars-for-summer/
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 16:42 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
I think we need to go and visit this place, they seem to think along the right lines.:

https://www.thecarwarehouse.co.uk/


I just checked out the site, and your right in one way as they do have an amazing range of different vehicles and some relatively interesting imports and small cars.

I typed in convertible, and found Lotus Elans (very nice) Peugeot 205 CTi's and Nissan Silvia S15 convertibles. (didn't know these existed as rag tops). There's 3 interesting small cars straight away and all fun too IMO.

Downside is paying dealers prices, but then some obscure Imports are hard to find and buy privately or source/import and do the paperwork for.

If Mrs Stinkwheel's Copen needs alot of bodywork then that's a possible down side to keeping it, but you could do as Tracy said and look for a newer cleaner one? Mention the Colt CZC if she likes folding hard top cars, as it's a small nippy car that is built along the same format but hasn't quite got the style of a Copen.

I used to have an MGF and found it fun most of the time, but I'd only buy one now as a cheap resto project as there's plenty of things to go wrong with them, and only one proper way to put them right/make them fairly reliable.
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 16:48 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meh. New cars aren't fun. They are expensive and filled with safety crap.

The Swift is the last of the bargain fun hatches.

Unless you're into spending 15k plus on an UP GTi but even that's apparently not as much fun as it could be. Probably fun enough though.

Quirky small fun stuff doesn't sell in enough volume here to be worth manufacturers importing it or offering it.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 17:05 - 16 Jun 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is true, but remember firms like Diahatsu in the late 90's making some quite interesting and left field small cars like the Coure Avanzatto, or Sirion Rally2. Suzuki with the Ingis sports etc.

Most of these are all enthusiast owned now, and sought after and or expensive for what they are. I think it's worth seeking out small fun cars though, as the world has moved so far away from this concept in today's 'cars arnt a fun thing, but a white goods item to use and discard' mentality.
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