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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 00:08 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Thames water bankrupt Reply with quote

Thames Water says it can't pay back £190m loan

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67696645

Committee member Barry Gardiner said that amounted to Thames having the regulator "by the short and curlies" - suggesting that if Ofwat did not agree to the rise, it would essentially trigger a quasi-nationalisation that would cost the taxpayer billions.

Why? Why would it? The gov just take over, fuck off all shareholders and just start again. Just wipe all debts.

Or is that not a viable option.?
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 01:14 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

The reason the water network still needs 2.5 billion quid of investment is because they have only been spending just less than the bare minimum to ensure people have water in their homes.

As long as profits keep increasing, they don't give a shit about the service.

Same with any former publicly owned entity.
Rail, water, mail etc.

Tories will lose the next election.
The weird Starmer club will moonwalk into the room
Spend all the money buying back all the failing services and bring them back up to an acceptable standard.
Then just like last time, the country will be broke again and the tories will moonwalk back in.

Rinse and repeat.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 02:28 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Water is an absolutely daft thing to run privately. If the service is shit the customer has no option to take their business elsewhere.

I'm not sure water should be nationalised, something like shared ownership between local councils maybe Thinking
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 03:31 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

It'll still cost 2.5bill to get it up to standard.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 09:08 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regardless of the cost, they should be allowed to go bust, the shareholders should lose their money and the management should lose their jobs.

If they can't find a private buyer for the remaining business then the government should step in to do a deal with the liquidator to retain the assets (including the workforce), purchase the business for a peppercorn and the creditors can fight over their however many pennies in the pound those are worth. The gravy train just reached the end of the line.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 10:40 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
Regardless of the cost, they should be allowed to go bust, the shareholders should lose their money and the management should lose their jobs.

If they can't find a private buyer for the remaining business then the government should step in to do a deal with the liquidator to retain the assets (including the workforce), purchase the business for a peppercorn and the creditors can fight over their however many pennies in the pound those are worth. The gravy train just reached the end of the line.


"But that's so unfair!"

The value of investments and the income from them can go down as well as up Rolling Eyes
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WD Forte
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PostPosted: 15:29 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Investing is a type of gambling
why should tax payers bail out folk who've effectively lost money on the gee gees?
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rpsmith79
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PostPosted: 15:52 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

WD Forte wrote:
Investing is a type of gambling
why should tax payers bail out folk who've effectively lost money on the gee gees?


By that token, so are pension pots, as the money in everyones private/work pensions will be invested in compaines like this, that were once considered a "safe bet"

So if Thames were to go bust, it could affect a hell of a lot of peoples pensions pots, not just private investors
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Bloggsy
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PostPosted: 16:17 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

CaNsA wrote:
The reason the water network still needs 2.5 billion quid of investment is because they have only been spending just less than the bare minimum to ensure people have water in their homes.

As long as profits keep increasing, they don't give a shit about the service.

Same with any former publicly owned entity.
Rail, water, mail etc.

Tories will lose the next election.
The weird Starmer club will moonwalk into the room
Spend all the money buying back all the failing services and bring them back up to an acceptable standard.
Then just like last time, the country will be broke again and the tories will moonwalk back in.

Rinse and repeat.
How right you are
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Ste
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PostPosted: 17:01 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
The gravy train just reached the end of the line.

That's not gravy, it's billions of litres of sewage.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/nov/10/thames-water-pumped-sewage-into-thames

And here's a map which shows you in real time where Thames Water is dumping poo. https://www.thameswater.co.uk/edm-map

But it's okay because water companies only discharge poo into rivers or the sea in exceptional circumstances to prevent damage to property. Those exceptional circumstances occurred more than eight thousand times last year.

The real numbers will be quite a bit higher as many of the poo outlets don't have monitoring equipment.

https://www.thameswater.co.uk/media-library/home/about-us/performance/river-health/edm-annual-return-guide-2022.pdf
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MCN
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PostPosted: 17:35 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe claw back monies paid to thier greedibastirt zectutives and slave traders (share holders).
These fuks are never in it for the common good.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

rpsmith79 wrote:


By that token, so are pension pots, as the money in everyones private/work pensions will be invested in compaines like this, that were once considered a "safe bet"

So if Thames were to go bust, it could affect a hell of a lot of peoples pensions pots, not just private investors


And it's the job of the pension funds to invest wisely and over a wide portfolio. Once you start state intervention for this reason, where do you stop?

If pension funds are finding themselves overexposed with Thames water shares, it's 100% self inflicted, it's been circling the drain for a while now.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 18:45 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
it's been circling the drain for a while now.


hee hee hee
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 20:12 - 13 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

rpsmith79 wrote:
So if Thames were to go bust, it could affect a hell of a lot of peoples pensions pots, not just private investors


That’s why these bastards will brazenly sit in front of a public inquiry, don’t deny they’re corrupt and/or incompetent but still have the attitude that, “You can’t do anything about it.” Lock ‘em up.

How hard can it be, the stuff literally falls out of the sky and everybody wants it.
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MCN
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PostPosted: 01:50 - 14 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
rpsmith79 wrote:
So if Thames were to go bust, it could affect a hell of a lot of peoples pensions pots, not just private investors


That’s why these bastards will brazenly sit in front of a public inquiry, don’t deny they’re corrupt and/or incompetent but still have the attitude that, “You can’t do anything about it.” Lock ‘em up.

How hard can it be, the stuff literally falls out of the sky and everybody wants it.


Brazenly? As in hold their feet to a fire.

A real fire, not just some figurative cliche type of fire.
I hope there's enough water to dowse flames if it gets out of control.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 10:17 - 14 Dec 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

How do you define success? Money is the only universal and objective metric we have, the Market the largest organic computational system the human race has invented.

But for the system to work you need things like supply and demand and competition. Yes, people need water but that need is mostly dictated by geography. Past a certain point you cannot get more done with a free/limitless/clean supply of water, unlike energy.

Thames Water makes/made money, it's a metric, what was that metric showing us? Only that they were a successful parasite but parasitism only works up to the point the host reacts and kills the parasite.
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