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Jayy |
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Jayy Mr. Ponzi
Joined: 08 Jun 2009 Karma :
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Posted: 02:07 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: Roundabouts - Who's right? |
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So two things recently happened:-
https://www.facebook.com/michael.t.kinsella/videos/2049136035121171/
This chap almost gets mowed down, the road markings clearly say straight on or right for him and the BMW almost changes lane and wipes him out.
Same thing happened to someone I know the other day but slightly different.
1. Van positions himself to come off to the left. Car is indicating left as van looks like going left too.
https://i.imgur.com/VPHPSLz.jpg
2. Van goes round roundabout to right instead of turning off and side swipes the car ( he didn't check if there was anything in his blindspot ).
https://i.imgur.com/DzAwQVE.jpg
There are no road markings on this roundabout. This is the actual roundabout taken from Google maps. Just like in the Bike / BMW video, pretty much the same thing happened.
Now I know the highway code states stay left lane to go left and right to go right but the above bike / BMW video shows what everyone on here probably sees every single day of their life whilst driving, I literally see it every day. There's one local to me that every time I go round it, I think to myself, "If that guy on the left wants to go right, he's going to wipe me out", yet it's a dual lane roundabout leading off a motorway.
1. Here it is as you approach it. Arrows showing you can go straight on in both lanes.
https://i.imgur.com/m83WkPs.png
2. White car if it wanted to could decide to go right... wiping you out.
https://i.imgur.com/QZBfO0P.jpg
So the question is, who's at fault? |
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recman |
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recman World Chat Champion
Joined: 26 Mar 2012 Karma :
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defblade |
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defblade World Chat Champion
Joined: 30 Apr 2009 Karma :
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Posted: 06:59 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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So many people do so many fuckwitted things on roundabouts that I have adopted the advice usually given on PistonHeads: never go around a roundabout next to another vehicle. Be properly in front or just stay behind. This goes double for lorries.
This simple advice works wonders, you just have to stop looking at roundabouts in general as an overtaking opportunity. ____________________ Honda Varadero 125cc => Suzuki Bandit 650 33bhp => 77bhp =>
BMW K1200R Sport 163bhp => Aprilia Shiver GT 750 95bhp |
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Pete. |
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Pete. Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Aug 2006 Karma :
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Posted: 07:13 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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It's just something to watch out for because you see it happen all the time. Guy in the left lane should have thought ahead and got in the right lane for going round. Guy in the right lane should have thought ahead and made up some ground on the guy in the left so his indicator would be plain to see and the side of his vehicle was presented to him, or else he should have got in the left lane for a safe exit. ____________________ a.k.a 'Geri'
132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good |
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arry |
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arry Super Spammer
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G |
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G The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002 Karma :
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doggone |
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doggone World Chat Champion
Joined: 20 May 2004 Karma :
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MCN |
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MCN Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Jul 2015 Karma :
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Posted: 08:47 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: Re: Roundabouts - Who's right? |
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Jayy wrote: | So two things recently happened:-
https://www.facebook.com/michael.t.kinsella/videos/2049136035121171/
This chap almost gets mowed down, the road markings clearly say straight on or right for him and the BMW almost changes lane and wipes him out.
Same thing happened to someone I know the other day but slightly different.
1. Van positions himself to come off to the left. Car is indicating left as van looks like going left too.
https://i.imgur.com/VPHPSLz.jpg
2. Van goes round roundabout to right instead of turning off and side swipes the car ( he didn't check if there was anything in his blindspot ).
https://i.imgur.com/DzAwQVE.jpg
There are no road markings on this roundabout. This is the actual roundabout taken from Google maps. Just like in the Bike / BMW video, pretty much the same thing happened.
Now I know the highway code states stay left lane to go left and right to go right but the above bike / BMW video shows what everyone on here probably sees every single day of their life whilst driving, I literally see it every day. There's one local to me that every time I go round it, I think to myself, "If that guy on the left wants to go right, he's going to wipe me out", yet it's a dual lane roundabout leading off a motorway.
1. Here it is as you approach it. Arrows showing you can go straight on in both lanes.
https://i.imgur.com/m83WkPs.png
2. White car if it wanted to could decide to go right... wiping you out.
https://i.imgur.com/QZBfO0P.jpg
So the question is, who's at fault? |
Do not overtake at or near functions.
Problem solved.
Lack of lane markings or signage doesn't help. Shite road layout/design/engineering.
If it gets to court the car will get most of the blame indicators, road design or not. ____________________ Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN. |
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G |
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G The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002 Karma :
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grr666 |
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grr666 Super Spammer
Joined: 16 Jun 2014 Karma :
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Posted: 09:16 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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Quite likely either was being directed by a nav unit, they often get confusing and lag at critical moments.
Maybe both were new to the area and trying to find somewhere unfamiliar. I'd say it was 50/50, both could
have been positioned more favourably. ____________________ Currently enjoying products from Ford, Mazda and Yamaha
Ste wrote: Avatars are fine, it's signatures that need turning off. |
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- Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Oct 2013 Karma :
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doggone |
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doggone World Chat Champion
Joined: 20 May 2004 Karma :
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Wonko The Sane |
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Wonko The Sane World Chat Champion
Joined: 20 Jan 2013 Karma :
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Posted: 10:58 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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with roundabouts like these, there is often some expectation that the main A road that goes 'straight on' over them that people proceed round the roundabout as though they are still on that A road, some people in the left lane leaving off to the left, people in the right lane continuing round the roundabout but most traffic in both lanes following the main route.
This is how people seem to drive.
The issue comes when people have joined from the left and are abiding by the 'left lane for left turn or straight on' advice from the highway code, their straight on is at odds with the main route.
Got a link to google maps to see the whole layout of the junction? ____________________ Looking to pass your CBT / Bike tests in Bury Lancashire? try www.focusridertraining.co.uk Would recommend.
They're also on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/pages/Focus-Rider-Training/196832923734251 |
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chickenstrip |
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chickenstrip Super Spammer
Joined: 06 Dec 2013 Karma :
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Posted: 11:19 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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This kind of thing is just where you have to use anticipation of what other road users might do, to stay safe. Give yourself the room to get clear of anyone you suspect might suddenly change their minds or do something stupid. It's all just part of riding on the roads. With busy roads, you can never be totally safe from the idiots - you just give yourself the best chance you can. ____________________ Chickenystripgeezer's Biking Life (Latest update 19/10/18) Belgium, France, Italy, Austria tour 2016 Picos de Europa, Pyrenees and French Alps tour 2017 Scotland Trip 1, now with BONUS FEATURE edit, 5/10/19, on page 2 Scotland Trip 2 Luxembourg, Black Forest, Switzerland, Vosges Trip 2017
THERE'S MILLIONS OF CHICKENSTRIPS OUT THERE! |
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MCN |
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MCN Super Spammer
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NutsyUk |
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NutsyUk Nearly there...
Joined: 22 Jun 2016 Karma :
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johnsmith222 |
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johnsmith222 World Chat Champion
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u33db |
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u33db Renault 5 Driver
Joined: 26 Sep 2008 Karma :
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Posted: 12:53 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: Re: Roundabouts - Who's right? |
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I watch a lot of videos like this at lunchtimes were the motorcyclist has been seemingly "wronged" by a car driver through no "fault of their own".
You could argue thats the case here and that the BMW driver "should have been looking" but roundabouts aren't for overtaking; i don't know what the speed deficit is but its large enough for him to already have passed one truck and got up along side the car and realistically no driver can watch their mirrors 100% of the time.
So they're both wrong for me; car driver COULD maybe have been more vigilant and the bike SHOULD have been going slower.
Whatever the cause the bike rider shouldn't be swearing at the driver like they've just raped his wife...i mean i doubt it was on purpose and we all make mistakes...no need to go nuclear. |
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Skudd |
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Skudd Super Spammer
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NutsyUk |
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NutsyUk Nearly there...
Joined: 22 Jun 2016 Karma :
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- Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Oct 2013 Karma :
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Posted: 14:18 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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doggone wrote: | mpd72 wrote: | If there's two lanes on and off a roundabout, you should only be in the left lane if you're leaving at the next exit.
(Unless you're a foreign HGV driver in Dover, then you go all the way around the roundabout in the outside lane and wipe out 5 plus cars every week).
Happens a lot near the Channel ports. As a local, you learn to expect it and be very wary if you're on the inside of a foreign HGV and about to leave a roundabout. |
Spot on, the car should have moved to the left before the exit giving others time to react.
Roundabouts work well if people would top trying to be clever to gain a couple of places.
You see just the same thing at motorway exits where they simply must get past one more truck. |
Not strictly true and not the point I was making., Left lane is next exit only, right lane can be next exit or carrying on round.
Many roundabouts on dual carriageways are dual on and dual off and it's even signed for straight on traffic to use both lanes. It's the twat in the left lane crossing the exit on a dual lane roundabout who's in the wrong. ____________________ TZR250 2MA road, TZR250 1KT road, TZR250 2MA race, TDR250, YZF-750R Boost colours.
Jaguar S Type 3.0 V6 Sport R, VW Transporter T5 GP LWB Shuttle 140ps DSG. |
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Skudd |
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Skudd Super Spammer
Joined: 01 Oct 2006 Karma :
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Posted: 14:21 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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Yes I'm sure it's overtaking. As an ADI I taught people about the use of round abouts with their pit falls and what to expect and do, especially in such a scenario. ____________________ Famous last words of Humpty Dumpty. " Stop pushing me "
Petty Anarchists look at "1984".............. The Visionary looks at "Animal Farm". |
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- Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Oct 2013 Karma :
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- Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Oct 2013 Karma :
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Posted: 14:23 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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MCN wrote: | Unless lanes are marked with arrows you can enter in the left and either take the first turn or the next or the next.
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Sorry, but that's bullshit.
If you want to turn right on a dual lane roundabout, you do not go all the way around in the left lane, across 3 exits, not matter what you think.
A link to the highway code saying otherwise would be useful, as would rocking horse poo. I can't believe how many on here don't even know the basics of driving.
https://travel.stackexchange.com/questions/73754/how-do-i-safely-navigate-a-two-lane-roundabout-in-the-uk[/quote]
Quote: | In a two-lane roundabout, drivers may be expected to use the outer lane for a ΒΌ circle and the inner lane in all other circumstances. Using the inner lane requires:
Crossing the outer lane to the inner lane when entering the roundabout. This is relatively easy, as I can usually safely stop and wait until there is room to enter the roundabout.
Transferring from inner lane to the outer lane prior to my exit.
On a straight road, it is straightforward to view in my rear mirror what lane other traffic is in, but on a roundabout, I get confused. Are there some tricks to determine the lane of traffic behind me on the two-lane roundabout?
If there is traffic in the outer lane, I am stuck and I cannot exit. I can also not stop safely. Should I keep driving in circles in the inner lane until there is space to exit to the outer lane? |
https://i.stack.imgur.com/0lT4V.jpg ____________________ TZR250 2MA road, TZR250 1KT road, TZR250 2MA race, TDR250, YZF-750R Boost colours.
Jaguar S Type 3.0 V6 Sport R, VW Transporter T5 GP LWB Shuttle 140ps DSG. |
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MCN |
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MCN Super Spammer
Joined: 22 Jul 2015 Karma :
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Posted: 14:34 - 02 Aug 2018 Post subject: |
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I linked to the Highway Code.
Rule 185
It is not more complex than it need be. ____________________ Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN. |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 5 years, 239 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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