Starting out and wanting advice

[ThePurpleWind]

Alright, so I'm looking to buy myself a 125cc machine soonish (1-2 months) for commuting and a bit of country lane stuff at weekends/days off. I do have a few months riding experience on a Yamaha N-Max scooter from a previous job, so I'm not completely new to the concept of riding, just 95% or so

Anyway, my initial plan was just to straight for my A2 License (I'm 20, so not got the freedom to go full A just yet) when finances permit, which really needs to be taken before September 2019 to avoid forking out for another CBT. I've also passed my theory test last month so I am serious about this.

I booked a taster session at Papillion Training (I live in Manchester) and after picking up basic geared control pretty quickly the recommendation was to purchase a 125cc machine and rack up the miles on that first.

Looking at what's available, there isn't a whole lot available cheaply, that's a proper geared 125cc rather than 50cc mopeds and 125cc scooters, neither of which are any good to learn on. It's all either stuff that needs work or various Chinese makes, which I've heard mixed things about, the negatives being from about 5 years ago so things may have changed since then. I'm also going to need something with a centre stand due to rather limited space where I live. Locked garage is nigh on impossible.

Looking at insurance quotes, I'm getting anywhere between £700 p.a. for a Suzuki Marauder or a Kawasaki Eliminator, neither of which would be easy to get through the gate (I don't have a drive either) through to £1400+ plus for a normal commuter style bike.

Budget is either up to about £600 cash or up to £2000 if it can be financed (so it can done and dusted within 12 months)

So I've essentially got 3 options
1. Buy a used Chinese bike very cheaply and hope it doesn't fall apart
2. Buy a used Japanese bike such as a Honda CB125F etc
3. Buy a new Lexmoto or similar

Also any advice on insurance?

[pepperami]

I’d say go for option number two.
However that said, around here (East Anglia) there are a good few
Lexmotos and Zontes (Chinese) and knowing a couple of owners, they seem happy with their Chinese bikes.
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I am the sum total of my own existence, what went before makes me who I am now!

[stevo as b4]

Yeah I say option two also. You won't really get much 125 worth having for £600 and indeed that's bottom project money for some old bikes. You wouldn't get a decent running decent looking modern one either most likely. And as you said second hand geared 125's are a bit few and hard to come by, and bargains well good luck there!

You'd get a decent second hand Jap or a decent new Chinese bike like a Lexmoto or something well regarded like a Pulse Adrenaline etc for around £2k new.

[Ste]

Go for a number two.

£600 gets you a 125 which is more of a project than a form of reliable transport.

The only advice for insurance is to use price comparison sites to find which insurer is cheapest for you. Who other people have found to be cheapest is irrelevant from your point of view.

https://www.thebikeinsurer.co.uk
https://www.confused.com
https://www.moneysupermarket.com/motorbike-insurance/
https://www.gocompare.com/ps/motorbike/motorbike-insurance

There's also compare the market and MCN to have a look at.

Personally, I'd go for a standard YBR commuter style bike over a Marauder cruiser style bike but that's a matter of opinion.

I tentatively say that because of your age, you might be better getting something on finance which isn't a complete piece of shit as you are almost certainly going to be on for at least a year or two. Look at bank loans as well, finance gives you the attractive option of walking into the dealer and then riding home on your newly financed bike but you might well be able to get a better APR on a bank loan. Plus you can use the bank loan to buy privately which means you get more bike for your money than if you buy from a dealer with your slightly limited budget.

Does your budget include riding kit and security equipment?

[pinkyfloyd]

Make it £800 and come to Portsmouth and I'll get you a full A2 licence. (just get the theory done first)

This includes a 2 day CBT to give you extra experience on a bike. 3 days DAS training and your mod 1 and 2 test fees.
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.

[Kentol750]

Firstly, you need to seriously think about Pinky's licence option. Having an a2 would also bring insurance costs down for a 125. Ste is also right, you have to really shop clever on the comparison sites when it comes to your details. Use an incognito tab if you start getting paranoid about prices. But, a decent 47bhp bike will cost as little as a 125 if you shop wisely.
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Some bikes.

[Teflon-Mike]

Bottom line here is CREDIT.
£600 in the pot, you already know doesn't buy you much of a 125 motorbike. Meanwhgile it doesn't go far towards an A2 course, or even getting an A1, given you need repeat CBT shortly.

Old adage that is much out of fashion in today's credit-culture, If you cant pay hard cash you can't afford it, credit is NOT the soft option... fashions change but truth remains.... and its not just the buying of bike; you have already mentioned insurance, and premium prices twice as much as you barely have cash to buy bike....

If you are short of money, paying 1/3 more to 'rent' some-one else's money to buy a bike, and then 1/3 more to buy insurance you similarly cant afford upfront, IS a rather perverse way of making ends meet.... And there are PLENTY of pit-falls in finance and insurance, and combining the two, is, frankly, like dangling your dangly bits over the mincer whilst stood on roller skates, and shouting "Dont worry, I wont slip!"

SO, as described, I do a Richard Prior and 'Vote None of the Above!", and suggest backing up and revisiting 'the plan' from the top.

WHY do you need transport?

I spent a year in Manchester... admitedly about half your life-time before you were born, but it had pretty good buses running every ten minutes or so, and it was, I cant recall, as or cheaper to get 3 in a taxi coming back from the clubs....

So why do you NEED personal transport?

You have already mentioned the problem of parking, let alone secure parking.. why buy problems if you dont have to?

Yeah, other people do it... if they can afford it, whet the heck.... what you have said so far YOU cant afford it.... neither can other's probably, but that's their problem, and one YOU don't have to have.

Think long and hard about it....

There's 60 million people in the UK, half of them drive a car,and there's more cars for them to drive than there are qualified drivers. There's only something like 7o,ooo motorcycles; half of them are learner legal mopeds and 125's, ANY one of almost 50million folk can get on and ride without taking a test..... And, of them 3o,ooo learner legals, over 2/3 are mopeds and scooters, not geared motorbikes, you would preffer....

THEN, sold on on average every 18 months or so, there's only something like 3ooo the length and bredth of the country that will come up for sale each month.... and at least 1/3 to 1/2 of those will not be even advertised, let alone advertised on a nice convenient web-site on the smurfone in your pocket.....

Manchester.... I still grimace at the "in 'Norf" suggestion; I had freinds that drove 200 miles south to get there, and they didn't talk a forreign language like scootch.... well... actually.. no skipping onwards...

2/3 the population of the UK live south of the wash; that is where more than 2/3 of the bikes in the country also live. And even living in the midlands, almost slap bang on the geometric center of area of the country, a stones throw from Meriden, where they used to make Triumph Bonavilles, I know pickings are a bit 'slim', even when 3 coasts, and 90% of the counrty is within an hour and a halfs 'legal' drive of me....

Point is, first, its a sellers market for Learner-Legals, theres not very many of them, and there's far more people who can ride one, and want one, and 'think' its the panacea to thier transport problems and HAS to be the 'cheap' option, that want them; and most of them are not on your door-step...

And you are looking at the dumbell ends of the market; old bikes at the very bottom end of the market you might buy cash, and the top end, where you might buy on the neva-neva... Which is the same p;lace MOST of the buyers wanting a 125 are at... so join the cueue, wait your turn and DONT expect a 'bargain'.

To find ANYTHING you will have to do some leg work; lots of little bikes, ad mentioned dont get advertised on the smurfone sites; they are traded accross works canteen tables, in college car-parks, or down the club or otherwise by word of mouth. Especially at the lower end of the market, folk are loath to spend money on adverts, so they get stuck in obscure 'free' ads in corner shop windows or local free-papers etc;

You want a 'better' deal on a 2nd hand bike; you HAVE to be prepared to hunt, do the leg work, talk to people, look in all the corner shop windows, all the free papers, and use the grape vine; you will NOT get there so quick only looking at the smurphone! AND you have to be prepared, and able to travel, and travel fast to get to and see anything that may bve worth handing over cash for, and a bit clued up when you get there to be sure it IS before you hand over any cash!

Learner-Legals lead hard lives. Buyers tend to be either learners who know neither how to ride them or look after them, and/or budget commuters, who just want to beat busfares loath to spend a penny on them if they can get away with a cable tie and a bit of saw dust....

This is why so many older, cheaper 125's are frankly complete wrecks... yet, 'cos of buyers market, and fact that buyers are often even more eager and optimistic and even less clued up than the seller... they STILL fetch prices they really dont deserve.

NOW... Typical 125 Learner/Commuter, has anticipated service life of aprox 7 years and perhaps 40,ooo miles. And any dont live that long!

Average annual miles for a motorcycle now, is around 3ooo a year. And that average is brought up an awful lot by commuters, of which most are under 125cc, and used every day transport and frequently crank up 6ooo miles a year or more on them, going to and from work.

More reason so many are in such dire state so early in life' more STILL, it costs almost as much to make a 125cc motorcycle as a 1250cc motorcycle; there's just as many wheels to bolt on the thing; just as many seats; just because the hole where fire happens is smaller is little to no reason they should be any cheaper. Reasomn they are, is because people expect them to be, and are loath to pay so much for a 'small' bike; so they are built down to a price,. and to do that, built down to a quality...

Of which the generic Chinese offerings are some of the lowest; as you might have already noted; because they are mostly built for the developing Asian market where labour is low, and its cheap enough to pay some-one to do the frequent maintenance they need if well used. Here in the UK, labour is expensive, and a mechanic wont be any cheaper, nor will oil or spark plugs because they are working on a Shinray or a Lexmoto not a Honda or Yamaha.

Now, the 'saving' on buy price of a generic chink, starts to pall some, as they demand more paid for labour and parts to keep them working.... take heed. But, with something like 3/4 of the UK small bike registrations, now generic chionese brands, it is something of an accademic topic.

As said, its hobsons choice out there, its a sellers market, there just aren't that many learner legal bikes, and so many more buyers for them, ALL looking to snag something cheaper than a Citreon Saxo, and frustrated they dont have fifty to choose from on thier door-step.

So back to top; 'the plan'... think hard... is there one here?

If you cant afford to pay cash, you cant afford to pay MORE to pay to borrow some-one elses money, either for bike, or to get insurance on the monthly.

There are big stings in the tail, to the credit plan for either, and your insurance quotes are just the first hint; they DONT like young riders, and they dont like 'bad' post-codes, and you are both before you begin...

Next, little bikes get crashed, and get nicked; the risks are high, and Third-Party-Only, doesn't matter whether you are riding a brand new gold plated custom Yamahga YZF-R125 or a rusty ten year old Keeway; you can make just as big a dent in the side of a kiddie carrier full of kittens on either.. and THAT is what you are paying insurance to indemnify yourself against; price of the bike matters not a lot!

Insurance looks like your biggest problem here, and £1200 a year or so, its likely as much or more, than even a brand new Jap brand bike on the monthlies......

There is some justification for 'in for a penny, in for a pound' reasoning here; If you have to get in the sea with the sharks.... you might as well be on a cruise liner as a rubber dingy.... BUT, first step IS to recognize you are getting into shark infested waters!

£100 a month, on the knock for the bike; another £100 a month on the knock for the insurance, and geez, before you have even put petrol in it you have pledged your soul to the credit-devil for half as much as I spend a YEAR on my bike.. total!

Have to say that its one of the few perks of old age, but... I pay about £100 a YEAR for my insurance... and the bike was bought and paid for, cash, over a decade ago, I only have to pay for what I use by way of tyres and petrol and engine oil.... and ALL IN, my annual biking budget is only about £500 a year!

+Commuting..... you say thats main reason for wanting bike... check insurance proposals carefully; its often an 'opt in' on bike policies that are NOT so commonly used for every day sole transport any more; and opting 'in' can put the premiunm up by 30-50% spo be even more expensive than it already seems.....

Insurance is something of a skam, and the biggest sharks live in that particular pool; but its gambling in reverse, and the tables are loaded in their favour, not yours, they do it for a living!!! There's few ways to win, many MANY ways to loose..... and with high compulsary and voluntary exceses on the proposal, its very very VERY easy to end up 'burned' on the deal.

Eg; No4 son, had a CG.... thought he was being smart, and got mummy to insure it for him on the knock.... better post code than one in which he lived; mummy under wrote credit plan, mummy a car driver was even on the policy, to bring it down more; Voluntary excesses were never even looked at, +commuting not ticked... he gave the Ins co EVERY reason to squirm out of paying if he ever had a crash, and being left liable for thier losses on top.... As was, bike was nicked.... ins co did pay out.... but after deducting the excess, and after paying off the credit co for the outstanding balance of the 'monthly plan' he ended up with no bike, no money, and arguments with mummy whop was STILL paying the insurance co, when he was wondering why he didn't have a new bike!!!!

Thats the first sting of buying insurance on the knock; its not pay as you go; its a credit plan to buy a years insurance, and that insurance is ended by a total loss claim; so before they pay you any money, they take all remaining monthly payements for the year off the top, plus thier exceses, plus howver much they have discounted the declared value of bike... and rather than getting money, you CAN end up oweing it... and not monthly. straight away.

And IF the bikes on the knock too? And you were expecting the insurance pay out to clear the outstanding finance? Lol!

Like I said, its shark infested waters, and if you cant afford the buy price and you cant afford the policy premium, up front, CASH out your pocket... you CANT AFFORD it, and rather than making it 'easy' to pay, you can very easily end up finding it even HARDER to pay... not for the bike you would like... but for the bike you no longer have!

BE WARNED.

Like I said, if you can do without a bike.... why buy problems for yourself? Think HARD.

A-N-D there's no good answer to 'what bike';' IF you decide you DO have to have one, or the risks are worth it, its STILL hobsons choice out there; its not like picking a mars bar over a snickers from the counter in the sweet-shop!

Of what is out there, that may be for sale, condition is all; old scrag end bikes tend to be a fools economy needing more £ worth of work than they are ever worth; new bikes and newer bikes, just as much, subject to horrendous new bike depreciation in the order of 30% a year, on top of any credit charges.

The 'bench-mark' best VFM Learner/Commuter bike, has for the last decade or so been the Yamaha YBR125... and one at around 3-4 years old, with a fresh MOT. Likely to cost around £1600, its suffered most of its new bike depreciation to early owners; but, still has decent amount of expected service life still in it
, and fresh MOT is some confidence that it hasn't been thrashed, crashed and trashed to oblivion in the MOT exemption period, and 'should' be pretty road worthy, and not 'so' likely to need work or need expensive repairs or be in dire maintenance over draft.

Also easy to live with; its in all the insurance data-bases, and the spares places catalogues; every one knows what it is, and parts are easy and not too expensive to come by, and you have a good bet they will fit.... which if you are trying to get bits for something of less known name, is not so certain. Insurance companies may turn you away, or give 'quote me silly' prices; parts suppliers likelwise may turn you away as its less hassle than trying to fathom out what you want or need or take risk that bit they order in is 'wrong'. And you will likely find the bit you need just down the road at franchise dealer, on the shelf, ready to go, NOT have to hunt e-bat, take chances and hope bit turns up from China.

Meanwhile, you get a bike that even though made in China, has Jap brand on the tank, and some notional QC applied, built for the western market; book says it should do 65mph... and odds is it will do it.... and do it without the side panels unscrewing or the battery strap taking a walk, where a generic chink, probably will only do 55 flat out and you will be checking the engine mountings every time you ride along with the tyres and the engine oil... like you should.....

SO, all in its the best VFM option; you get a bike, that works, delivers full quota of performance, doesn't demand so much looking after, is easy to get insurance for, easy to get bits for and for as long as you own it, shouldn't cause to too much grief.

Newer bikes cost more in depreciation; older bikes, more in maintenance and hassle; flashier bikes, cost more to buy and more to insure, and more if you need fix them. Chinky bikes cost more to keep on top of the maintenance, and loose more in depreciation when you come to sell.

3-4 year old YBR then tends to be about the optimum Best VFM learner legal motorcycle going....

BUT, you need £1600 to buy one cash, NOT £600...

And you have a dilemma, if you cant afford what is the most economical, easiest to live with 125.... you cant afford to buy cheaper, to spend more on maintenance, and have more hassles for your money along the way, and likely still have something not worth much when you are done. You cant afford to buy more expensive either, and using credit, you are commiting yourself to the shark pool, and paying 1/3 more than you already cant afford for the privilidge...

And to ride anything, you iminently need a repeat CBT... which ironically is likely to cost as much as self booking and taking Theory, and MOd1 and Mod2 for an A1 125 only licence you never need do over to keep riding one....

Sorry, but I dont see this as a choice between Used Chink, Used Jap or New Lexmoto.... I see this as a half cock plan for failure and pain either which way at the moment, NOT a plan for success, to meet transport needs and have a bit of 'fun' on the week-end... I REALLY dont,

Choices in the 125 world, are, stressing the point Hobsons... there ARE no good choices, let alone right or wrong ones; And with maybe £600 cash and likely Commitment to £100 a month insurance and another £100 a month finance, on top of tax and petrol and maintenance and repeat CBT..... DO you REALLY need any bike at all?

You are looking at committing yourself to a LOT of money either way, that you could utterly avoid, along with the associated hassle, just for small hassle of standing at the bus stop....

If you really MUST have a bike... be sure you can afford it; if you apply in for penny on for pound dive in the shark tank thinking to do it on credit, be prepared for shark bites, the risks you will end up spending even more money than you dont have, ending up with even bigger immediate bills than you cant afford now, and you are pledging future income you HAVE to be sure you'll have, to have the privilidge on those bigger bills and risks along the way.

Your call, kid!

But be sure you know what you are getting into, and as far as the choice of bike? You can only buy ones any one offers for sale; which means your choice is probably make believe, it will be honsons. and 'the bike' is at the end of the day, almost the last thing you need.

That impending CBT, is more of a worry; and for the 'fun', saving up a while and taking up Pinky's offer to go do a course when you have saved up, 'just' to get licence in your pocket, could be as much fun for your money as you can get.... BUT... still without the money to make use of it, and buy bike, and Big-Bikes are bigger money-pits than little ones, and given that by the time you might make use of it you could probably do a Ride-What-You-Like DAS either because you have had A2 for two years or have turned 24... that could make even that plan rather redundant and or expensive.

If you dont have a car licence, that £600 would probably be better spent doing car lessons and getting car tests done, which £600 aught cover pretty comfortably, and which gets you full licence, gets clock started on New-Driver-Probation, and is a qualification you can stick down on CV come job hunting, even use to get a McJob delivering parcels or wot-not in a white van, so can be earning you money, not costing it you, whilst you wait for the bus.

THAT is my thinking on the matter.

But, given youthful exuberance; unlikely you will like that answer; and if I was 20 again?. Actually motorbikes wouldn't be my No1 Priority! PARTIES probably would be!!! But, frustration would bite, as it did when I was 19, and I would probably not do the smart thing either; And not doing what I did, which was buy a Kawasaki AR125 on the knock... in for a penny in for a pound, and managed not to loose SO much money along the way, despite the thing being nicked three times; Pay heed, its not a possibility is an almost certainty if you have small bike especially in the city; But not doing what I did, NOW I would probably go for the cheap 2nd hand chink option, as I am a mechanikal engineer by trade.. and do mechanics 'for fun'... and treat the thing as disposable, after saving up a month or two to be able to buy the insurance 'upfront' as well a the bike, and be prepared to take the bus, when it dont work, or isn't where I parked it!!!

End of the day, its ways to skin a cat, and the options you have are legion; but unfortunately there's more bad choices you can make than right ones.... and small solace, you is young, and yoof is for foolishness... so you can get away with a bit of it.... and it dont seem to hurt so much... althought, easy to say when you are puishing fifty! It was a long time ago, I probably cant remember how much falling off hurt, or having to pay HP instrallements on a bike I couldn't ride was, or how foul catching busses was.... roll on alziemers! One of the few benefits of old age... you dont care any more!!!! Every day is a fresh adventure! Lol.

BUT, think long and hard, dont dive in or work on presumption, and consider well, just how much you really NEED motorized personal transport.. and how much you can save NOT indulging in credit-plans.
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[Teflon-Mike]

[ThatDippyTwat]

[Teflon-Mike]

[Rogerborg]

If you ever make it this far, your best choice is option 4: get your license, then get a bike.

Why on earth a training school would recommend that you don't get training baffles me.

Get thee back to a training school (that one, or another one) and get a go on an A2 training bike, even if you have to pay a bit to do so.

If after that, you really, reaaaaaaaaaaally still want to waste your time and money on a tiddler, have at it.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[el_oso]

125's can be a false economy. Insurance is one of the costs that can be higher on a 125.

The bike is usually more expensive to buy too as there is more demand, however get the right bike, keep it in good condition you'll sell it for little loss, so you can recover costs there.

Servicing costs, unless you do things yourself may break even on. Some of these bikes have such a small oil capacity the you need to change the oil every 2k miles, so you coulf find yourself forking out for a service every two months.

Unfortunately, gone are the days when you could buy a 125, ride it around for a year, get good enough on your own bike to do your test and have a cheap intro to biking.

If i wasn't going to lose interest in bikes any time soon, I'd put your dough into doing the biggest test you can, opening up your choice of bike. At the end of the day you could still get a 125 if you wanted to. However if you saw a ninja250 or cbr250 etc that wasn't selling at the asking price, you could easily get a killer deal.
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Duke 390
Previous: '05 XR125L | '96 XJ600S Diversion |'05 Suzuki GSXR1000 | '05 Honda CBR125-R | '97 YZF 600R Thundercat | '11 Honda CBR250
Car: Jeep Wrangler 4.0L

[ThatDippyTwat]

[Teflon-Mike]

[ThePurpleWind]

Great to see so many responses. I also seem to have done my thing of only typing half of what I meant to send, so here's a little more information that probably is relevant.

I do own a car and I use that to commute currently. It's on finance, currently 6 months into a 24 month deal, hire purchase, not any of this PCP gubbins.

Over the past year I've been paying insurance on a monthly basis, yes it's a credit plan, yes I've been paying just under £240 a month on that (so about £2800 a year). First year of driving joys. However, that runs out next month, and I've purchased the insurance upfront, costing £1250. Hence the temporarily limited finances. I have few other outgoings, from next month it's literally car (£168.50 p.m), fuel (approx £60-80 p.m), and housekeeping (I live with my parents currently). I also earn a good wage and work full time as a bus driver.

Probably needed better wording, but the advice from the training school was get some experience on a 125cc first and then go for your license, otherwise it'd be more expensive buying more training than I really needed. I'm a pretty quick learner though, (Having passed both car and bus tests with 19 hours of lessons each) so maybe it would be better to go for the A2 straight away, or at least get a bit of time on a big bike first through a few pay as you go lessons (It's £65 for 2 hours at the training school where I did my CBT).

Been using price comparison sites, and various ones, to get my quotes. Will see where a big bike and a brand new license places me on the scale. I'm hardly a speed freak so have no desire that would be really expensive to insure, like a sports bike, and it's an interesting point that 125cc machines would be more expensive to insure due to the usual complete lack of experience that the riders of such machines seem to have.

I wouldn't have seen the CBT expiring in just over 15 months as impending to be honest, and I've still got just shy of 23 months left on my theory test certificate.

I'm fully aware of the various pitfalls of financing, and in all honesty 1/3 more on the bike is fairly in excess of what I've seen, although for insurance it's not too far off. I had to do that for my first year insurance on the car, that first year on anything is always going to be damn expensive unless you wait 5-10 years, and what would be the point in that?

[Rogerborg]

[Teflon-Mike]

[linuxyeti]

[ThePurpleWind]

250s do seem to be in abundance new, both from the Jap manufacturers and the various rebranded Chinese bikes like Herald and Bullit.

Experimenting with different bikes, the usual suspects for a A2 license holder, Yamaha MT-03, Honda CB500F, etc all return rather high insurance premiums, about £2800, so what I paid for my first year as a car driver. Something like a Royal Enfield is quite cheap comparatively, getting down to around £1200 for a Classic 300. Scooters that fall into around the 300cc category like the Honda Forza go even cheaper still, although then that's with trusty old MCE and the £1150 excesses etc. Nothing against owning a scooter, the image doesn't bother me one jot unlike a lot of people, whether I'd own one as an only bike though I'm not entirely sure.

[Kentol750]

You looked at a 2003 er5/cb500/gs500? Or a restricted 600cc bike?
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Some bikes.

[ThePurpleWind]

Restrictors seem to be no good for insurers unfortunately, only a few will quote and it's all silly amounts upwords of 3k+

Baseline cheapest insurance I've been able to get quoted on is £700 exactly, on numerous bikes, mainly classic bikes, cruisers or classic style ones.