Resend my activation email : Register : Log in 
BCF: Bike Chat Forums


First vaping related death

Reply to topic
Bike Chat Forums Index -> Politics & Current Affairs Goto page Previous  1, 2
View previous topic : View next topic  
Author Message

Easy-X
Super Spammer



Joined: 08 Mar 2019
Karma :

PostPosted: 20:33 - 25 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nicotine is barely addictive in the clinical sense. Not like crack cocaine or heroin. Cigarettes on the other hand are highly addictive as there are a lot more active ingredients.
____________________
Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

RhynoCZ
Super Spammer



Joined: 09 Mar 2012
Karma :

PostPosted: 21:03 - 25 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Haven't we had a long discussion about vaping recently?

My points were: You can't know what's in the fluid and super-heating up stuff and inhaling it (metals, plastics, the fluids = chemical changes) is not cool in any form.

The counter argument from many was, but it's safer than smoking.
____________________
'87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI; MZ 150 ETZ, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Riejufixing
World Chat Champion



Joined: 24 Jun 2018
Karma :

PostPosted: 22:19 - 25 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Easy-X wrote:
Nicotine is barely addictive in the clinical sense. Not like crack cocaine or heroin. Cigarettes on the other hand are highly addictive as there are a lot more active ingredients.

Nicotine isn't physically addictive, if that's what you mean. However, it is very strongly psychologically addictive.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Johnnythefox
Traffic Copper



Joined: 01 Dec 2016
Karma :

PostPosted: 01:30 - 26 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I stopped smoking 40 Benson and Hedges a day in 2013, I vape pretty much all the time but at a pound a bottle per day (poundland) if nothing else it's saving me thousands of pounds a year.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
Karma :

PostPosted: 02:02 - 26 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nicotine is a physically addictive substance.

As in withdrawal causes physical symptoms.

I expect Google will confirm that for anyone who disagrees.

It's in a very different league to smack, alcohol, benzos and other drugs that withdrawal from can result in death but none the less it is still physically addictive.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Easy-X
Super Spammer



Joined: 08 Mar 2019
Karma :

PostPosted: 02:59 - 27 Aug 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, I'll have to disagree with the propaganda.

Still, a few hundred THC vaping lung problems versus the hundreds of thousands of deaths attributed to "traditional" smoking isn't too bad Smile
____________________
Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

duhawkz
World Chat Champion



Joined: 03 Dec 2006
Karma :

PostPosted: 22:29 - 06 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://metro.co.uk/2019/09/06/second-death-us-linked-vaping-health-concerns-grow-e-cigarettes-10699550/

Another death related to vaping, this one mentions that he died after vaping recreational cannabis
____________________
"The guy is a worthless cunt and I honestly believe I would be a slightly happier person if he died." - Chris-Red
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

King29
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Oct 2017
Karma :

PostPosted: 22:52 - 06 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let people do what they want. I say bring back Skoal Bandits, they were proper, not like these namby pamby electro nicotine shite. They looked good plastered on a bike too.

Yeah.

https://i.imgur.com/CePAzjY.jpg
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

MCN
Super Spammer



Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Karma :

PostPosted: 08:21 - 07 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
I'm surprised that anyone is surprised TBH. Anyone who spent a few moments thinking about it would see that all those millions of tiny bottles produced without regulation in China for pennies at a time and sold at huge profit are likely to contain ingredients where cost is given first consideration and health only give as much consideration as necessary to keep them under the safety radar.


Aww shite...

Are Big Ching Chong adulterating the Vap Juice with Melamine now too? Sad
____________________
Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

MCN
Super Spammer



Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Karma :

PostPosted: 08:24 - 07 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

duhawkz wrote:
https://metro.co.uk/2019/09/06/second-death-us-linked-vaping-health-concerns-grow-e-cigarettes-10699550/

Another death related to vaping, this one mentions that he died after vaping recreational cannabis


'Recreational Cannabis'?

What recreation is one fit for after spliffing yer head off?

Very Happy
____________________
Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
Karma :

PostPosted: 08:25 - 07 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Contaminant found in marijuana vaping products linked to deadly lung illnesses, tests show

State and federal health officials investigating mysterious lung illnesses linked to vaping have found the same chemical in samples of marijuana products used by people sickened in different parts of the country and who used different brands of products in recent weeks.

The chemical is an oil derived from vitamin E. Investigators at the U.S. Food and Drug Administration found the oil in cannabis products in samples collected from patients who fell ill across the United States. FDA officials shared that information with state health officials during a telephone briefing this week, according to several officials who took part in the call.

That same chemical was also found in nearly all cannabis samples from patients who fell ill in New York in recent weeks, a state health department spokeswoman said.

Vitamin E is found naturally in certain foods, such as canola oil, olive oil and almonds. The oil derived from the vitamin, known as vitamin E acetate, is commonly available as a nutritional supplement and is used in topical skin treatments. It is not known to cause harm when ingested as a vitamin supplement or applied to the skin. Its name sounds harmless, experts said, but its molecular structure could make it hazardous when inhaled. Its oil-like properties could be associated with the kinds of respiratory symptoms that many patients have reported: cough, shortness of breath and chest pain, officials said.

“We knew from earlier testing by New York that they had found vitamin E acetate, but to have FDA talk about it from their overall testing plan, that was the most remarkable thing that we heard,” said one official who listened to the briefing but was not authorized to speak publicly.

The FDA also told state officials Wednesday that its lab tests found nothing unusual in nicotine products that had been collected from sick patients, according to another person who took part in the call.

The investigation has been particularly challenging for health authorities. “We don’t know what we’re looking for,” an official at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which is leading the investigation, said last week.

Officials are trying to come up with a consistent definition of the illness and a standardized system for collecting information from the states. Unlike certain infectious diseases, such as measles, which are required to be reported to federal authorities, states are not required to report possible cases of vaping-related illnesses to the CDC. And they still don’t know what vaping ingredient or ingredients are causing the lung injuries.

State health departments are reporting new cases weekly. As of Aug. 27, there were 215 possible cases reported by 25 states. Additional reports of lung illnesses are under investigation, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which is leading the investigation.

On Wednesday, Oregon health authorities said a middle-aged adult who died in late July of a severe respiratory illness had used an e-cigarette containing marijuana oil purchased from a legal dispensary. It’s the second death linked to vaping nationwide and the first to be linked to a product bought at a store. Illinois officials reported the first death last week. They did not specify what kind of product was used in that case.

State and federal health authorities have said they are focusing on the role of contaminants or counterfeit substances as a likely cause of vaping-related lung illnesses. Many patients have told officials and clinicians that they bought cannabis products off the street. Many of those who have fallen ill say they have vaped products containing marijuana, but others said they used traditional nicotine e-cigarettes. Many report using both. Authorities said they are not ruling out adulterants in nicotine vaping products.

Although the discovery of a common chemical in lab tests from the FDA and New York’s highly regarded Wadsworth Center lab offers a potential lead, officials cautioned that they are a long way from understanding what exactly is making so many people sick.

An FDA spokesman said the agency is “looking into potential leads regarding any particular constituent or compound that may be at issue.” The FDA is analyzing sample for a broad range of chemicals, including nicotine, THC, other cannabinoids, “cutting agents” that may be used to dilute liquids, other additives, pesticides, opioids, poisons and toxins.

“The number of samples received continues to increase and we now have over 100 samples for testing,” FDA spokesman Michael Felberbaum said Thursday.

Not all the samples are suitable for testing. The FDA analyzed 12 viable nicotine samples and 18 viable THC products, state officials said. Vitamin E acetate was found in 10 of the 18 THC products.

“This was the only thing that seemed to show up in 10 of the 18 cannabis products,” said one state official who took part in the call.

The federal lab results seem to confirm findings from New York State. Late last week, its lab found “very high levels of vitamin E acetate in nearly all” its cannabis samples tested. More than a dozen samples were tested, a health department spokeswoman said Thursday. At least one vape product containing vitamin E acetate has been linked to each patient who submitted a product for testing, the department said.

“Vitamin E acetate is not an approved additive for New York State Medical Marijuana Program-authorized vape samples and was not seen in the nicotine-based products that were tested. As a result, vitamin E acetate is now a key focus” of New York’s investigation, New York State Health Commissioner Howard Zucker said in a statement Thursday.

As of Thursday, New York had received 34 reports from doctors of severe pulmonary illness among patients who ranged in age from 15 to 46 who were using at least one cannabis-containing vape product before becoming sick. All patients reported recent use of various vape products, officials said. Many are suspected to be counterfeits or recreational cannabis-containing vape products available in other states.

The second report of a death has emphasized the danger of this lung disease. “It was surprising that the patient suddenly appeared without any other underlying health conditions and became ill enough to die from this syndrome,” said Ann Thomas, a physician with the Oregon Health Authority.

Vaping refers to the increasingly popular practice of inhaling vapor from an e-cigarette device, which frequently involves heating a liquid that can contain nicotine, marijuana or other drugs.

Vitamin E acetate is basically grease, said Michelle Francl, a chemistry professor at Bryn Mawr College. Its molecular structure means that “you have to heat it up pretty hot” for it to vaporize. Its boiling point is 363 degrees Fahrenheit, which is well above the 212 degrees F boiling point for water, and nearly four times higher than normal human body temperature.

Once the oil is heated hot enough to vaporize, it can potentially decompose, and “now you’re breathing in who-knows-what,” Francl said.

When that vapor cools down in the lungs, it returns to its original state at that temperature and pressure, she said, which means “it has now coated the inside of your lungs with that oil,” she said.

In Utah, clinicians have treated several patients with acute lung injuries who were diagnosed with a rare condition known as lipoid pneumonia, with symptoms including chest pain and difficulty breathing. Those patients had abnormal immune cells filled with lipids, doctors said.

Unlike the human digestive tract, which can break down and get rid of foreign substances, the lungs aren’t designed to handle anything except gases, experts said.

Laura Crotty Alexander, a lung inflammation and e-cigarette researcher at the University of California in San Diego School of Medicine, said it’s not clear whether the chemical itself or its byproducts could be toxic.

“We haven’t looked at the toxicity of vitamin E in the lungs,” she said. “The lungs are designed to exchange gas molecules; they’re not designed to be exposed to other chemicals.”

When the lung cells die, that often provokes an inflammatory response, and “other cells need to come in and clean up the cell debris,” Alexander said. But the lungs are very delicate. When extra cells enter, “they get in the way of gas exchange,” she said. That makes it more difficult for oxygen to get into a person’s bloodstream. The inflammation can cause liquid to accumulate in the lungs, making it difficult for someone to breathe, she said.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2019/09/05/contaminant-found-vaping-products-linked-deadly-lung-illnesses-state-federal-labs-show/
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Easy-X
Super Spammer



Joined: 08 Mar 2019
Karma :

PostPosted: 15:04 - 07 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

The basic PG in ecigs is perfectly safe apparently but I've know people who are allergic to it, inhaled, and had to switch to VG only.

Also, there was a thing I read a few years ago about "popcorn lung" a certain buttery flavouring was perfectly fine to ingest but not to inhale. Granted only ppl in the factories ever got the condition but it caused quite a shit-storm at the time.
____________________
Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
Karma :

PostPosted: 03:55 - 10 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vape related deaths are to do with counterfeits of Dank Vapes

A number of vape-related lung illnesses are linked to 'Dank Vapes,' a mysterious black market brand selling THC products

One of the most popular illegal vape brands is the elusive "Dank Vapes"
People who sell Dank Vape brand devices on the black market hawk them as premium marijuana consumption devices, but the person who is running the business is a mystery, according to Inverse.

Dank Vapes continues to grow because it offers an accessible marijuana option in states where the drug is still illegal, plus a more inexpensive option in states where legal cannabis is available.

The business is popular enough that others have started copying it with their own "Dank Vapes," making the name itself even more mysterious and difficult to track.

"These are just people filling cartridges as 'Dank Vapes.' It's not a singular facility. It's just people in their garages filling them and selling them," Mark Hoashi, the founder an app that rates and reviews cannabis products, told Inverse.

Vitamin E acetate could be an illness-causing culprit
The illicit and nature of Dank Vapes and other popular THC vape brands has made it far impossible for authorities to determine a common illness-causing ingredient, but some experts believe Vitamin E could be to blame.

"We are leaving no stone unturned in following any potential leads, including Vitamin E acetate found in many of the samples containing THC, and we're committed to taking appropriate actions as the facts emerge," FDA Commissioner Dr. Ned Sharpless said in a tweet.

Vitamin E acetate is an ingredient naturally found in vegetable oil, and vegetable-based oils are often used as solvents to turn drugs like THC and nicotine into vapors so users can inhale them. Ideally, all of the ingredients should be vaporized before the user inhales, but in reality, some of the ingredients may instead end up in a user's lungs.

As a result, the liquid sits in the lungs and can cause pneumonia, one type of vape-related lung illness officials across the United States have reported.

Until more information about the cause of the illnesses is revealed, Sharpless said people should stop using illegally-purchased vape products, modifying legally purchased products, and using THC oil at all.

Sauce: https://www.insider.com/vape-illness-linked-to-dank-vapes-thc-vape-brand-2019-9

----------

And now for some indepth geeky stuff...

"Why are there vendors selling carts for 12 bucks each and shipping one at a time? So they can make a dollar for each felony they commit? No, far from it. Lets review how much it costs to make and distribute a real and a fake cartridge.

Distillate - The key part of any cartridge is distillate. Distillate is judged in a few different ways. You can go view videos on how distillate is made on youtube but for the purposes of securing distillate, people like to buy lighter distillate because it looks better in a cart, and it generally has (much) less pesticides in it because it has been run more, it can also lower thc distilate levels.

When the cart game first started, and still for the original brands, the cartridge is cut 10-30% with distillated MCT oil which removes the crystalization and allows a smokable cart. This made the cost of the cart go down and lighten the color which allowed you to use a little bit darker darker distillate, it also made the bubble move faster. So a fast bubble has historically been a sign of a low quality cart.

Then came honeycut (Vitamin E). I remember when it landed, it wasnt called honeycut, it was just some cutting agent from China and it didnt let the bubble move. We were fucking scared on my end, not just me but, Mario, Exotics, TKO, and Dank Vapes. We all talked and decided not to use it. We didnt care there was a new cutting agent, but because what the fuck is it that people are gonna be smoking, some chinese liquid. Some mystery product that can allow people to undercut and look like they werent cutting at all.

This was gonna hurt all of us because fakers now can create a cart that looks fucking perfect, BUT, its heavily cut. We all independently decided that we would just stay away from it and it slowly became the trap industry standard. It didnt make sense for a real brand to carry it because it cost more than distillated MCT oil and since they are barely cutting if cutting at all, it didnt matter to production. Even worse, in the distillate world the distillate middle men are now cutting the disti with honeycut so now without even knowing about it these little shitty fake cart companies are already buying honeycut product, then honeycutting it further. Basically the only people who arent gonna get fucked by this are the big boys who buy straight from the labs and they have a long term trusted relationship with said labs.

We then saw sales dwindle a bit, across all companies and my own. Honeycut with the varacity of fakes had totally taken over. People wanted low prices and they fuckin got em by buying fakes.

Hardware - Real branded CCells can only be bought from 1 to maybe 2 companies in the United States, last I checked those were the only distributors here. CCELL is based out of China and they make a damn good cartridge and the built amazing technology. Now, its expensive to make those carts, so fake cart makers do what any fake cart maker would do and thats make it a cheaper and often faulty version of it. They basically want to finesse. All counterfeiters are in the business of finessing. Sell it cheaper at a lower cost. With anything in life you get what you pay for and thats why there are so much fucking heavy metals (which you obviously shouldnt be inhaling) in the fake carts as well. The price difference as you will see, is staggering.

Now we see that fake cart dealers are killing people, and thats what the fuck you get when you buy a fake cart. Its very difficult to get real carts and most people dont have the connection, so they buy terps, honeycut, fake ccells (which leak heavy metals), and cheap disti (more pesticides). Lets go over the costs of a real cart.

These prices are when buying 50k-100k worth of cart materials at a time

Real CCell Cartridge - 2.00 (now 2.25 cause of chinese tarrifs) CCell Mouthpiece - 0.35c including tarrifs i think Distillate - 5.25/g Packaging -.25 - .50/c for dank vapes style package Labor 1.00/cart to include packaging, mixing, filling carts, etc

So far, we are at about 9 dollars a cart, when you start getting to dank vapes levels and size you can knock maybe, mayyyyyyyyyyybe like 1-2 dollars but they order by the millions.

So now, for creating the infrastructure these entrepreneurs need to make a profit and to get the product in the consumers hand they need to go through local socal wholesalers, then reach the distributors who then eventually sell to the guys who get the product to your home town, then the street level dealers. Everyone has to make their cut for it to be worth them getting to you. This is the economics of cartridge manufacturing.

Now you tell me, with these prices, how does anyone sell a cart for 12 bucks? Simple, heres the economics of a honeycut cart:

Fake CCell Cartridge - 0.60 (now 0.75 cause of chinese tarrifs) Fake CCell Mouthpiece - 0.15c including tarrifs i think Distillate - 2.00g (because of buying shittier distillate and honeycutting it 40%) Packaging -.25 - .50/c for dank vapes style package Labor 1.00/cart to include packaging, mixing, filling carts, etc

Fake carts cost around 4 bucks to produce. So the guys selling fakes on are making 3-4x by selling em there, margins I have never seen in my time of vending carts and im a fucking OG in the game. I also have a moral compass and am not gonna finesse my friends to make a buck, which many of you cocksuckers are like friends to me now and I talk to multiple times a day.

Sauce: it's for real yo

tl;dr don't go buying vape cartridges
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Easy-X
Super Spammer



Joined: 08 Mar 2019
Karma :

PostPosted: 10:32 - 10 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow... can't say I understood half of that but I can see it goes way beyond "normal" vaping.

FFS is there nothing 'muricans won't fuck up to make money?! Evil or Very Mad
____________________
Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

bhinso
World Chat Champion



Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Karma :

PostPosted: 16:09 - 12 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ste, I think Tef would be proud of those last two posts.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

The Artist
Super Spammer



Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Karma :

PostPosted: 17:29 - 12 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big Clive has done a good summary video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SX9yYVscEo&t=0s
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
Karma :

PostPosted: 17:49 - 12 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big Clive doesn't know about Dank Vapes. Razz
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Pjay
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Jan 2016
Karma :

PostPosted: 18:14 - 12 Sep 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is just natural selection finding a way.
It doesn't affect normal vapers.
____________________
struan80 - I'll go first - satisfied tick 1
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts
Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 4 years, 199 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
  Display posts from previous:   
This page may contain affiliate links, which means we may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. By clicking on an affiliate link, you accept that third-party cookies will be set.

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bike Chat Forums Index -> Politics & Current Affairs All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

Read the Terms of Use! - Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
 

Debug Mode: ON - Server: birks (www) - Page Generation Time: 0.14 Sec - Server Load: 0.22 - MySQL Queries: 17 - Page Size: 117.43 Kb