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tara1234 |
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tara1234 Borekit Bruiser
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jaffa90 |
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jaffa90 World Chat Champion
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bladerunner |
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bladerunner World Chat Champion
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Ste |
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Ste Not Work Safe
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Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike tl;dr
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Posted: 08:11 - 02 Feb 2019 Post subject: |
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tara1234 wrote: | Iv looked online and it appears that a daylight MOT isn't actually a thing |
Ste wrote: | A day time only MOT is just like any other MOT apart from it says "no lights fitted at time of test" as an advisory. |
It's a 'thing', but the term is a bit of legacy. I actually still have a MOT cert, from, 1984, in the folder of docs that belong to my Montesa Cota trials bike, that was marked 'Day-Light-Use-Only', but as Ste says, now, they are merely endorsed 'Lights not fitted at time of test'.
tara1234 wrote: | Is daylight MOT only for dirt bikes? |
No. is the short answer. Under modern C&U regs, a road bike has to meet the requirements of a road bike, to be used on the road. That means it must have lights.
Back to my old Cota trials bike. Registered in 1981, it was supplied 'as standard' without any lighting equipment.. at least fitted. Like the 'Day-Light-Use-Only' MOT cert, somehwere I actually have the OE lighting kit that came with it in a card-board box. As a competition machine, most owners would never use one on the road and for competition, the first thing they would do is take the lights off any-way. It was supplied, with lights, in a cardboard box, as an 'accessory', that could be fitted if the owner wanted, which they may have, for some competition, like classic long-trial or enduro events or 'night trials'.
Supplied, but registered for the road, without lights, they exploited even older legacy legislation, where motorcycles didn't have to have lights. Many machines of the 1920's and 30's, were sold without lights, like a push-bike. Either because the electric lights of the era were rather dim and unreliable, or that acetalene lamps were rather dim and impractical, and in either case, if they weren't needed, it saved money and they could drop the sticker price.
As asside, "Lucas - Prince of Darkness!" the 'joke' actually comes from parady of a 1930's advert for Lucas electric lights, known as 'The Lady of the Lamp"
https://www.alanwiseman.co.uk/General/images/Ladylamp.jpg
By the 1960's, when the MOT was 'invented', many, particularly Brit-Bikes, were still sold without lights 'as standard', to keep the brochure price down, and where they were a pseudo standard fit, they were often sold as a bolt-on optional extra, which was actually one of the sales features of the Japanese machines when they started to come along, that things like lights and indicators were 'standard equipment'... but MOT regs remained, that they weren't 'needed'.
So whilst many 'dirt bikes' like my old Cota exploited the legacy legislation to sell without lights, it applied to any, and many vintage and classic machines also exploited the 'Daylight Use Only' marked MOT.
NOW! As said, if supplied as a road-vehicle, its supposed to have the equipment demanded by the Construction & Use regs for a road vehicle. And even competition trials bikes, for probably the last 20 years, have come as 'standard' with lights fitted.
Where the 'legacy' has been perpetuated, is under some rather convoluted rules for 'Machines adapted or modified predominantly for off-road use'... in which there is a lot of grey area and room for interpretation. Starting with what might be deemed 'off-road use', which is NOT limited merely to riding dirt. Road-Racing is off-road, stunting, is normally 'off-road', so you can modify and adapt a bike to suit a lot of disciplines that can be deemed off-road, but aren't for dirt.
And leaves the question quite open, in so far as what you might have to do to wangle your bike, through an MOT with non-working lamps.... merely taping over the lenses PROBABLY isn't sufficient.... ISTR that there is also a caveot that exemption is only eligible to 'solo' machines, so you would have to remove pilion seat and pegs and grab-rail, entirely, before you could even start, and the old MOT Man's default of "If fitted, must work" remains, and if there's a switch, should do something, and merely taping up the lamps might not be enough, merely taping over the lable or even the switch itself may not be enough, if it is there, got to work.
And I assume, we are STILL talking about your NSR......
Which has many other problems you have alluded to in other posts, above and beyond whether it will pass an MOT 'cos of lights!
And from where I am sitting, this is yet MORE optimism bordering on delusion, pure 'hope' trying to find a way to get around doing what you really need to... which is tear the frigging thing down to the frame, and properly restoreit! ITS FCUKered!
Its a resto base! It is a heap of scrap in waiting, and you are merely prolonging the agony, even trying to find yet more work arounds than bite that frigging bullet and FIX IT, properly... or scrap it! Its not a viable every day road vehicle!
And you are probably riding it, now, without a licence or insurance to, 'cos you suggest that its a full-power non-learner legal variant... and having 'obtained insurance by deception', implying its a UK-Spec Learner-Restricted model you could slap L-Plates on.... you would only be digging that hole even deeper, offering plod even more reason to tug you and uncover full rap sheet, trying to blag it throng test as a 'Modified vehicle'.... and first thing plod will do, after asking "DO you know why I have stopped you?" (because the brake light didn't come on when you slowed down!) is ask, "So these mods.... declared to the insurance are they?"... and start adding even more crimes to that rap-sheet, as you keep talking!
GO FIX the Ruddy thing.... or scrap it! Its doing nowt for you but prolong the agony whilst you DONT have a decent bike to use, and dont get the licence you really want to have anything more than a 15bhp 125..... and just takes you around the garden path, in this delusion that there 'has' to be something you can do, and NOT bite a bullet anywhere..... you know, it is an awful lot easier in the long run to bite one of them bullets, and after you have, you will wonder why you ever spent so much time or energy trying to dodge it!
GO FIX YOUR BIKE!!!! ____________________ My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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Sister Sledge |
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Sister Sledge World Chat Champion
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Robby Dirty Old Man
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Kawasaki Jimbo |
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Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike tl;dr
Joined: 01 Jun 2010 Karma :
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Posted: 13:00 - 02 Feb 2019 Post subject: |
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Sister Sledge wrote: | That's really interesting Tef. |
Lol. There was a rather hilarious one on one of those Police-Camera-Action progs, some while back.
Coppa had pulled a gixer-boy, for riding a bike with luminouse pink head-lamp cover, amongst, I presume, the usual loud-pipe and little plate tug-magnets.... The 'Drama' was in the rider being a bit smart-arse with the coppa over his interpretation of legal tyre tread-depth, and trying to apply the 1.6mm minumimum for a car, not the 1mm min for a bike, or 'visible' (as you mention!) for a moped.
Obviously a common occurrence..... the lad pulled his docs out of his pocket, and showed the coppa it had a 'tested without lamps fitted' MOT, and a copy of the MOT mans manual with regard the tread depth and legal spacing of a number-plate, ete etc etc.....
Coppa made him wait at the side of the road, and called out an 'expert' I 'think' a VOSA tester, who went over the bike in fine detail, looked at the docs, then eventually agreed with the lad, that he was 'just' within the law.... Coppa then came back over and said, "Hmmm its a bit dark now.... how you getting home?"
And sat there, in the car, waiting till he tried to ride it away! ____________________ My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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tara1234 |
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tara1234 Borekit Bruiser
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Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike tl;dr
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Posted: 19:02 - 02 Feb 2019 Post subject: |
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tara1234 wrote: | and driving with no MOT is illigal, |
So is riding a bike you haven't got a licence for, or insurance for, or that's in an obviously un-road-worthy condition.... B-U-T.. its the lack of a receipt for an MOT test that bothers you?!?!?!?
Meanwhile, you have a bike, that you shouldn't be riding, that you admit 'really' needs a total tear-down, that you cant get to this 'mate' who you believe can sort all it's problems... you 'hope' without resorting to the total tear-down you don't want to tackle....
Like I said... sort it or scrap it.... and if you cant sort it, or get it to chap who can... what's left? Bullets need biting.... take your pick.
How much to hire a van? ____________________ My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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tara1234 |
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tara1234 Borekit Bruiser
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Posted: 19:45 - 02 Feb 2019 Post subject: |
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Its not about the mot paper its the ANPR it detects if you have Insurance, mot and tax. All online databases now.
It is driveable, I drove it from reading to london at night when I bought it, engine seams fine was hard to start in cold but apparantly thats normal with the NSR125.
In regards to restriction I was thinking of drilling holes into the throttle like in the video below. If I feel like I wanna be legal put the screw in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nk5rhFCQaCQ |
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P. Red Rocket
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Ste |
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Ste Not Work Safe
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Posted: 05:55 - 03 Feb 2019 Post subject: |
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The headlight on an old imported NSR is going to be dim.
Be careful that you're not trying to find a way around a problem that isn't actually a problem and if you made it from Reading to London at night then it can't be too bad.
Drilling holes and putting screws in the throttle might see you restrict it to less than 11kW (14.5bhp) but as you don't know how much power it's got at the moment, you don't know how much power you're needing to prevent the bike from using. |
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P. Red Rocket
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tara1234 |
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tara1234 Borekit Bruiser
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Posted: 17:17 - 03 Feb 2019 Post subject: |
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Ste wrote: | The headlight on an old imported NSR is going to be dim.
Be careful that you're not trying to find a way around a problem that isn't actually a problem and if you made it from Reading to London at night then it can't be too bad.
Drilling holes and putting screws in the throttle might see you restrict it to less than 11kW (14.5bhp) but as you don't know how much power it's got at the moment, you don't know how much power you're needing to prevent the bike from using. |
My idea was to put a screw in at 50% and then dyno it, and just assume that my unrestricted power is twice what the dyno reads at, if im still above 11 kw go down another 10% or so.
I went along the A4 which is all streetlamped.
Last edited by tara1234 on 18:25 - 03 Feb 2019; edited 1 time in total |
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Kawasaki Jimbo |
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Nobby the Bastard |
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Nobby the Bastard Harley Gaydar
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Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike tl;dr
Joined: 01 Jun 2010 Karma :
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Posted: 02:18 - 04 Feb 2019 Post subject: |
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tara1234 wrote: | My idea was | Where all the drama started! You know, unimaginative people, might usually have pretty dull lives, BUT.... they suffer less heart-attacks too!
tara1234 wrote: | to put a screw in at 50% and then dyno it, and just assume |
Assumption is the mother of all eff-ups....
So, over-active imagination, plus over reliance on assumption, and oooh... did we mention the delusional not long ago?
Dyno Testing.... you would need to go to a work-shop with a dyno. That will not likely be the back-street-bodge-it merchant. It will be one of the better appointed outfits, that will charge if not franchise Dealer work-shop-prices, probably not far off. In the order of £50 an hour.... or part there-of.
So, to get one run printed, will cost you £50 or so.
Go away, twiddle your screw, try again... another £50.....
And so it goes on.
The tests only cost £120... it wouldn't take MANY runs or much work-shop time before JUST biting the frigging bullet and taking the pigging tests, was cheaper, easier and offered Soooooo much more, than all this faff and fret, determined to try beat the system!!!
GO look at it all! You have a bike you cannot legally ride. That even if you could illegally ride it.... you couldn't, 'cos its kerbluggered!
YET, you seem utterly determined to find some blag, or some work-around to any and every issue, OTHER than doing the 'boring' of cracking out the credit-card, paying a school, doing a course and getting a licence......
Which would actually let you ride this bag-of-hassle, legally, with actual, legal valid insurance, 'cos you'd have the licence to ride it... IF you are absolutely determined that this bike is worth trying to work with, B-U-T, with a full-licence in your pocket, to let you 'legally' ride any bike you like... you probably wouldn't want to! even if it worked, and even if it worked reliably, and even if it was in sufficiently good fettle to deliver all its unrestricted power.... its STILL only a 24bhp motorcycle, about as fast and powerful as a thirty year old four-stroke single, commuter bike, like a Suzuki GN250, Yamaha SR250, or Honda CB250... and what you paid for this heap-of hassle, as it stands, was as much as you could have got something far 'more' like a 50bhp Kawasaki ER5 for, T&T's and road-worthy, and ready to go, that you WOULDN'T have to bludy-bump start, faff around with Dyno-Runs or restriction-washers, or worry that the insurance might get a tad arsey over being a grey-import, or or or or any of the other, utterly unnecessary issues you have with this heap-of...
All because of some rather incredible "Ideas" and a heck of a lot of assumptions.... like, that it will 'help' you get the feel for a heavier bike, cos its like two bags of sugar heavier than your SR.... like getting used to 'all' that extra power... cos... oh, yeah, well, even restricted to LL limits is an ENORMOUSE (lol) amount of extra grunt!
It is just bizarre!
'Sensible' says you are pizzing in the wind, on optimism and delusion with this thing, TRYING to find a way to get around being told you need to do a DAS course, and vilifying the chap that told you that, taking tests on your SR and failing them. So 'sensible' says get with the program.
Of all the problems you have... most you are making for yourself, trying to work around doing what you were told you needed, eons ago.
Cough up the cash, book a course, go do, do tests, get a licence.
Do that, and oh-sop much of this problem on top of hassle, layerd on bad ideas and bad assumption, would JUST become redundant....
This is chit you REALLY don't need to have. Its all of your own making, in the choices you have make, and are continuing to make, based not on good reason, but ideas and assumption!
STOP having ideas. Go get facts! Go get a frigging licence!
If you fix this bike, if you make it even notionally legal... It will NOT solve your little issue with round-abouts that saw you fail tests first time about.......
You are really NOT prioritising the problems that most need dealing with here! You are letting your imagination run away with you, into fantasy and delusion, that is bound to ONLY lead to more problems, NOT solutions to the ones you got.......
Bike the bullet.... you need to learn to ride safely, you need to be up to par to pass tests, WHAT do you need do to solve THAT?
Believe me, its not stick a fugging grub screw in an NSR's twist-grip!!! ____________________ My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 5 years, 80 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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