Frank Thomas leathers? 'Steered' to them instore, but -help?

[MikeM696]

(edit: sorry for the long post!)

Okay - 1st post, new member - getting back on a bike after years away from them. Hope you don't mind an advice post as my first post! Feels a bit cheeky, but in need of advice / sense-check!

So I headed to my local bike shop (J & S in Bristol) to buy a lid & leathers (got the old ones out of the loft... Oddly they have shrunk mysteriously around the belly over the years! That, or... NAH! They must have shrunk, right?!).

I was looking at an Alpine or Dainese jackets and the guy in the store steered me towards FT. He reckoned they'd be better for my new ride (an '08 Monster 696), due to not being curved-armed like race-jackets are more.

I'd not heard of the brand (FT) before, so asked his thoughts on them, he reckoned they were decent, with a solid history of providing mid-range but good kit (more in this in a mo!).

So in the end, on his advice I went with a FT leathers - jacket & trousers:

- FT Dynamic Jacket
- FT Dynamic Trousers

I did have a brief concern that they were cheaper, but figured WHY would the guy in the store be steering me to something cheaper rather than letting me spend more, other than being a sound guy & being honest.

Anyway, I get back home, check a few forums & see FT gear being critisized/complained about all over the place!

Then I did up some research & find Frank Thomas was bought by J & S in 2011! So now I see WHY he steered me to the cheaper gear! OWN BRAND and likely much higher mark-up. Shitty.

I wouldn't mind so much, but I specifically asked about the brand. Now at this point if he'd said: "It's actually a brand we own and 'blah blah blah'" fair enough, but the fact he failed to disclose this info makes me a bit p!55ed off with him, and trust = blown.

So this brings me to my question (sorry for the waffle!):
----------

Am thinking of returning (unused, in bag, labels attached etc), BUT...

- What do folks here think of FT gear POST the 2011 buy-out by JS? Many of the threads where I saw issues were pre-2011, so I thought I'd ask if anyone here has thoughts/experience with FT post 2011 leathers - Especially any crash/spill experiences?

I did hunt for crash-test data but it seems a little thin on the ground, except for this: https://www.agvsport.com/2004/2004/custom/MCNandRidetests.htm

Anyways - thoughts VERY much appreciated and again, sorry for the long advice request post as my intro! (bike arrives Friday aft & wanting gear ready & waiting so I can take it out this weekend!).

Also - to sense-check myself, do others think this was a bit sneaky of the sales guy?

[owl]

Good luck with that...

https://www.jsaccessories.co.uk/pages/online-store/in-store-terms-and-conditions.htm

[Old Git Racing]

You dont see many racers wearing FT leathers/clothing. You do see them wearing alpinestars dainese though. If you fall off a bike the road doesn't distinguish between racer or road riders. Personally I wouldn't touch FT with a barge pole if your serious about protection.
Get the best you can afford, and yes the salesman probably has a motive, they all do.

OGR.
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2022 Tiger Sport 660 2019 Street Twin 2003 K3 gixxer 1000 1998 Srad 600 track hack

[MikeM696]

Thanks for the reply!

Yer I saw that :S But am thinking if I want to go back & exchange for something more expensive, they may agree to an exchange with payment on the difference.

Hope so, as would hate to have to start arguing with them, life's too short (but protective gear too important to be tricked imo!).

[notabikeranym...]

Sorry to completely go on a tangent here on your thread but J&S is fucking shit. Full of dickheads in the two I've visited.

One of them had no sense of customer care whatsoever, and the salespeople are actual shitheads at the other shop.

How can he tell me an AGV is less aerodynamic than a Shoei and that I shouldn't even buy an AGV because they suck (cause they didn't have the one I wanted) and that the Shoei is much better and I should go for a Shoei.

My ex worked at one of the J&Ss, they'll always try and sell you a Shoei as they get commission for selling Shoeis. They don't actually give a single shit what you do as long as you spend money.

Shitty pushy salespeople with no interest in what you actually want vs what they'd rather upsell to you, and the lack of customer service is atrocious.

Places like Bikestop in Stevenage however are a million times better and I'd rather spend all my money there in future.

[MikeM696]

No worries, not that much of a tangent tbh! (who doesn't like tangents anyway - straight lines are boring, right?)

I hear you - First experience of J&S and apart from going back to try to get an exchange (depending on what folks think of Frank Thomas gear but I'm leaning towards an exchange!), it'll be the last visit.

[talkToTheHat]

Store policy does not overrule your statutory rights. J&S are double-dickish about their own brand kit becasue they can't get the money back from the distributor if it fails. I've butted heads with them over faulty goods when they say "distribtor says it's not a warranty issue" for somehting that was celarly their problem under the sale of goods act

The line you need is "Does not meet expectations of quality"

Old FT textiles, I've got some good ones with titanium kneecap sliders (not knee-side racing sliders, like the shoulder things in jackets) and they're great apart from the fit.

New kit? they're still selling "memory foam back protectors" that don't meet any standard. It's cheap tat missold. BKS are also a J&S brand IIRC and some of their cheap kit is awful. Their high-end CE cat2 gloves appear to have been dropped though, probalby becasue theyre as pricey as the big brands and undermiend by the cheap tat.

I wouldn't touch frank thomas kit that isnt fully CE.
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Bandit. does. everything.

[ljw]

100% shoddy, should have told you it was an own brand.

One alternative anecdote though: I bought a budget helmet from the Plymouth J&S not long ago and had the total opposite experience --- got steered away from a Frank Thomas lid towards a Lazer one instead. Chappy in there was pretty helpful.

[linuxyeti]

[1198]

[biker7]

I bought a FT xti two piece leather race suit just after they went bust a few years back. Excellent quality and wore many many times. Unfortunately Iike many of us mine has got too small now! Always bargain stuff around - as much as there are dodgy sales staff there are those of us willing to be convinced to save a few quid! You can usually get your money back if you get pushy but don't put too much faith in other people's opinions. You probably thought the gear was good quality/value when you bought it so it probably is. The sales guy is paid peanuts - don't expect too much. FT stuff was good in its day. Some of the dearer more pc modern gear is not so good quality. If you want a popular brand, you may have to pay quite a bit more. You may still have got a bargain with the FT. Best wishes whatever you choose to do!
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Swansea area
Fat Bob (2019)

[talkToTheHat]

Didn't falling quality of their own brand kit and their in house brands completely destroy Hein Gerike? I assume J&S are collecting brands so they can drop them when they get toxic?

Hats off to RST for being very forthcoming about the CE complinace of their kit. I'm finding their textiles last well, but haven't yet crash tested them.
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Bandit. does. everything.

[owl]

[doggone]

I wouldn't buy new without trying them, I've tried FT jackets which fit well... except the upper arms seemed way too tight even with just T shirt under.
If you don't mind a bit of a lottery there is a lot of choice lightly used on ebay, as noted above they tend to shrink round bellies and shoulders exacerbated by being a reasonably close-fitting item to start with.

[1198]

[1198]

Just seen the post by Owl. Seems they have somehow split the business?

[ocatoro]

[ocatoro]

didn't realise frank thomas had a bad reputation to be honest.

I've had a couple of their textile jackets, and they were decent quality. materials easily as nice as my alpinestars jacket, and fit was better.
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[AshWebster]

What happened to men being men? i go into a shop (if i have to) knowing exactly what i want and i try it on, buy it and then leave. I dont listen to sales patter or get sidetracked to buy anything other than what i have researched.

Have some self confidence!

My 2ps worth all i can say is Alpinestars leathers fit well, are used by lots of racers and they look good. As with most things you pay for what you get.
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[kramdra]

FT is in my experience, better quality than Dianese.

FT went bankrupt before J&S bought the old stock. I do not know if they have since produced new stock with the same branding. Either way, bankrupt stock is cheap, so it could be a very high markup.

[Evil Hans]

I was looking at helmets in J&S (just trying some on) ... sales guy slithered over and try to flog me one (can't remember the brand)

"How much is it?"

"350"

"Out of my budget, sorry"

"Well, these other ones are on special offer"

"How much?"

"399"

"OK. You do realise that 399 is *more* than 350, don't you?"

<BLANK LOOK>
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[The Shaggy D.A.]

Do they actually still make FT gear? I thought they were just selling off old 2011 buyout stock.
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[Kentol750]

BKS leathers became very popular around 15 or so years ago and stepped into the 'off the peg' market. Frank Thomas factories were making the kit for them. All the big stores stocked them. BKS bespoke business carried on. FT went under, j and s bought name and got BKS too. Kit was never terrible, but quality control seemed lacking.
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Some bikes.

[Ste]

Try loads of different stuff on at J&S. Frank Thomas, Dainese, Alpinestars, RST and whatever else they happen to have.

Then go home and use the internet to buy whichever leathers you found that fit you best.

Since you'll have bought the ones which fit you the best, the 365 day return windows with sportsbikeshop will be unnecessary.

[recman]

I tried a shed load of leathers on in J&S about 5 years ago.
Frank Thomas were the only brand I felt comfortable in tbh.
They don't get a great deal of use so they're still in excellent condition, the jacket in particular still feels very well built.
Also, I just bought a lid from J&S. I went in with the intention of trying lots on to see what fitted, which I did, and the help I got was pretty decent.
I wasn't steered in any particular direction, the bloke just brought me every type of lid I asked for in the size required.
He was pretty clued up though, he didn't degrade the cheaper brands, he didn't have to tbh, none of them felt comfortable.