First post, first bike - advice/feedback please.

[robobozo]

Hey all,

Noob here, first post - I’m hoping for some feedback on my bike plans…

Bit of a late starter (late-40s), haven’t been round cars or bikes since my teens/twenties but last year I started looking at Cafe Racers on Pinterest and now there’s this lovely old Norton that’s been passing me on my way to work recently and now here I am!

I’m going the DAS route to get my licence. More expensive in the short-term but I think it’ll be a better move in the long-term. I live in London so a cc limit of 125 suits me for now - but I would like the option to go for something bigger in case I want to venture outside the M25.

Looking at a 2nd-hand Suzuki GN125/250. Seems like they’re reasonably well regarded, they come up for sale pretty regularly, I like the look of them stock and I’ve seen some lovely rebuilds.

I want a bike to ride and have fun with - but I do also want a bit of a tinkering project and I am looking at doing some custom work on it. This is for my own enjoyment, I don’t have a budget or a timeline and I plan to do the work in chunks as and when I can.

Having said that - there’s a few things I’m considering doing sooner rather than later

1) Lower front forks/triple trees for a more ‘traditional’ stance and/or adjust rear suspension to match as needed
2) Replace handle bars
3) Add Clip-on mirrors

I understand that messing with forks/suspension is not a job to be taken lightly - my thinking is that it would make more sense to do it while I’m getting used to the bike rather than after I’ve settled in to it.

I figure those are three things I could get a decent specialist bike mechanic to handle and I’d be taking the bike to someone respectable for a first once-over anyway. Currently looking at Zenith in North London as they’re local to me. I believe they also do basic maintenance courses.

So - does that sound like a fair plan? Anything that is not making sense or just not smart? Are there better ways of approaching a slow-paced, low budget tinkering build like this?

Thanks in advance!

/ J

[Rogerborg]

How did you get on during your CBT?

After you've been trained and tested on a 595cc+ 40kW+ bike, I think it's unlikely that you'll settle for something with 10-20hp and a small handful of torques.

CBT, training, tests and licence first, then think about bikes.

I now hand you over for your ritual Teffing, which will say much the same as the above in 8,000 words.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Teflon-Mike]

No, it does NOT make more sense to start effing with the suspension before you 'get settled in to it'... not having ridden anything before, let alone the bike in standard form, how the heck will you have the first clue, whether what you have changed has made it better or worse, or if its just you, the way you are riding the thing.

First; Rushing is a fast way to hurt when it comes to motorbikes.... slow down, take it easy!
Next; Keep-It-Simple-Silly... ONE thing at a time.

The clasic Cafe, you suggest as inspiration, is the Triton; Norton fetherbed frame and road-holder forks for handling; Triumph bonaville, twin-carb engine for power and speed; detail to suit tast with bum-stop (plank!) saddle; large beaten aluminium petrol tank, rear-set foot-pegs, clip-on handle-bars for a crick in the neck, and almost everywhere else tbh...

GN125/250.. for a Cafe-Racer?!?!? It's a ruddy cruiser! (ish).. more accurately its a latre 70's contrived 'Factory custom' a reletively conventional commuter bike, with token cruisery features like forward set highway pegs, pull-back handlebars, short rear shocks, long front forks and a step-seat...

It IS rather like starting with a Cadilac and saying you want to turn it into a Ferarri... it's just such a step in the opposite direction, as to really not be a particularly viable place to start.

Dont stop people... they have wire wheels, which gets them all exited, and off they go to make shitting-frog riding posiution Cafe-Brat-Chop-Scramblers that feature all manner of influences of classic and custom design... and rarely achieve much but looking like you should be rat talking about the merits of Remington type writers over an Apple mac in a Starbucks! But still...

Click profile; and you will find a few links to tiddler projects that I have done; pretty much straight renovations; 'to the book'.. this keeps things simple; you aren't trying to re-invent the wheel, just follow trhe air-fix model instructions to glue tab a to flap b etc.

Now... think long and hard on this; I am a mechanical engineer; I used to earn my crust developing missile guidance systems for the militery... I do this sort of chit for fun, and have a very long record of doing projects, and completing them... which is quite rare... about 1 in 10 motorbike projects ever come close to being 'done' less pass an MOT, even less still get regularly used, as even thier creators find them unreliable and or uncomfortable, and rapidly wheel them back in the shed to fix the stuff they didn't do or did wrong or really wasn't such a great idea when they were getting all exited about 'making it a bobber!'...

Be warned... you do not, buy a junk motorbike, wheel it in the shed on Friday; order a credit card limit load of bits from a magazine or brochure or e-bay... and just wack them together over a bank-holiday week-end!

And doing one 'here and there, as and when'... sorry, but thats a plan NOT to do anything from the off.

When you start a project, you need to be pretty clear what you are about, and how you are going to do it, and disciplined to stick fairly close to your principles for the project, and THEN you need the number one ingredient, which is project momentum... you HAVE to keep it going or it stops, and that's it.. it never gets going again.

Doing a project by installement, really is a bad idea; because every time you stop... its that much harder to get it going again; especially if it isn't going well, and or doesn't feel like it's going anywhere. Which, when it comes to it, and you get down to the nitty gritty, and its all cleaning and sanding and sorting and faffing with wires, and finding the little problems, it feels like its sapping all your energy and you dont have anything to show for it, it can be very hard to carry on even if you dont stop!

Add in the stop-start load of working out where you got to last time, what you should be doing this time, sorting out and tidying up to get on with a job, and sorting out and tidying up after... you can spend a lot of time doing stuff and not making progress or getting the job shifting, and more 'drag' to momentum.

Doing a straight renovation, not being overly fancy about it, but doing it to a reasonable standard, I reckon on around 300 man hours... hands on.. thats about six or seven full working weeks, nine to five, or every weekend for a full year... not a couple of weekends and a week off work! and that's for a straight renovation, to the book, no trial and error make ity up as you go along ideas to be incorporated.

See why so many projects get started and so few finished?

So... Keep it Simple Jeep it STANDARD, at least for a first project!

You need a licence... split that out; work on that as ONE project.

You want a cafe racer... ponder that a second project... and the notion that its almost always cheaper and easier to buy a straight standard bike that needs no work doing to it, than one that needs work, more needs more work still to turn into something its not to start with.

As said the quintessential Cafe is a Triton. This is a pretty well known quantity and depsite possible variation pretty well known.

But, if you want to find out of you can live with such a beast, first start with a few months on something a little more contemprary that is easy to ride and easy to live with. Then perhaps try living with an old Meriden Bonny, in standard form, and see how you get on with the idiocyncracies of right foot down for up gear-change and adusting cable operated twin-leading-shoe drum brakes... as well as stopping with them on old ribbed cross-ply tyres... you probably will have very different opinions of a Triton if you do... and however much you love the look... probably not have the enthusiasm to try use one for more than a garage trophy or very short outings!

And that;'s off the shelf... doing your own 'custom' project, as a learner never having done it before, not having a licence or knowing what riding a regular bike is like.... the ambition here is enormouse.

Slow down, one thing at a time, and lower the ambition and expectation levels a little.

Start JUST with getting the licence... that's enough to be getting on with.
____________________
My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[arry]

Hi!

Firstly - look at security options and insurance prices; living in London is a curse for you when it comes to biking. Too many robbers, not enough cops.

Secondly - what Roger said really. Makes far more sense to have some bike experience of the recent variety and then work out what you want to do. Your view will change massively upon that. My dad was a biker in the 70s (illegal bro, byklaff v1.0) and went for his DAS in later life and didn't get past the lessons stage, it just didn't feel right to him any more. I hated my CBT and could have easily binned it off after that but glad I persevered.

Thirdly - bike wise look at Royal Enfield just because I own one and therefore it's the best worst bike there is.

Lastly - enjoy yourself and don't be put off by the Tefathon.

[Rogerborg]

[robobozo]

[arry]

You'll ride a small bike on CBT. You'll ride a bigger bike on DAS. Once you've done that second bit you'll realise just how much easier it is to ride bigger bikes. More stable, better suspension, better brakes, more get out of jail free.

In a lot of ways it's a better route through going from middle ground to lower.

[robobozo]

[arry]

A new Enfield is about 4 grand. I picked my standard model up, with just 400 miles and 4 months since registration under its belt, at under 3 grand. Loads of modifications available at cheap money to make it more 'your own' without going mental, and plenty of mental options if that floats your boat.

One to look into, anyway.

[robobozo]

@Teflon-Mike Thanks for the best and most detailed forum welcome I've ever had - I'll do my best to pick out some key bits...

[Rogerborg]

[Pete.]

Good old Tef. Why use one word when a hundred will do?
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good

[stevo as b4]

I'd set your sights a bit higher in ideals than 'Honda Civic > Dodge Charger' it would be very possible/straight forward with some spare cash to waste to make a Honda Civic embarrass a 440 Hemi Charger in a straight line easily, and to make a Civic handle like one, well you'd really need to know how to fuck up a cars suspension completely to achieve that!

[Teflon-Mike]