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dt125 for green laning / light trail crap?

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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 11:40 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: dt125 for green laning / light trail crap? Reply with quote

Would a dt125 ypvs work on green lanes, shod w/ some Michelin AC10s or similar? I do like my klx250 - but let's be honest, it's designed for your mother-in-law really. Bland as owt, as linear as it is gutless, and actually pretty fucking lardy when you try and turf it out of a deep sludge rut by hand. Best thing about it is it's not a crf250l.

I miss me crm. Crying or Very sad I could use some of that peaky shit now I'm a little bit better at riding off road. But it's gone and there aren't many around to buy any more.

So what about a little old dt125? Wouldn't they be a bit of a laugh?? Reckon I might be too big and heavy though - that's the only thing. 5' 11" and north of 14 stone if I'm brutally honest. I do fancy a raggable little trailie though - 2t all-or-nothing silliness. Anyone ever taken one off road properly? Like, as an adult. With excess timber. And not much talent.
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thx1138
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PostPosted: 13:22 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Re: dt125 for green laning / light trail crap? Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:
n green lanes, shod w/ some Michelin AC10s or similar?

Anyone ever taken one off road properly? Like, as an adult. With excess timber. And not much talent.


AC 10s are being dropped, soon, and replaced with the "Tracker",early next year I think.

https://i.postimg.cc/CK2WT9nP/tracker1.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/Ls5rWm5g/tracker2.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/52nhpX4M/tracker3.jpg

My very first off roading was done on a DT125, I was technically an adult, but a very light one, and 19 years old. Mind you, we also hooned across the south downs on it 2up. Thumbs Up

Also the very, very first time I rode one, i was that guy that drops the clutch and wheelies the bike and falls off the back Laughing
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 14:04 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm - I've only ever known AC10s. Actually, that might not be true - I remember once, Mr. Rafferty fitted something that looked remarkably like AC10s but they had this weird thin connecting piece between the central blocks. It looked like its purpose was to prevent sideways slippage when negotiating a really mad camber, or - similarly - going across rather than up or down a steep incline. And, in this quarry where we used to ride, it seemed to work like that. Could've been a placebo effect though. It's always hard to tell with these things unless your graham jarvis or whoever.

Anyway, my current knobblies are looking much the worse for wear. But, because I'm not as shit as I used to be, I've yet to feel the need to change them. It's not like I'm dabbing all the time, even in the recent mud. So I might be being blasé but I think those new tyres look fine and it'll be interesting to try 'em. Or do you think we should all be stocking up on any remaining ac10s and stashing them in the cupboard under the stairs??
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 14:06 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

also - in b4 anything orange or drz400e
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 14:36 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Remember you can off road anything, and when DT125R's were new they were much more serious motocross inspired and based upon machines. There were no orange bikes about really then to make everything else look poor.

When the DT was new it would have been tested pretty hard, as people buying them wanted to think they were getting a YZ replica for the road etc. It'll be fine at green lanes, quarrys, pay and play sites or for beginners Enduro use. I wouldn't want to start leaping one off table top jumps flat out on a motocross track, as bits will eventually fall off or break.

I can't see why a DT wouldn't be as good as any other small trail bike off road, it's the tyres you fit that make alot of stuff possible or not. Its light circa 100kg easy to start and pick up, and also has masses of cheap spares available for them too.

There's always things you could improve for proper regular off roading, and as you said it'll be a bit peaky, so a good back tyre is essential help find traction.

I'd also want a proper metal bash plate, an exhaust guard, and suff like hand guards, and a flexible tail light and number plate mounting etc, to minimise damage when you drop it. I'd say that having a full working YPVS valve would be very useful as would maybe re-built suspension with a better rear shock.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 16:10 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay - so I'm thinking 1.5-2k could get me something usable that I wouldn't lose much on. Hand-guards, sump plate, exhaust armour plus tyres (oh and yeah, probably a shock). I remember riding w/ a guy on a iirc a husaberg 125 or more likely a husky, and we were both having a right laugh. That thing was revving like a chainsaw. It was great. I think I want some o' that.

So I suppose I'm best just going for whatever is the most recent example of the DT I can find, or is it a case of them being best early '90s, mid '90s, or when? Anyone got any strong views either way? To the eye, the mid/late '90s and onwards bikes look to have the best geometry, clearance and swing arm etc. But I really need to do some digging and try and suss out which actually ride the best.

edit - one other thing; I'm just naturally assuming mono-shock wins out, and to regard twin sprung stuff as too old, and/or - to be half way decent - likely to be over-restored and thus over-priced (?).
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 17:04 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you don't already have the bike or know of one for sale, I'd not limit yourself to any make or model other than whats local, fairly well known and popular, and in the best condition.

There's nothing much wrong with green laning on an old air cooled, twin shock, drum braked bike. But they have poor brakes on the road (comfy seat though) and are going to be hard work and more effort off road than a tall, light, mono shocked water cooled machine 2decades newer.

Specifically at DT125R's I'd look at anything from 1989-2005 when they stopped making the RE last version. They didn't change very much in 15years. But an early 90's model in one of the classic or more sought after colour schemes is probably going to be pricey in good condition, as they are the ones the oldies like me want to take them back to being 17.

I think the 2000> models are a better bet, as im sure they had the YPVS servo fitted, and they just need de-restricting and it enabling. (Not likely will you find a bike that hasn't already been de-restricted though).

Some need an aftermarket pipe, as theres several restrictions built into the exhaust that mean it's got to be cut open and re-welded after.

I forgot to mention gearing too, as a 125 that's going to be used off road most of the time, doesn't need an 80mph top end, and by lowering the gearing by a tooth on the front sprocket or so you'll make the gears more useful off road, especially on tight hilly or technical terrain.

There's a place in Essex somewhere that is always importing decent used DT125's and other trail bikes from France often in much better condition than a same age UK bike. So if you were anywhere local and looking for something in the £1500-2000 range that might just need a bit of fettling and tidying it might be worth a look.

Most such bikes on eBay are often battered and bodged to fuck by teenage twats that don't want to look after anything. Or they've been stolen once or more, and if not have probably been abused to death on motocross tracks etc. The imports are a route I'd definitely look into, as the French don't seem to ruin their bikes as much and they are often less rotten.

Also the nerdy old restorers don't tend to go for non UK bikes, as they only want original matching numbers UK machines, despite the bikes being almost identical in every way.
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thx1138
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PostPosted: 17:54 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:

There's nothing much wrong with green laning on an old air cooled, twin shock, drum braked bike. .


TRF member wobbling about on a 1959 AJS

https://vimeo.com/252147643
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 18:34 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
There's a place in Essex somewhere that is always importing decent used DT125's and other trail bikes from France often in much better condition than a same age UK bike. So if you were anywhere local and looking for something in the £1500-2000 range that might just need a bit of fettling and tidying it might be worth a look.


Yes I was looking at some of their listings this morning. They have a couple that appear good and sound. I have to say I'm a bit put off by the prospect of dealing with the DVL fucking A though.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 19:39 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo - what's the craic with the suspension on this old kdx200 -

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Kawasaki-KDX200/123467417818?hash=item1cbf3b48da:g:XOkAAOSwapdb3c0l:rk:3:pf:0

I can't see any of that Uni Trak linkage there or a dog bone or owt. Second question - what's the 200 like against the 125? I like the idea of a simpler air-cooled engine tbh so this 200 is good from that pov. A lighter 125 might be a better laugh though.
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TbirdX
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PostPosted: 20:44 - 10 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

DT125 perfectly acceptable for light..and even some heavy, laning.

I had the RE (electric start) version and did two years of laning and 2 Taffy Dakars on it no problems at all.

The suspension can be crude, the brakes poor and the power (all 15-20 horses) of it narrow and peaky, but boy is it fun.

I miss it. A lot.

Don't be tempted, I'm sure you wouldn't be, to try to mod it to an inch of it's life because you'll kill it with a painful death.

Stick a complete DEP on it, do the speedo mod and call it a day.

Enjoy the 4 stoke boys telling you how much they love the smell Wink
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thx1138
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PostPosted: 01:46 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is this of any interest/help? Model 1 DT175MX trail test magazine article, I retrieved it from TRF Facebook group file earlier

I know it's a bigger engine etc, but.


https://1drv.ms/b/s!ApBvzpPhBRnBgeAsJIdORKtLmxPZxg
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 08:21 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd love one - think they're a bit small is my only caveat. I always have to smile at those tiny drum brakes fitted to '70s and early '80s trail bikes. Smile
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garth
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PostPosted: 11:33 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

2k seems a lot of money for an old DT, you could have my 450 for that and it's only done 600 miles Laughing
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Suntan Sid
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PostPosted: 11:37 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:
I'd love one - think they're a bit small is my only caveat. I always have to smile at those tiny drum brakes fitted to '70s and early '80s trail bikes. Smile


They're nothing to worry about!
Being the owner of an early 80's trail bike, as long as you have set up and adjusted them correctly they're great, I can lock up the front and rear, on tarmac, no problem at all.

On a small, road based trail bike, once you've got the motor running properly, I'd be spending all my time fine tuning the suspension, setting the sag, preloads etc.
IME, you should experiment with different weights of fork oil. If you're planning on doing a lot of off road you could go a lot lighter on fork oil, the manual will recommend a certain weight but that will be based on a compromise between on an off road.
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 11:42 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got a ttr250 for sale, pm for more details!
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G
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PostPosted: 13:11 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Re: dt125 for green laning / light trail crap? Reply with quote

Sounds like you want...
A KTM200EXC.

I used a CRM125 for green lanes a bit. I always found it lacking.
It could 'keep up', but I don't want to be really trying to keep the speed up on green lanes when there might be a horse around the next corner.
Okay, the CRM125 engine's a lot revvier than the DT125 (taken from the NSR road bike and still feels like a road engine), but still I'd prefer a bit more.

The KTM250EXC and 300 are much easier to ride than the 200, but seems you don't entirely want that.
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yen_powell
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PostPosted: 13:31 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:
I'd love one - think they're a bit small is my only caveat. I always have to smile at those tiny drum brakes fitted to '70s and early '80s trail bikes. Smile
I had an XL250 as my first green laner. It had monoshock suspension but was still the model before disc brakes arrived. I found the drums okayish on the road and usually fine off it, I moved the front brake lever up the bar a bit to give me more leverage.

The only down side to drum brakes is evidenced by those signs you see by fords telling you to test your brakes. If you go through deep water they do sod all until they dry out. I actually learnt this in my old VW Beetle after driving through a flooded road and failing to stop at the T junction straight afterwards. Luckily nothing was coming along the main road!!

I used to drag the front brakeon the XL a little after going through deep water until it functioned properly again.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 13:42 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kentol750 wrote:
Got a ttr250 for sale, pm for more details!


Not being funny but have you actually read my first post - where I said I already run a 4t 250 single?
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G
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PostPosted: 13:46 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:


Not being funny but have you actually read my first post - where I said I already run a 4t 250 single?

I was going to mention this - but you did mention the weight too and the TTR is more in line with the DT125.

Saying that - I was fine with a DR600 (and KTM690 etc) for greenlaning - that weight on an enduro does make it a bit harder work however.
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garth
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PostPosted: 14:43 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

+1 on a 200exc, I however (possibly due to a lack of competence) found it a bit lairy for green laning, it was awesome when on the pipe and I'd imagine a hoot on an enduro, but I wouldn't choose one for laning.

Haven't been overly impressed with any 4T 250 that I've ridden, but a 450 is a different animal entirely, if you can live with the servicing.

Still absolute shite on the road though.

I think in an ideal world you'd have one of each.
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G
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PostPosted: 15:04 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea, I'd normally recommend a 250 or 300, which have really nice linear throttle responses.

Even the 125 generally isn't as bad - the 200 is a 125 with a sudden kick around mid revs.

On that actually - maybe a KTM125 would be a slightly better compromise for less of the 'wheelying you into vegetation when tired' effect Smile. (Which did happen to me during an enduro on the 200 - hit powerband mid corner near the end of an enduro, threw me back, which pulled the throttle on even more; bike left corner due to loss of steering.)
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 15:25 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Re: dt125 for green laning / light trail crap? Reply with quote

G wrote:
Sounds like you want...
A KTM200EXC.

I used a CRM125 for green lanes a bit. I always found it lacking.
It could 'keep up', but I don't want to be really trying to keep the speed up on green lanes when there might be a horse around the next corner.
Okay, the CRM125 engine's a lot revvier than the DT125 (taken from the NSR road bike and still feels like a road engine), but still I'd prefer a bit more.

The KTM250EXC and 300 are much easier to ride than the 200, but seems you don't entirely want that.


Because I can't do much in the way maintenance I'm not keen to buy anything KTM.
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thx1138
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PostPosted: 16:19 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beta x trainer? 300cc 2t

If I can green lane one, anyone can.
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G
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PostPosted: 16:19 - 11 Nov 2018    Post subject: Re: dt125 for green laning / light trail crap? Reply with quote

I would expect a KTM ridden as you rode your CRM probably wouldn't be too different on maintenance.

And on that - do a year of enduros on a CRM and it's going to need more work.

This is for 2 strokes - 4 strokes have a good bit more generally. And any work they do need tends to be harder too.
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