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First big bike: dual sport on a budget?

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Just for the fun of it
NX650
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
XTZ660
18%
 18%  [ 2 ]
KLR650
27%
 27%  [ 3 ]
DR650
18%
 18%  [ 2 ]
Other
36%
 36%  [ 4 ]
Total Votes : 11

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mackula
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PostPosted: 00:20 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: First big bike: dual sport on a budget? Reply with quote

I finally got my full licence and I've been looking at old dual sports. My budget is pretty modest at £1500 but I could possibly stretch it to 2k for the right bike.

So far I've come up with these options:

Honda NX650 Dominator
Yamaha XTZ660 Tenere (first gen model from the 90s)
Kawasaki KLR650
Suzuki DR650

The KLR and DR still sell outside Europe which would make them good choices when it comes to parts availability and the like, but it seems that all four bikes are equally obscure in Britain.

At a glance these bikes all look pretty similar to me with similar HP and weights, however it seems that the Honda and Yamaha can be had for quite a bit less - generally for around £1500 on ebay while the KLR650 and DR650 go for around £2000. Would there be any reason to pay the popularity tax for the latter two bikes or should I be deciding between the Honda and Yamaha? My instructor said that the Tenere was actually a significantly better bike than the KLR and DR but it never got the recognition it deserves because it was never sold in America.

Are there any other bikes I should look into besides those four?

Thanks!
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grr666
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PostPosted: 00:32 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Old school Africa Twin?
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 00:47 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Ha! Reply with quote

You'll be lucky to find one in your budget that runs. It's a sellers market. They're all fetching silly money now.. go with grr666 and find the lowest mileage aftwin you can afford.
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Last edited by Kentol750 on 00:50 - 27 Jan 2019; edited 1 time in total
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 00:48 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

grr666 wrote:
Old school Africa Twin?


That works and is under 2K?
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garth
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PostPosted: 00:49 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just sold my fully sorted xt600e for £1600, complete with rack, panniers, acerbis tank, dynojetted etc etc 25k on the clock.

I rode it 13k in 3.5 months and it didn't miss a beat.

It's pokier than a klr, but less refined.

If I was you I'd be looking at a CCM 644, dr650 engine with less weight and better suspension, and cheaper.
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 00:54 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Garth, you didn't tell us!
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 00:55 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Consider a KLE 500? Mine was a hoot, and the guy I gave it too is also having a hoot on it. There again, it has a GPZ motor in it so perhaps I have an unrealistic impression about what they are like.

Of the ones you listed, I'd have the XTZ... Actually, I had a MZ baghira which was an XTZ motor in a much tricker chassis. They also did a slightly lower motard version called a mastiff. You still see an odd one for sale.

The dominator would be my last choice. They missed a trick there. They are slow, heavy and boring although tough.

TDM?

Why a dual sports? Remember, these are pretty much effectively road bikes, especially if you put tyres suitable for road use on them. Ok for an odd dirt track here and there, they'd be great if we had a lot of unmetalled roads like they do in Australia, but we don't.

There are much comfier, faster, more capable bikes for riding round the UK on. This is from someone who has owned two "dual sports" bikes. They are pretty impractical really, there's an odd road where they might excell but they are a sod to luggage up, tyre choice is limited and they generally have a poor tank range and are underbraked.

My old GPZ500 outperformed both the KLE and the baghira in every measurable way and you could get two of those for your budget.

I'm not saying don't buy one if you want one, I'm just asking you to question your motivation. What do you think it's going to give you that a more road biased bike wont?

Pushing your budget and shop around and you could potentially get a "cartoon" Triumph tiger. A much more substantial and practical motorcycle with dual sports styling.

I just bought a super low mileage CBR600 for the wife for the sort of money you're looking at spending.
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 01:08 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stinkwheel, where are the bikes you propose...? I scoured eBay over the last 6 weeks for something similar that didnt need major work. Nothing under 2.5k
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garth
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PostPosted: 01:14 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

TDM850s burn oil like nothing else.

Cartoon tigers weigh more than the moon.

I've also had a baghira, but mine landed me in hospital twice so I wasn't overly keen on it.

SLR650 if you're really skint.

I've had a gen 2 versys for under your budget. That was alright.

Echoing above, they're all (the big singles) crap on the road really. You're only going to be comfy sitting at 65mph.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 01:16 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

mentalboy wrote:
grr666 wrote:
Old school Africa Twin?


That works and is under 2K?

To be fair, I don't really look at used bikes much but I remember them from the late 80's early 90's and how
well they were spoken of. One of my mates in London still rides one. I didn't think there would be a glut of them,
but OP only needs to find one. Personally I'd look at my 2k twice before spaffing it on a 20yo bike but that's just me.
My mechanical prowess stops at getting my credit card out to pay a mechanic so I wouldn't buy a doer upper myself,
I'd sooner buy nearly new or brand new and get rid again before the big bills start coming.
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garth
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PostPosted: 01:16 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or a transalp?
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grr666
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PostPosted: 01:24 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

garth wrote:
Or a transalp?

Yesssssss. That's the one I had forgotten. I remembered the bright red Dominator also of the time but knew there
was also a similarly styled bike that IIRC came in a red white and blue colour scheme that wasn't the Africa Twin.
Transalp. That's been doing my head in for about 40 mins
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Last edited by grr666 on 01:54 - 27 Jan 2019; edited 1 time in total
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 01:41 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Transalp is a lardy bastard though. And pricey. Check out how many times I've professed my love for the big single trailies...gave up and bought an husky 701 enduro...again..... As grr666 says unless your prepared to mekanik a lot..its a pricey field.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 01:46 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kentol750 wrote:
Stinkwheel, where are the bikes you propose...? I scoured eBay over the last 6 weeks for something similar that didnt need major work. Nothing under 2.5k


I just got a 2000 CBR600F4 (carb motor, alloy frame) with 7k miles on for £1550 off ebay. I snapped it up the day it went on, the ad was only up for 6 hours. The guy had already had three other people call up but they all tried to knock him down on price. I said I'd take it and paid the deposit by paypal while he was still on the phone. That ad then disappeared. Fastest finger first.

Quick look on ebay.

There are two tiger 955is on ebay now for under £2k.

There is a hugely overpriced MZ mastiff.

Half a dozen TDM850s for under £1500.

Just got to keep your eyes open.

Cheapest bikes these days are on local facebook groups though.
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I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 03:10 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

But, nothing in the sphere of what op was looking for. Cbr600f you got is beyond a2 restriction rules and less desirable than other 600s. Mileage and price suggest you got a bargain though!
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mackula
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PostPosted: 03:38 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
Consider a KLE 500? Mine was a hoot, and the guy I gave it too is also having a hoot on it. There again, it has a GPZ motor in it so perhaps I have an unrealistic impression about what they are like.

Of the ones you listed, I'd have the XTZ... Actually, I had a MZ baghira which was an XTZ motor in a much tricker chassis. They also did a slightly lower motard version called a mastiff. You still see an odd one for sale.

The dominator would be my last choice. They missed a trick there. They are slow, heavy and boring although tough.

TDM?

Why a dual sports? Remember, these are pretty much effectively road bikes, especially if you put tyres suitable for road use on them. Ok for an odd dirt track here and there, they'd be great if we had a lot of unmetalled roads like they do in Australia, but we don't.

There are much comfier, faster, more capable bikes for riding round the UK on. This is from someone who has owned two "dual sports" bikes. They are pretty impractical really, there's an odd road where they might excell but they are a sod to luggage up, tyre choice is limited and they generally have a poor tank range and are underbraked.

My old GPZ500 outperformed both the KLE and the baghira in every measurable way and you could get two of those for your budget.

I'm not saying don't buy one if you want one, I'm just asking you to question your motivation. What do you think it's going to give you that a more road biased bike wont?

Pushing your budget and shop around and you could potentially get a "cartoon" Triumph tiger. A much more substantial and practical motorcycle with dual sports styling.

I just bought a super low mileage CBR600 for the wife for the sort of money you're looking at spending.


It's definitely more of a buyer's market when it comes to street bikes, in fact I was looking at GPZ500s and CBR600Fs along with old SV650s before I decided I wanted a dual sport.
I guess in my mind's eye I'm seeing myself doing weekend greenlaning trips on a dual sport and going a bit off the beaten path. Realistically I'm not sure how often I'll actually do that sort of thing, but I'll always be thinking "what if" if I go for a pure street bike.

The KLE500 and Transalp look decent enough...guess I'll add them to the list. Africa Twins are a no-go based on the £2500+ prices I'm seeing on ebay.
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Kentol750
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PostPosted: 04:13 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Waiting for new mt07tenere to land....then we shall see.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 09:28 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kentol750 wrote:
Waiting for new mt07tenere to land....then we shall see.
Is there an MT09 derived version planned as well? That would be a lot of mental crazy funtimes as
long as they didn't skimp on suspension components. (again)
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Sister Sledge
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PostPosted: 10:18 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I sometimes thing this question myself. If I was pushed I'd perhaps go DR650 - as you say they're still common in other countries. Mind you, if you import a new engine for whatever you buy then you'll pay heaps of taxes..

I like the old air cooled simplicity but there's that word - old. Whatever you choose could well end up costing you a rebuild in the end. The engines appear basic on the outside but they're like a clock on the inside.

Try scouring a forum? Have you considered a CCM machine? Trick suspension and often with dual sport availability.
Ask on this forum what's for sale:

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/ccm_mad/index.php

There's thumpertalk too.

My own bike is a supermoto and I don't have offroad wheels - that's my project for the end of 2019.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 13:04 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kentol750 wrote:
But, nothing in the sphere of what op was looking for. Cbr600f you got is beyond a2 restriction rules and less desirable than other 600s. Mileage and price suggest you got a bargain though!


I recounted the story because you have to be on the ball to get a bargain. As I say the advert was only up on ebay for a few hours. Classified ads on Ebay are the ones that haven't yet been sold. If they've been on there a while, they probably weren't the bargain of the century, something that's a very good price will be snapped up immediately.
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I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 17:21 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:

Quick look on ebay.

There are two tiger 955is on ebay now for under £2k.

There is a hugely overpriced MZ mastiff.

Half a dozen TDM850s for under £1500.

Just got to keep your eyes open.

Cheapest bikes these days are on local facebook groups though.


I loved mine. One of the comfiest bike I have owned.

Dirt track is the absolute most off road it can handle though, porky bike.
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struan80
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PostPosted: 20:55 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can I throw a F650GS in there, got my 2004 in good condition, 35k miles for £1600, not a bad bike in my imaginary head anyway.
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thx1138
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PostPosted: 21:32 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

DR650 because I like DR's
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 22:02 - 27 Jan 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

My take on it is that for road use the only bit of a dual sport (daft name for a trailie) I'd want is the high wide bars, tall seat and slim profile. Therefore I'd want the most road biased bikes possible whether that was a single or a twin.

Stuff like XT660X's, KLE500's or the Versys sound better road bikes than a halfway house to a bike that's not great on the road or the dirt.

If you wanted to go on the dirt regularly then for example in the Honda range you want to replace any bikes with XL in the name with XR or a Yamaha TTR instead of an XT etc. Sure the big enduro biased bikes arnt great road bikes, (small fuel tanks, plank seats, and plenty of high speed vibes etc) but you want the lightest most pared down bike with decent suspension and minimal equipment for off road use.

Two bikes as Stinkwheel said may be better than one? GPZ500 and an XR400 for example?
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