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Changing your biking habits cos of climate change

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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 10:59 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
If everyone could save 5000 commuting miles a year from cutting out commuting or smarter working habits etc, then shouldn't they all be allowed to have a de-catted TVR V8 for driving to car shows, or doing half a dozen track days a year instead? Isn't this what carbon offsetting and planting trees is all about?


Sorry, it's hair shirts for all. The carbon offsets are there for the rich and powerful who's lifestyles will remain unchanged.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 11:00 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just read this..............

2019 set to be one of the hottest years on record – UN experts

https://home.bt.com/news/latest-news/2019-set-to-be-one-of-the-hottest-years-on-record-un-experts-11364415509750

I'll be changing my habits and getting out more on the bike if that happens. Dance!
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 11:38 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
Just read this..............

2019 set to be one of the hottest years on record – UN experts

https://home.bt.com/news/latest-news/2019-set-to-be-one-of-the-hottest-years-on-record-un-experts-11364415509750

I'll be changing my habits and getting out more on the bike if that happens. Dance!


Ummm, that's this year, all but gone, not a prediction for next year.
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 11:57 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
in 8 years they went from the first man in space to walking on the moon.

In 160 years they have gone from the lead acid battery to the umm Thinking fancier lead acid batteries with a lithium battery off shoot. Despite people like phone and electric car manufacturers spending small fortunes on battery technology.

I won't hold my breath for new battery technology.
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It's repeated all the time; 'we went from the brown-bess muzzle loading musket, to the machine gun, within a century', or 'we went from the steam engine to the space shuttle in 250 years'... So EXTRAPOLATE the rate of technological 'progress'... and imagine where we'll be in ten years time!

It doesn't work.

Scientific Knowledge doesn't increase at an predictable rate... end of. It happens in random events.. AND THEN, 'some-one' has to find a use for it, then necessity is the mother of invention to make something 'useful' out of it.

Battery Technology? Two Hundred Years ... to get to where we are at now... with things that are still not a lot more advanced than a Lemon-Cell!?

Galvani, 'invented' his 'battery' from the 'need' to have a store of electricity to tickle dead toads with, in his anatomical experiments.... B-U-T he wasn't working blind; what he did was to get the ball rolling for a scientific explanation of electro-potential... the Galvanic-Cell, or Lemon-Battery, was nothing 'new'.

Archaeological evidence supports suggestion that it was probably 'known' if not understood around 3ooo years ago by ancient, Greek and Egyptian 'physicians', and used in medical treatments.

It's more than likely that some-one gave themselves an electric shock, holding a zinc rich bronze beaker, full of vinegar, stirring the concoction with a burned twig.... or as likely more than one some-one, and more than once!

You can almost see them, in the kitchen, "WHAT?!? That hurt! Quick, grab another amphora... lets see if it does it again!... Oooooh! It DID... lets try it with some of that Beer we brewed for your mother-in-law!" Because human nature don't change much!

And there in lies.... along withe the inextricable link between technological progress.... and BEER!

Small aside, we know from manuscripts/tablets, that the ancient used electro-therapy before Roman times; though more commonly they used fish like the Sting-Ray...

Modern Medical science... such a rapid rate of progress since Galvani's day and the leaches, and toads... all the way forwards to... err something that the Romans did, having probably got it from the Greeks who likely got it from the Egyptians!!!

Which shows just one of the dangers in this sort of extrapolation; taking arbitrary and peculiarly 'modern' base lines for the presumed start point... conveniently ignoring all of the prior knowledge that likely existed, if not so well explained, and the leaps and bounds of 'fashion' or adoption in between... like 500 years of the Catholic church having an embargo on human dissection, carried over from 500 years of it being banned by the Roman senate! So even when the time-line isn't perverted by random discoveries not being understood, or having obvious application, social factors and hey..... POLITICS... will tend to suppress or expedite the progress, so that any 'graph' is so bumpy, you could draw a line through the dots and draw anything you like.... a hill, a cliff, or a smiley face Smile

Extrapolation of Technological progress DOES NOT work! There are just too many variables, and far too much that is... oooh.... pun... environmentally sensitive!
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 12:11 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
JackButler wrote:
Can any of the snowflake's & SJW's please tell me how a capitalist system that thrives on consumerism can ever possibly become environmentally friendly?


In the same way that a capitalist system that thrives on consumerism can provide healthcare free at the point of use?


Care to explain your counter-argument in more detail? Healthcare hasn't done anything to reduce consumerism. If anything, it's probably added to the problem.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 12:36 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Polarbear wrote:
Just read this..............

2019 set to be one of the hottest years on record – UN experts

https://home.bt.com/news/latest-news/2019-set-to-be-one-of-the-hottest-years-on-record-un-experts-11364415509750

I'll be changing my habits and getting out more on the bike if that happens. Dance!


Ummm, that's this year, all but gone, not a prediction for next year.


FFS I'm a stupid cnut. Brick Wall
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 12:42 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:


FFS I'm a stupid cnut. Brick Wall


No you're not. Just a senior moment, forgivable Smile
I sometimes have moments of clarity. They're very rare, but... Laughing
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 14:47 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:


Care to explain your counter-argument in more detail? Healthcare hasn't done anything to reduce consumerism. If anything, it's probably added to the problem.


In the US where governmental oversight is generally frowned upon, the free market has traditionally run rampant and they have nothing in their government or institutions that really qualifies as 'socialised medicine' they have a problem with access to healthcare. They have a few programmes, but they are generally a sticking plaster to help a huge gaping wound and then some.

In the UK we have socialised healthcare, where everybodies needs are met. How did this happen? Did we just arrive at this one day? No, we have a free market capitalist society with some socialised elements. The primary example being healthcare.

So why is the same not true for the environment? Someone back just after the war took a hard decision to bring all healthcare under the remit of the government, and fund it using tax income. Someone in a current government could do something similar with the environment. They could retain our current free market capitalist economy, but institute policy and legislation that would regulate the areas of that economy that produce CO2. It's all about a free market capitalist economy with some regulation for the benefit of all. This is not communism, this is regulated capitalism.

It works for the NHS, why can't it work for the environment too? I suppose what I'm saying is that if there really is a climate crisis (learned people seem to agree there is) then why can't government start to take drastic action to address it? Some steps have been taken, but it's arguably not quite enough yet.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 14:55 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty obvious, I'd have thought. The NHS is a national institution, much easier for a government to manipulate. Environment is a global concern, as is modern globalist capitalism. A national government deciding to do something will have little effect overall, especially of such a small and insignificant nation such as ours, not respected by its own citizens, never mind the rest of the world.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 15:16 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
JackButler wrote:
Can any of the snowflake's & SJW's please tell me how a capitalist system that thrives on consumerism can ever possibly become environmentally friendly?


In the same way that a capitalist system that thrives on consumerism can provide healthcare free at the point of use?


One of the theories I like reckoned that the NHS effectively came about after WWI - the thinking went something like this; during 1916, when conscription began (courtesy of the Military Service Act of the same year), the authorities quite promptly became appalled at the quality of the "material" that greeted them at barracks etc. The men were under weight, had suffered from rickets, TB, and god knows what else. There were serious concerns we were fucked and too weak as a nation to actually fight a war never mind win it.

In short it was that kind of thinking that led to proposals such as the NHS being taken seriously. Otherwise, there's a fair-to-good chance they may have been quickly binned as too expensive, etc. etc.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 15:33 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Pretty obvious, I'd have thought. The NHS is a national institution, much easier for a government to manipulate. Environment is a global concern, as is modern globalist capitalism. A national government deciding to do something will have little effect overall, especially of such a small and insignificant nation such as ours, not respected by its own citizens, never mind the rest of the world.


But my point is that it's an example of how we can do it without convincing every individual, nor making a global socialist autocracy.
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JackButler
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PostPosted: 16:16 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:

But my point is that it's an example of how we can do it without convincing every individual, nor making a global socialist autocracy.


Your point doesn't seem to include the possibility that capitalism largely controls politics & therefore most political policies seem focused on keeping capitalism happy.

It would indeed be a solution if gov'mnts got their acts together & made a few simple rules for commerce to follow . . . Instead, everyone seems to be blaming everyone else.

It's not the consumers fault that their mince pies come complete with 3 different materials making up the packaging, 2 of which are non-recyclable . . . . So why are we asking them (in vain) to please think about the environment when selecting their mince pies?
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 16:31 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

JackButler wrote:
Your point doesn't seem to include the possibility that capitalism largely controls politics & therefore most political policies seem focused on keeping capitalism happy.


You mean like the NHS keeps capitalism happy?
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 16:42 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, it doesn't, because it won't, can't pay the asking price for many new drugs and treatments. But the drug companies seem ok with that, presumably because they still make huge profits elsewhere, and I assume that's through private health care for those that can afford it. They don't operate out of the goodness of their hearts, although maybe some of their employees do. Sad for them really, being exploited like that.
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Last edited by chickenstrip on 16:46 - 03 Dec 2019; edited 1 time in total
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JackButler
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PostPosted: 16:46 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
JackButler wrote:
Your point doesn't seem to include the possibility that capitalism largely controls politics & therefore most political policies seem focused on keeping capitalism happy.


You mean like the NHS keeps capitalism happy?


It does when we break off small chunks of it & let the private sector run it.

Do you actually understand & have the ability to comprehend exactly what is happening in the NHS??? Have you sat down & chatted with people who work in it, or have you formed your opinion from your MSM of choice?

Tell me this, if there's a shortage of nurses then where have all the nurses gone?


That's before we even get started on PFI.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 16:53 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel we're drifting off topic into the very realms I ranted about at the top of the previous page Laughing
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 18:43 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

JackButler wrote:


It does when we break off small chunks of it & let the private sector run it.

Do you actually understand & have the ability to comprehend exactly what is happening in the NHS??? Have you sat down & chatted with people who work in it, or have you formed your opinion from your MSM of choice?

Tell me this, if there's a shortage of nurses then where have all the nurses gone?




This is not happening, at least not in the way you're painting it. It may happen if we get into trade talks with the US but as I've already been warned for mentioning the B word here, I'll stop now.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 19:17 - 03 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
as I've already been warned for mentioning the B word here, I'll stop now.


I'll just start calling you names if you carry on Laughing
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JackButler
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PostPosted: 03:00 - 04 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:


This is not happening, at least not in the way you're painting it. It may happen if we get into trade talks with the US but as I've already been warned for mentioning the B word here, I'll stop now.


Who are you trying to kid that this is not happening??? Yourself or the whole of the internets???

If parts of the NHS are so badly run that we need to break chunks off & have the private sector run them, then all we are doing is chucking taxpayer £money at the private sector.

Where have all the nurses gone?
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 08:57 - 04 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

JackButler wrote:
Where have all the nurses gone?


Well they haven't been sold into slavery mate. You have to bear in mind that it's not just a pool of NHS nurses who are always NHS nurses and then remain so. I assume through normal attrition they've left and found other careers, had kids, died, retired etc. The usual reasons people leave jobs. The issue would be that the money within the NHS budget has not been there to recruit more, or perhaps people don't want to be nurses these days.

The point is that this has nothing to do with the private sector. Public private partnerships are simply methods of contracting out some services to private industry where that is seen as efficient. It's probably not that efficient in every case, but it doesn't amount to the 'selling of the NHS' that it's painted as. The public private partnerships were actually implemented by the Labour party under Tony Blair.

There isn't a shadowy conspiracy in the UK to privatise the NHS. There might well be in the US and they do have a LOT of leverage over us if we leave the EU, but as mentioned that's a taboo subject in a thread about climate change.
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DJP
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PostPosted: 10:56 - 04 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Undinist wrote:
The answer was published in January this year. In the 15th century about 56 million North American natives died, mostly because of diseases imported by Europeans. The dead natives' farmland, which was about the size of France, reverted to forest.


So the solution then is to kill tens of millions of third worlders?

Probably not very PC though.

Although there is only one answer to environmental issues: Less people.

Now, who fancies going first?
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 10:59 - 04 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

DJP wrote:
So the solution then is to kill tens of millions of third worlders?

Probably not very PC though.

Although there is only one answer to environmental issues: Less people.

Now, who fancies going first?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8zhNb8ANe8
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 11:19 - 04 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a frightening thing that possibly the only way the human race will survive is to cull vast quantities of itself.

there again, what's the difference between doing it to animal populations that have out grown their habitat, we are animals as well and have certainly outgrown this planet so why should we be exempt.

I can certainly see the 'Soylant Green' scenario of voluntary euthanasia coming into being in the future. Maybe not the chomping on the bodies part though Laughing
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 11:26 - 04 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another thought! - If the survival of the human race was dependant on moving to a distant star, do you think they would insist on LGBTWXYZ being part of the rockets crew. It's not like they would procreate to keep the species alive or would BAME over rule logic.

If you insisted on ugly women going (fairs fair, they can't all be Heidi Klum) would you have to send with them a good supply of 'beer goggles' to ensure mating?

I could go on Laughing
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Ste
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PostPosted: 11:26 - 04 Dec 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

DJP wrote:
So the solution then is to kill tens of millions of third worlders?

It could almost be called a final solution. Shocked
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