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Aprilia RS50 2004 Oil in Coolant and White smoke

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MarJay
But it's British!



Joined: 15 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: 16:01 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Tankie wrote:

It's two stroke oil +coolant , the only place these two fluids can crossover is the cyl head gasket or cylinder head ,read the OP's original thread ,over heated, white smoke, oil in coolant.


So, how much oil is being circulated round in the head of a 2 stroke?


How much is circulated and unburned, and doesn't end up as coke on the head? Even ignoring that it's the square root of jack.
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Nobby the Bastard
Harley Gaydar



Joined: 16 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 16:03 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
MarJay wrote:
Nobby the Bastard wrote:

So, how much oil is being circulated round in the head of a 2 stroke?


How much is circulated and unburned, and doesn't end up as coke on the head? Even ignoring that it's the square root of jack.


I think he thinks that 2 stroke oil is held in chambers in the cylinger and head like 4 stoke oil. I don't think he relaises that 2Ts don't do that as they have no valve grear to lubricate in the head....
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MarJay
But it's British!



Joined: 15 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: 16:07 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobby the Bastard wrote:

I think he thinks that 2 stroke oil is held in chambers in the cylinger and head like 4 stoke oil. I don't think he relaises that 2Ts don't do that as they have no valve grear to lubricate in the head....


Perhaps... or maybe he thinks the cylinder completely fills with 2T oil? Not sure.
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Tankie
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Joined: 24 Feb 2017
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PostPosted: 16:54 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobby the Bastard wrote:
Tankie wrote:

It's two stroke oil +coolant , the only place these two fluids can crossover is the cyl head gasket or cylinder head ,read the OP's original thread ,over heated, white smoke, oil in coolant.


So, how much oil is being circulated round in the head of a 2 stroke?

The output of the oil pump, it can't go anywhere else.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:13 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tankie wrote:
Nobby the Bastard wrote:


So, how much oil is being circulated round in the head of a 2 stroke?

The output of the oil pump, it can't go anywhere else.


It goes into the carb or equivalent as a small fraction of the resulting fuel mix, get sucked into the crank area to lubricate the crank bearings, the big and small ends and the barrel.

Anything left gets forced into the cylinder barrel where it is burned with the fuel mixture.

How does it then get into the coolant?
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Tankie
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PostPosted: 17:23 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Not all is burnt, if the cylinder head joint is leaking the oil can pass into the coolant and also vice versa.
If you put your finger into the tail pipe of a two stroke you will find an oily residue, so some does in fact pass right through the engine to atmosphere.
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MarJay
But it's British!



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PostPosted: 17:24 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tankie wrote:

The output of the oil pump, it can't go anywhere else.


The oil pump outputs to the carb and sometimes on some two strokes to the bottom end on bikes that have a crankcase induction.

Your statement is like saying the internet goes to your house. Yes it goes to your house, but then it goes to your router, and is sent out around the house over wires or wifi and is consumed by devices.

You know that the oil and fuel system are pretty much one and the same on a two stroke right? That the oil is burned along with the fuel and is put into the engine effectively where the fuel goes in. It's not circulated around the outside of the engine, it remains in the cylinder and underneath the piston in the bottom end as a very fine mist. The bottom end compresses the fuel/oil/air mixture and pumps it through the transfer port into the inlet where it gets burned. There's nothing left to leak into the coolant!!

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Easy-X
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Joined: 08 Mar 2019
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PostPosted: 17:32 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Something very soothing about that GIF Smile
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Tankie
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Joined: 24 Feb 2017
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PostPosted: 17:49 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Why is it producing white smoke then?
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Nobby the Bastard
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Joined: 16 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 18:03 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tankie wrote:
Why is it producing white smoke then?


Because a crank seal has gone and its burning gearbox oil.
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Tankie
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PostPosted: 18:11 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
And the oil in the water? there is no positive pressure in the gearbox, if there was water in the gearbox as well, I would be heading that way
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 18:12 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tankie wrote:
And the oil in the water? there is no positive pressure in the gearbox, if there was water in the gearbox as well, I would be heading that way


Probably either a residue from manufacture or some Fuckwit thought oil goes in the coolant cap.

The gearbox wouldn't get pressurised as its the bang that would pressurise the coolant system, and the crank seals are protected from that.
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Last edited by Nobby the Bastard on 18:15 - 15 Oct 2019; edited 1 time in total
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dynax
Trackday Trickster



Joined: 06 May 2019
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PostPosted: 18:13 - 15 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Easy-X wrote:
Something very soothing about that GIF Smile


You're not wrong Laughing
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DUCAUDI
World Chat Champion



Joined: 17 May 2019
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PostPosted: 00:34 - 16 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
Easy-X wrote:
Hmmm.... Italian bike, white smoke Thinking

Election of a new Pope?


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sajidnazeem
L Plate Warrior



Joined: 13 Oct 2019
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PostPosted: 19:14 - 21 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
It was another O ring that had burst. Suggesting that the head was warped. I changed the head but not at idle a grey ish smoke is coming. Maybe the oil is too rich?
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GSTEEL32
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Joined: 24 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: 16:11 - 22 Oct 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote
You should be using a head gasket as its water cooled & Italian,

Its cheap as chips to replace.

You'll need to get the machine up to temp and give it a run. The blue smoke on a machine that's not run for a while could come from anywhere, including the expansion pipe in the exhaust (if its been sat and has been previously run rich)....

Are you using the oil pump, or premixing ? has the white smoke now stopped ?
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mattsprattuk
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PostPosted: 08:25 - 21 Jan 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote
I want to see Marjay arguing some more... I wish he knew as much as he thought he did, then it wouldn't be so painful. Laughing
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Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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