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| TheFlyingEngl... |
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TheFlyingEngl...
Borekit Bruiser
Joined: 05 Oct 2017
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 Posted: 18:56 - 25 Jun 2018  Post subject: Headbutting the Side of the Road - Running Issue |
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Okay so what I'm going to do is post my last posts I made on a ZXR owners group, seems as if nobody can really help on there so thought I'd come over here. I shall quote what happened.
The bike is a 1991 ZXR 400
| Quote: | So after a long weekend of headbutting the wall and troubleshooting with individuals, I've lost all motivation to continue work on my good old ZXR.
It's recently had Valve Clearances, new cam chain all done, new carbs stripped down with the right can on my micron system added onto it, it was jetted up to 100 and it ran fine. No flat spots when running It struggled to start but other than that it was bang on (It does smell rich, I was about to throw in the original 95's to see if it was fine).
I went out for a ride on Friday and it was fine, started up wonderfully and ran great. Took it to the petrol station and filled up. Then it struggled to start, beforehand it would randomly cut out like it had no fuel, thought something was clogged in it, after 2 days I had enough, took about 8 seconds on the start button to turn on after filling up. Then I took it home, stripped all the fuel lines, already have a new fuel filter, stripped the petcock and cleaned that out, put it all back together. On Saturday I took it out, after 3 minutes I got onto a straight and gave it some beans up to 60. The bike kept acting like it had no fuel, it cut out and died on the side of the road.
After waiting 2 hours on the side of the road for the AA, he soon arrived and the bike turned back on. Rode it home with him behind (Five minutes down the road, if that). And it cut out and died. I then just took it out today. Rode 2 minutes down the road and up a hill, slowed down to go down a back lane and it cut out again. I then rolled it down a hill and it wouldn't even bump start, I'd go to bump it and it would even turn back on. When I got close to the end of the hill it fired and sounded like it was dead, sounded like it was dying and then after 6 seconds of it sounding like a dead piece of crap it fired back on slowly and I kept having to rev the throttle, got to the road of my house and it died again, the engine sounded like it had hardly any fuel again and then when I let go of the throttle it died but after riding it today it sounded like it was also misfiring as well.
This bike has only just got out of the garage after having everything done, it has a CBR 600RR coil pack upgrade, new carbs that were stripped and cleaned out and upjetted to 100 from 95. I'm pretty stumped and pissed off. I need it to sort out for work and I'm on a limited budget now as I was given money to buy new carbs. But now it's got to the point where it's annoying. I sorted out the cooling system, the bike gets hot every now and then from sitting in traffic for ages but the fan comes on and it goes straight back down. There doesn't seem to be any compression loss at all, it has quite a lot of back pressure and rides like a rocket.
I got given a replacement fuel pump today and a new starter relay, just as I thought the pump was dying and the relay looked crap. The bike has a K&N Filter, Micron System and that's it. I just want it back on the road. Unsure of this issue. Sometimes it would start, sometimes it wouldn't. If it's left for ages and I go to start it, it would struggle for ages to start. 8 seconds on the starter button. After a while of it running you could turn it off and start it fine after a few times. It's charging well, it has a new battery and a new rectifier and the volts are very good.
It's frustrating and I've spoken to a few people about the carbs and my next step was to re-jet or have a look at the Pilot Jet screw. But I seriously doubt it's that issue, I know the carb's need balancing but after today I don't want to waste time when others could potentially have another answer. |
Video 1 of it dying after first checks and big clean out whilst balancing carbs.
https://youtu.be/47D-wCOw4rc
After this post, I reset the pilot air jets to default but to no avail no luck.
Second post
this is a follow-up post from the last.
| Quote: | The issue the bike had is it would ride well and then once I slowed down it would turn off.
I was told to reset the carbs, reset the carbs as they were bad, cleaned and stripped them down with carb cleaner and air compressor.
Rejetted to 100's due to K&N air filter and Micron System.
The broke down and the AA came out and followed me home as my bike made a miracle of a recovery and once we got back (2 minutes away) it died again, we then said it was the fuel pump.
Just so people know the fuel pump is the 20 quid one everyone is complaining about, I got sent a replacement and that's what was running on the bike today. I am now waiting for an OEM pump that arrives on Wednesday.
The fuel tank was clean, rebuilt and cleaned the petcock, new fuel lines, new fuel filter (Found a kink in the pipe so got the right length set). The carbs were also balanced as best as I could get them before the bike started dying.
I think took the plugs out and they were coated in oil, the good man James Wylde told me to look at the spark plug seals so I did and they were naff, got new ones and they fit perfectly.
Had some iridium NGK plugs leftover so I put those in, fit perfectly.
The bike is currently running...
Shitty 20 quid fuel pump.
NGK Iridium Plugs.
2007 CBR 600RR Stick Coil Conversion
K&N Filter.
Micron Full System.
New Fuel Lines and Fuel Filter.
Rebuilt Carbs and Cleaned Carbs.
Balanced Carbs.
Valve Clearances done with new Cam Chain.
So I'm waiting till Wednesday for the new OEM pump. Not sure if it's going to fix it or not.
Now I've shared a video, as I felt good today and put the bike back together I took it out for a spin,
it rides fucking beautifully. It picks up well and there are no flat spots, the clutch felt weird so I just need to adjust it.
After a 5 minute ride I slowed down into a laybye to turn around, went to turn around and the bike cut out very slowly.
Tried to start the bike again and wouldn't.
Waited 20 seconds went to start and held the bike open with full throttle
Took about 5 tries.
Once the bike started I had to pin it on full throttle and the bike would only idle, it sounded really rough.
Called a friend just for a chat, put my gear back on and went to start it, pinned the throttle and then the bike revved up.
Launched away in a race back to my house.
Got back it idled for about 8 seconds and then died again.
Got the old man out and he had a look and turned on the bike, had to pin it to full throttle again and it was just idling, wouldn't go any higher and then all of a sudden REV, it started revving like it was back to life and then it died once again.
Pretty stumped, it really does sound fuel related and I'm pretty stuck on what to do. |
Video 2 of it dying on the side of the road.
https://youtu.be/AoyhTE5GViU
The update post was from today, came back and then it died again. About an hour ago I bypassed the fuel relay and it was running slightly better, and would turn on slightly easier but it kept turning off, the revs would drop and die or it would slowly die out.
Originally the problem was it felt like it was running out of fuel on the road, so I rebuilt the fuel system, new fuel lines, filters, rebuilt, cleaned the carbs etc. Everything I could think of.
The bike will idle and slowly turn off, about 40 seconds, I timed it in the last video. The idle will stick high or rev high and drop slowly (I've been told that's running lean but there's no point in fixing it if the bike itself has a big issue with it) which is fair enough.
Earlier on today I simply stopped to turn round and what the bike does is it'll drop the idle and die out. Everytime. No idea what I can do as I don't think the OEM pump is going to fix the issue yet I could be majorly wrong as the pump I have is shocking.
Video 3 of it dying after 40 seconds with pump relay bypass.
https://youtu.be/bwfYiQyMV5Q |
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| stinkwheel |
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist
Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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Posted: 19:21 - 25 Jun 2018  Post subject: |
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Connect a bit of clear hose to one of the carb drain spouts, bend it up alongside the carb and attach it there with a cable tie. Open the drain screw. As long as the top of the hose is higher than the top of the float bowl, you shouldn't spill any fuel. If it pisses out, your needle valve is leaking.
You now have a visual indication of the fuel level in your float bowl. The level in the hose is the same as the level in the carb. You will now be able to see if it's fuel starvation at idle.
Also try it with the fuel cap open in case it's a blocked breather.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
Last edited by stinkwheel on 19:31 - 25 Jun 2018; edited 1 time in total |
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temeluchus
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TheFlyingEngl...
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TheFlyingEngl...
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| Posted: 21:06 - 27 Jun 2018 Post subject: |
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Okay so still having issues.
Checked the fuel level, came up to 8mm below the fuel mark where it is supposed to be. All carbs were the same, carbs are basically balanced, haven't checked the air filter yet but I don't think it needs checking.
Air Mixture / Fuel Mixture set to default.
Fuel Level checked.
Float Level checked.
New fuel pump installed, OEM.
New fuel filter, fuel lines.
Re done the wiring for the fuel relay with new fuel relay.
New 30 AMP Main Fuse Relay.
Went out today hoping it would change, then pulled over, the bike died at low revs, sounded rough as it was idling at about 250/100 revs and then died. Went to start it again gave it full throttle and the bike turned back on slowly, I was on full throttle and the bike was idling at about 1500 revs then after 5 seconds the bike came back to life and I flew home to make sure I wouldn't be stuck on the side of the road, got home did the same test. Turned the back on will full throttle and it turned back on and idled and as soon as I let go it died. |
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temeluchus
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| stinkwheel |
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stinkwheel
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| Posted: 11:06 - 28 Jun 2018 Post subject: |
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Carb diaphragm(s)?
Worth adding at this point that 90% of carburettion problems are electrical. Your rev counter doesn't appear to be dipping when it cuts out however is the spark good and coming in at the right time? It's diffcult to tell which is why people start dismantlig their cazrbs in the hop this is the problem. You'd need a strobe to check. I've seen intermittant problems like this with shorts, bad coil earths, duff CDIs, damaged pickup coils and spun up flywheels before.
Have a look up under the tank, and around the HT side in the dark, see if they are arcing.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles. |
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| A100man |
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A100man
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| Posted: 11:58 - 28 Jun 2018 Post subject: |
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| stinkwheel wrote: | Carb diaphragm(s)?
Worth adding at this point that 90% of carburettion problems are electrical. Your rev counter doesn't appear to be dipping when it cuts out however is the spark good and coming in at the right time? It's diffcult to tell which is why people start dismantlig their cazrbs in the hop this is the problem. You'd need a strobe to check. I've seen intermittant problems like this with shorts, bad coil earths, duff CDIs, damaged pickup coils and spun up flywheels before.
Have a look up under the tank, and around the HT side in the dark, see if they are arcing. |
+1 and loose connections anywhere in ignition circuit. if not time to get the carbs off again for another clean. The were clean once but if there's been shit in the tank, well..
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Now: A100, GT250A, XJ598, FZ750
Then: Fizz, RS200, KL250, XJ550, Laverda Alpina, XJ600, FZS600 |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 5 years, 302 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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